Grand Prix Monaco Historique 2021 - Live Stream

[hoffman66]

Think someone might be taking this a little too seriously above loL!

Jean missed a gear, Marco was right there and had not looked remotely like clashing for 15 or so laps before, just a racing incident, the fact that jean is French and was probably guest of honour type stuff probably played a part!!

it is F1 after all

[Gerard C]

Originally Posted by hoffman66

Jean missed a gear, Marco was right there and had not looked remotely like clashing for 15 or so laps before, just a racing incident, the fact that jean is French and was probably guest of honour type stuff probably played a part!! It is F1 after all

+ 1.

[justracing]

Such a shame for Alesi, he didn't put a wheel wrong but following that closely Verna was almost certain to make contact if the leader hesitated or faltered for whatever reason. I must confess watching that rear view of the incident it did appear to be more than just a tap, Alesi's Ferrari went very sharply to the right wiping him out.

[Gerard C]

Werner was faster and I dont see how its possible to overtake at Monaco without being close, Alesi was defending hard as should. They both were fighting and taking risks. As hoffman66 said above its a racing incident imo. The Sports moteur avant race saw some wreckage too.

[John Elwin]

Originally Posted by Gerard C

+ 1.

+2

It was great to see Michael Lyons' very sporting gesture to Marco Werner after the race. And he probably had a better view than anybody as to just what happened too.

[john ruston]

So our man PBE stopped when in lead and the Swiss fellow won in his Talbot Largo.Pity as Patch should have won.
Funny they now put wings on Largo and it becomes a sports car at Le Mans Classic. Another flexible Pre War car!

[E.B]

Originally Posted by john ruston

So our man PBE stopped when in lead and the Swiss fellow won in his Talbot Largo.Pity as Patch should have won.
Funny they now put wings on Largo and it becomes a sports car at Le Mans Classic. Another flexible Pre War car!

Totally agree PBE was robbed over the weekend at Monaco. Wonderful to watch him prior to his misfortune.

Re the Talbot-Lago is that not what Rosier did in real-life in I think 1950? Take a Lago GP car and throw lights and mudguards on it and make it wide enough to classify as a two seater. He then entered and won at LM with his son co- driving (for a couple of laps.)

However I suspect you are referring to a pre war Talbot Lago (as like the one inherited PBE's win, a T150C 'MD'). I know Rosier's LM Lago was the later post war T26 entered as a T26 GS (Grand Sport Roadster in full).

Please excuse my ignorance John.

Edit: Just re-read your post and it clearly refers to a Pre War car so ignore my (uneducated) dribble re post war stuff. (looks for an embarrassed smiley to add)

[john ruston]

No problem!
It’s the same Largo that races in Grid 1 at Le Mans Classic .
Amazing despite it being classed as a Grid 2 Post War car!
Assume it’s lucky that our old Talbot 105’s have beaten it three times at LMC but they declined our Monaco entry for 105 in stripped condition as raced in Pre War South African GP
Should have sent Alta!

[E.B]

Originally Posted by john ruston

No problem!
It’s the same Largo that races in Grid 1 at Le Mans Classic .
Amazing despite it being classed as a Grid 2 Post War car!
Assume it’s lucky that our old Talbot 105’s have beaten it three times at LMC but they declined our Monaco entry for 105 in stripped condition as raced in Pre War South African GP
Should have sent Alta!

Thanks for the clarification.

[Mike Harte]

Originally Posted by hoffman66

Jean missed a gear, Marco was right there and had not looked remotely like clashing for 15 or so laps before, just a racing incident, the fact that jean is French and was probably guest of honour type stuff probably played a part!!

Has it actually been clarified officially that Alesi missed a gear, or whatever, and that as a consequence he faltered? Regardless, surely it is, however, the responsibility of the following driver to avoid ramming the car in front despite it apparently slowing, or not accelerating as normal?

[Gerard C]

Officially? Are you kidding? I'm with hoffman66 when he says "the fact that Jean is French and was probably guest of honour type stuff probably played a part".
I think he should have been warned for deliberate obstruction and putting three wheels on the kerb at Loews so many times (I know the name has changed, but this is period correct). Never heard about a Ferrari that wide!
Have a look to his pre-race itw. He was surprised to meet fast drivers. Ha yes? May be he thought it was a chic pic-nic organised for rich people?
Werner is not unknown. And damn fast. And really good. IMO.

