TWR To Buy Prost ?

[rdjones]

There is something very strange about this story somehow I think we will be talking about for sometime to come ! ! !

[Super Tourer]

Good point VB - to elaborate on that further the deal that Prost had with Ferrari also included the rear end of the car and gearbox - so the chassis would have to be designed around those Ferrari components. This is one of the reasons why Sauber as so quick - nearly 50% of the 'major' components on the car are designed and built by Ferrari. This also highlight's how useless Prost were...how they managed to turn that foundation into the effort they produced last year is beyond me.

As you say VB - its not going to be as simple as just bolting another engine on the back and off you go....

They may not want to run the car but under the FIA rules they may have to run some sort of effort to maintian their automatic entry. Whether Bernie will want an old shed tooling around at the back, spoiling his glitzy show is another matter....

[Maxmil]

Originally posted by nicholaswhite


I don't think that's true- if they turn up this year they'll just have to pay massive fines, that's all. And anyway, if it's illegal, why was he trying to get the assets?

I suppose it's fair enough that he's complain because it means he loses the 10th team travel benefits. If "Prost" did turn up this year I don't think they should keep their benefits from last year (just to please Minardi )

BTW, are the car numbers leaving a gap for Prost (ie Minardi gets 22 and 23)?

The usual fine is US$500,000 per car per race which is not so bad, but I don't know if that applies if the team is "insolvent". Stoddarts's lawyers evidently think that fines do not apply and that the Court did something illegal by selling the assets so cheap. Even if "Team Prost" does not survive, the assets were probably underpriced.

I too have been wondering why the numbers wern't assigned to Minardi. I have also been wondering if the "Team Prost" buyer would get the Ferrari engines, but Todt has stated publically that they will not.

This is a real good soap opera.

[alesi95]

You have to remember TWR aren't the buyers so although they might run any engineering side of the team they probably wont have to pay for it.

Also TWR are probably in it for the Tv money Prost earned from their 4points and although TWR wont get that money neither will Mr Stoddart. Thus no advantage gained.

Although I doubt we'll see Prost the team ever again unless theres manufacturer involvement.

[ghinzani]

Originally posted by Super Tourer
Looks like a lot of expense to get nowhere....maybe they do have to race to keep the entry, therefore going the route as described.

I agree with those that reckon the 107% rule would be their biggest challenge. An old dog like the Prost chassis powered by an even older cosworth tugger - doesn't sound a recipe for success.....

I thought that engine was the old Hart v8 that Walkinshaws team used for a couple of seasons? 98-99 perhaps? didnt it then go into the Arrows 2 seater? was Stoddart involved somehwere with building Arrows 2 seater b4 he bought Minardi?

[EERO]

ghinzani , you're close to correct, it was a Hart V10. But it last ran in '99, and was underpowered then, the 107% rule iIS the bigest challenge. BTW if the rumour is true about Mazzacne, we need to take up a collection to make him go away for good.

[EERO]

As for the Skoda reference, I've not found it anywhere else, but buying the Prost assets on the cheap would be one way for the VW group to get a spot on the Concorde. Enge is the Skoda connection and VW runs the team for a season or two as Prost prior to a full-fledged campaign as Bugatti or Audi.

Discuss.

[Dickie Thrust]

If TW is right and the team appears in Malaysia or Brazil and none of the Prost staff come with the deal, where do you get and F1 teams worth of engineeers and mechanics from in a few weeks? To run a competitive F1 team now it costs £1m a week. Where's that kind of money going to come from?

It can only be that TWR will run it and TW is using someone elses money to fund it. They could use the old Hart V10 (which they have been developing since 1999 at TWR) to get them out and I think this could deal have been brewing for some time. The back end of a 1999/2000 Arrows/Hart could be grafted onto a Prost tub and away you go.

[ghinzani]

reckon Jos will end up there? back to the old days I reckon

[Mania]

I dont see the point here. If a top manufacturer was buying the team then I wouldnt have a problem with it but knowing the slime that Walkinshaw is - who says he wont sell the outfit by the end of the season, after collecting the tv money etc.

