How much faster could GTE be?

[NaBUru38]

The #91 Porsche did 3'47 at Le Mans and 2'13 at Spa-Francorchamps. That's pretty fast already.

[MaskedRacer]

Originally Posted by NaBUru38

The #91 Porsche did 3'47 at Le Mans and 2'13 at Spa-Francorchamps. That's pretty fast already.

If you had the aero advancements of the GTE cars today, along with today's tires, plus the horsepower GT1 cars had in the 2000's (Corvette C6R, Aston Martin DBR9, Saleen SR7). I bet it could break 3 min 40 at Le Mans you think?

[canaglia]

Originally Posted by MaskedRacer

If you had the aero advancements of the GTE cars today, along with today's tires, plus the horsepower GT1 cars had in the 2000's (Corvette C6R, Aston Martin DBR9, Saleen SR7). I bet it could break 3 min 40 at Le Mans you think?

well... ok, guess it's however quite pointless... it's basically like to say: how fast could be group C cars with nowadays work lmp1 aero and confidential tires ?

anyway agree; unrestricted ford gt is the ultimate performances benchmark

[tjh8402]

Originally Posted by canaglia

well... ok, guess it's however quite pointless... it's basically like to say: how fast could be group C cars with nowadays work lmp1 aero and confidential tires ?

anyway agree; unrestricted ford gt is the ultimate performances benchmark

I should probably add an asterisk To my thoughts on the Fords dominance, Which is that if the class went on restricted, ford wouldn’t dominate for long. I think one reason Ford was comfortable using the V-6 is because they knew the car would “only“ be making around 500 horse power in race trim. The car was designed to be as fast as it could with that sort of power. They knew the V-6 could handle it and the engine’s compact design gave an aero advantage.

Take away the power restrictions and that V6 won’t cut it anymore. I imagine Ferrari would either boost the 488 way up (it’s already more powerful on the road than the Ford) or switch to the V12 812. Porsche would switch to the turbo engine from the 911 GT 2 RS, Chevrolet would probably tush turbo an LS7 or a 6.2, Aston Martin with switch to the DB 11 Turbo V 12...no manufacturer would sit idly by With a car that was designed and optimize around a different level of power and performance. There would be a mad expensive rush to redesign or introduce new cars tailored to the unrestricted rules. Like I said in my first comment, it would be like GT1 in the late 1990s.

[joeb]

Originally Posted by tjh8402

I should probably add an asterisk To my thoughts on the Fords dominance, Which is that if the class went on restricted, ford wouldn’t dominate for long. I think one reason Ford was comfortable using the V-6 is because they knew the car would “only“ be making around 500 horse power in race trim. The car was designed to be as fast as it could with that sort of power. They knew the V-6 could handle it and the engine’s compact design gave an aero advantage.

Take away the power restrictions and that V6 won’t cut it anymore. I imagine Ferrari would either boost the 488 way up (it’s already more powerful on the road than the Ford) or switch to the V12 812. Porsche would switch to the turbo engine from the 911 GT 2 RS, Chevrolet would probably tush turbo an LS7 or a 6.2, Aston Martin with switch to the DB 11 Turbo V 12...no manufacturer would sit idly by With a car that was designed and optimize around a different level of power and performance. There would be a mad expensive rush to redesign or introduce new cars tailored to the unrestricted rules. Like I said in my first comment, it would be like GT1 in the late 1990s.

Awesome?

[carbsmith]

No actually half of those things would never happen because the rules are still 5500cc normally aspirated and 4000cc turbocharged.

The Ford and the Ferrari could be a lot faster. The Ford doesn't even really need to be unrestricted to, I don't think they've ever taken all the sandbags out. Plus that engine actually already ran at ~600hp in the Ford DP without too much in the way of reliability problems, 800hp in their Daytona demo run, and has done 1000hp on the dyno. The Aston Martin and the Porsche definitely can't. My impression is the Porsche is running practically unrestricted like the Z4 GT3.

Anyways the Ford is basically a 90s GT1 and those could do 3:35-3:40 then with what is ancient tire technology by today's standards.

[canaglia]

Agree, V6 in ford gt is basically the same engine used in the ganassi riley dp pushing not less than 560hp. The only issue is that engine seems to be a bit low on torque compared to bmw and ferrari turbo engines.

[tjh8402]

Originally Posted by carbsmith

No actually half of those things would never happen because the rules are still 5500cc normally aspirated and 4000cc turbocharged.

The Ford and the Ferrari could be a lot faster. The Ford doesn't even really need to be unrestricted to, I don't think they've ever taken all the sandbags out. Plus that engine actually already ran at ~600hp in the Ford DP without too much in the way of reliability problems, 800hp in their Daytona demo run, and has done 1000hp on the dyno. The Aston Martin and the Porsche definitely can't. My impression is the Porsche is running practically unrestricted like the Z4 GT3.

Anyways the Ford is basically a 90s GT1 and those could do 3:35-3:40 then with what is ancient tire technology by today's standards.

Unrestricted to me means the displacement and cylinder count limits are gone. Even if they are kept around, the Ferrari V8 in street form is already 100 hp more powerful than the Ford. take the boost and rpm limits away and I don’t see a 3.5L V6 turbo being able to match 4.0L V8 turbos for power.

Originally Posted by canaglia

Agree, V6 in ford gt is basically the same engine used in the ganassi riley dp pushing not less than 560hp. The only issue is that engine seems to be a bit low on torque compared to bmw and ferrari turbo engines.

It can make more power than it currently does, but in the end cylinder count and displacement matter. If both are turbo, A bigger engine with more cylinders will ultimately be more powerful.

[canaglia]

Originally Posted by tjh8402

Unrestricted to me means the displacement and cylinder count limits are gone. Even if they are kept around, the Ferrari V8 in street form is already 100 hp more powerful than the Ford. take the boost and rpm limits away and I don’t see a 3.5L V6 turbo being able to match 4.0L V8 turbos for power.




It can make more power than it currently does, but in the end cylinder count and displacement matter. If both are turbo, A bigger engine with more cylinders will ultimately be more powerful.

actually pressure boost is what matters most


ferrari and mercedes f1 v6 1.6L turbo = >800hp
porsche v4 2L = about 600hp @ about 80kg/h

toyota eagle MK3 4L 2.1L = >700hp


examples of small displacement turbo engine with an insane power release due insane turbo pressure. Of coure these are expensive bespoke engines.
Like new vantage, ford gt has a not so high pressure boost, in the range of 1.4bar; 488 and M8 have higher pressures.


Anyway nothing wrong with that, ford v6 was revving up to almost 8000rpm in riley ganassi, it was designed to have a lower but flat torque release in mid-mid high rpm.