[Rudernst]

from what I have heard
Alesi and the Ferrari were favored all weekend by the organisers
to the point of getting extra laps in to dial in the car

Alesi went out on fresh tires in every session
which is allowed but notable
he and his team wanted to win at all cost
and did not

having looked at the video
the accident happened very early on the straight
under full acceleration
judging from the way Werner gains so quickly
Alesi must have had either had technical problem with the engine
or missed a gear
normally at Monaco
if one gets the exit right onto the straight
better than the guy in front
dragrace down the straight
and with some luck, outbraking into corner up the Casino hill (St. Devote)
No way that a healthy Ferrari would have lost so much ground there so quickly


and yes, on paper, Werner was the culprit
he touched Alesi because he did not allow for Alesis loss of momentum
Alesi had nowhere to go, because of the pit wall
bear in mind that the stewards at Monaco usually are FIA stewards
and usually the cream of the crop
they absolutely know what they are doing
(I have had the pleasure of their company myself)

In my humble opinion that was a racing accident

Werners behaviour was childish
I can understand how he got there
but to make an ass of himself in that way
not clever

In my experience
during the drivers briefing
they will have said something to the effect, that all incidents of contact will be looked into and get dealt with
there will have been a warning
but these get overheard
its just a drivers briefing....


RudE

[john ruston]

The only certain thing is that you can be sure that Jean will not pay for damage!
Is Werner part of the classic car dealers dynasty?

[Rudernst]

Originally Posted by john ruston

The only certain thing is that you can be sure that Jean will not pay for damage!
Is Werner part of the classic car dealers dynasty?

Marco Werner, among other things, has won Le Mans overall 3 times in a row, in the works Audi and the Daytona 24 hours to boot, it can be argued that he has enjoyed more success than Jean Alesi....

[Gerard C]

Jean Alesi: 201 GPs, 1 win, 32 podiums. Marco Werner: 294 races, 53 wins, 116 podiums. Facts. Not really Mr Average then. At Monaco he was c 2" faster than Alesi.

[merak1974]

I think this link provides all the races. Great stuff

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LpMLOmBD_Fc&t=1s

The sportscar race is particularly nice; beautiful Aston Martin, Jaguar, Maserati etc. entries.

[delta]

Originally Posted by Rudernst

from what I have heard
Alesi and the Ferrari were favored all weekend by the organisers
to the point of getting extra laps in to dial in the car

Alesi went out on fresh tires in every session
which is allowed but notable
he and his team wanted to win at all cost
and did not

having looked at the video
the accident happened very early on the straight
under full acceleration
judging from the way Werner gains so quickly
Alesi must have had either had technical problem with the engine
or missed a gear
normally at Monaco
if one gets the exit right onto the straight
better than the guy in front
dragrace down the straight
and with some luck, outbraking into corner up the Casino hill (St. Devote)
No way that a healthy Ferrari would have lost so much ground there so quickly


and yes, on paper, Werner was the culprit
he touched Alesi because he did not allow for Alesis loss of momentum
Alesi had nowhere to go, because of the pit wall
bear in mind that the stewards at Monaco usually are FIA stewards
and usually the cream of the crop
they absolutely know what they are doing
(I have had the pleasure of their company myself)

In my humble opinion that was a racing accident

Werners behaviour was childish
I can understand how he got there
but to make an ass of himself in that way
not clever

In my experience
during the drivers briefing
they will have said something to the effect, that all incidents of contact will be looked into and get dealt with
there will have been a warning
but these get overheard
its just a drivers briefing....


RudE

Spot on RudE. I also have been up in front of the stewards at Monaco. "and they let me off". Happy days.

[john ruston]

Comical commentary!
Very small grids
Pre selector in Nash?

[Rudernst]

Originally Posted by john ruston

Comical commentary!
Very small grids
Pre selector in Nash?

You speak in riddles John...
Less terse, please

RE

[Gerard C]

One by one speaking with the stewards? Tsss… "We" have a record there holding since '87: all the 24 drivers of the 505 T Trophy "convoqués ?* la direction de course", illico presto. Poor driving standard they said…
Last but not least, the PTS responsible had to argue about the rails to replace, think it was no other than…Jean Todt! They let us off but never invited us anymore!

[john ruston]

Rudy ,just for you!
My personnel view of You Tube coverage.
Comical commentary- Andy Marriott and his mate showing his lack of knowledge about Historic Racing. He’s an expert from mid 60,s on contemporary racing when he was with Motoring News and very close to Chris Lambert .Spent many years in States covering IMSA.
Very small grids due to people pulling out with COVID situation so with that in mind and why bother running the event?
The commentary team decided Nash in Pre War race had a preselect gearbox.Seems this is unique in a Pre War Nash?
Does that make my comments more lucid?

[Duddha]

Let's not forget Marco was the 1992 Monaco Formula Three Grand Prix winner...

[Rudernst]

On reflection...

A Ferrari getting favored in F1
this is completely period correct
it adds to the feeling of authenticity of the Historic GP

hats off !



RudE

[John Elwin]

Beaten by a mere 'garagiste' Lotus too! Oh, the shame...

[MichaelBirch]

Originally Posted by Rudernst

On reflection...

A Ferrari getting favored in F1
this is completely period correct
it adds to the feeling of authenticity of the Historic GP

hats off !



RudE

Excellent!