That would cause a lot of folks to lose their jobs all over again - and let us not forget that the pace of these cars is likely to be slower than Minardi which would just be an embarassment to the grid and will not provide any real racing entertainment for the fans.

I just dont see Walkinshaw doing anything substantial with the team - other than to screw it over all over again...

[ghinzani]

Its just a vehicle to sell to Red Bull for their American F1 team - lets hope they pick some decent American talent to drive the cars.........

[steve nielsen]

The Prost cars where not fast enough with Ferrari power, and now they want an underpowered Arrows engine in it??

either TWR has done great things with that engine or the car is'nt going to qualify a single race.

and Jos certainly would'nt drive for that team if Tom Walkinshaw has something to do with it, he already said he never wants to drive for him ever again.

Some reports say Enge and Mazzacane would be the drivers.

[Stephen Green]

A couple of teenie weenie comments here.

1. Aren't the old Arrows engines in fact Harts?
2. TW says at every opportunity that HE has not bought the team. It is a consortium and he (TWR) have offered technical support.

You should remember that TWR support other F1 teams with technical equipment as I understand it.

[ghinzani]

Yeah we established the Hart fact... I think they should ring up Brian and get a couple of 415T's and take the turbos off and weld em together! Maybe they can get a Toleman tg181b to run it in!

[Stephen Green]

I reckon the Skoda idea is closer to the mark than many of us think. VW would do well to market the brand and if they picked up an F1 team for peanuts then what's the loss to them? The value of the team if another manufacturer comes in will pay a handsome dividend?

[Stephen Green]

The team will almost certainly be run out of Leafield at very little extra cost to the Arrows team

[paulzinho]

This sounds very interesting. I expect a couple of drivers with HUGE wallets will be driving if they do in fact make the grid. I suppose its a case of watch this space but it seems that we might just see 24 cars this year.

[Mark F1]

It says on AUTOSPORT.COM that they will not be able to run under the Prost Grand Prix banner, so will they be named Phoenix ? (After the group who bought the assets).

[Stephen Green]

It would be interesting to know just how much influence or input a certain B Ecclestone had in this matter!

[BootsOntheSide]

Is this the same Pheonix that Max Wilson's CART engines (2000 Mercedes0 were branded as at the start of last year? EIther way this whole thing is really interesting. I'm amused by the criticism Tom is getting, he just seems like Alain to not really be cut out for F1 management, Arrows ahve plodded around haplessly for years, and his driver management has been laughable. But is this actually a legally enterable entity for 2002?

[Total-F1]

The Phoenix is the bird that rose out of the ashes.

This sounds like some dodgy company that was set up for the sole purpose of making millions and millions out of a grid slot.

Ferrari and several other companies would most likely have had deals with an Alain Prost company that was 'managing' the Prost F1 team, which Alain would have used as leverage to keep himself in the team.

[Nicholas]

The '99 Arrows engines were underpowered even then.

[The Accomplice]

Is this the same Phoenix that bought Rover?

[Super Tourer]

I think that indoubtedly the 'public'face of the deal is a front for something much bigger. VW/Audi have been mentioned on and off as interested in looking at F1 and maybe this is a fairly cheap and more importantly anonymous way of taking a 'hands on' look.

A finance company buying an F1 teams doesn't fit, as every man and his dog know's that manufacturer support is essential for success in F1.

Whoever is behind it has played it very cleverly, they have sat on the sidelines throughout the Prost receivership waiting for the price to come down. The assets of the team were literally just about to be auctioned off and they suddenly come in and buy the team for peanuts...very well judged - it took someone with alot of knowledge of both Prost's exact siutation and F1 in general to pull this deal off.

Malaysia or most likely Brazil will reveal a bit more about the team.......

[EERO]

Originally posted by Super Tourer
I think that indoubtedly the 'public'face of the deal is a front for something much bigger. VW/Audi have been mentioned on and off as interested in looking at F1 and maybe this is a fairly cheap and more importantly anonymous way of taking a 'hands on' look.

That's what I said....

The Skoda reference hasn't been substantiated but it would tie the whole thing to Enge.