Peugeot 2010-2011 (Temporarily Closed)

[cmk]

If there was to be any value for them, it would surely require that they be competing against Audi...who equally can't justify competing at this juncture without adequate competition, who at least would give some modicum of ammunition for their case to the corporate heads that be. Catch 22.

[Fogelhund]

Originally Posted by trahsub

Question brought up is in the event de Ferran was to run a 908, would it make any sense for Pug to run in the U.S.?

Particularly seeing as Peugeot would likely have to pay for the whole thing themselves.

[CTD]

Originally Posted by LeMans.pt

In the same source but on a different page:

2007 Built
Chassis 908-01: Development car
Chassis 908-02: Destroyed (2008 24H Le Mans essays)
Chassis 908-03: Destroyed (2009 24H Le Mans race - Pescarolo car)

2008 Built
Chassis 908-04: Nº7 in Spa and Le Mans (2009)
Chassis 908-05: Nº07 in Sebring and Nº08 in Petit Le Mans (2009)

2009 Built
Chassis 908-06: Nº9 in Spa and Le Mans (2009). Le Mans winner car now in a Museum
Chassis 908-07: Nº8 in Le Mans (2009)
Chassis 908-08: Nº07 in Petit Le Mans (2009)

Ok, so #1 is a no use.
#2, #3, #4, #5, #6, #7 and #8 is available.
What we must remember is the 908H!, which is either the #1, or one of the available chassis.
So at least 6 chassis able to be upgraded and being raced.
But some might be saved as spares, so we are maybe down to 4 chassis to be raced!?, and if Peugeot them self take 3 to race in Le Mans, only 1 can be offered?

[Dead-Eye]

Originally Posted by CTD

Ok, so #1 is a no use.
#2, #3, #4, #5, #6, #7 and #8 is available.
What we must remember is the 908H!, which is either the #1, or one of the available chassis.

The Hybrid is #01, and you seem to have missed the part about #02 and #03 being destroyed in accidents. I suppose #06 could be pressed back into service, but I don't see them risking the LM winning chassis.

[Fogelhund]

It seems that people here are assuming that Peugeot is incapable of building more chassis, if they really wanted to.

[CTD]

Originally Posted by Dead-Eye

The Hybrid is #01, and you seem to have missed the part about #02 and #03 being destroyed in accidents. I suppose #06 could be pressed back into service, but I don't see them risking the LM winning chassis.

Oh, my mistake.
But that removes 3 chassis!, so i only think we will see one Private Peugeot next year!?, unless Peugeot Sport, don't race themself.

[Dead-Eye]

Originally Posted by Fogelhund

It seems that people here are assuming that Peugeot is incapable of building more chassis, if they really wanted to.

That's a given. The question is if they want to for the last year of the 908 programme.

[LeMans.pt]

Originally Posted by CTD

Oh, my mistake.
But that removes 3 chassis!, so i only think we will see one Private Peugeot next year!?, unless Peugeot Sport, don't race themself.

Better make it 4: The two destroyed, the development car and the 'museum' car. Thay already said that they would race three cars and that they will 'give' one to privateers. I hardly think that even if they built more chassis for this year, that we will see more that one privateer 908.

[HORNDAWG]

Originally Posted by Fogelhund

It seems that people here are assuming that Peugeot is incapable of building more chassis, if they really wanted to.

Incapable? Not hardly! Unwilling to, for a single year of (possible) service, very much so! Especially in the current economic clime.








L.P.

[Fogelhund]

Originally Posted by HORNDAWG

Incapable? Not hardly! Unwilling to, for a single year of (possible) service, very much so! Especially in the current economic clime.

Have they stated specifically that they are unwilling, or is this an assumption without backup? They've built eight chassis in three years. Emperical evidence points to them building at least two a year, and two of the three years, they've built three, essentially for a single year, or even single race service.

[CTD]

Originally Posted by Fogelhund

Have they stated specifically that they are unwilling, or is this an assumption without backup? They've built eight chassis in three years. Emperical evidence points to them building at least two a year, and two of the three years, they've built three, essentially for a single year, or even single race service.

They are finished developing the 908, up to Le Mans 2009.
Why would they build extra chassis for just Le Mans, in these times?.

[HORNDAWG]

Originally Posted by Fogelhund

Have they stated specifically that they are unwilling, or is this an assumption without backup? They've built eight chassis in three years. Emperical evidence points to them building at least two a year, and two of the three years, they've built three, essentially for a single year, or even single race service.

Have they stated specifically that they are willing, or is this an assumption without backup?




L.P.

[Fogelhund]

Originally Posted by CTD

They are finished developing the 908, up to Le Mans 2009.
Why would they build extra chassis for just Le Mans, in these times?.

I am not suggesting they will, just stating that "if" they want to fund cars to run in the ALMS, and need chassis, they "could" build more, "if" they wanted to. It is an option available to them, and they are not restricted to just using existing chassis as many posts have assumed here.

[Fogelhund]

Originally Posted by HORNDAWG

Have they stated specifically that they are willing, or is this an assumption without backup?

Argumentative for the sake of it.

Clearly my point here is that they are not restricted to existing chassis, and that they "could" build more chassis "if" they want to. They haven't specifically stated they would, or wouldn't build more chassis, "if" there was a need. I made no claims either way, just presented it as an option. I didn't say they were "willing", or "unwilling", though others did, presented as fact.

[CTD]

Originally Posted by Fogelhund

I am not suggesting they will, just stating that "if" they want to fund cars to run in the ALMS, and need chassis, they "could" build more, "if" they wanted to. It is an option available to them, and they are not restricted to just using existing chassis as many posts have assumed here.

Of course they have the ability, but it's SO unlikely for them to do!, therefor we aren't discussing it as an possibility.

[The Badger]

If someone is going to pay for it , why not build another one ?

[CTD]

Originally Posted by The Badger

If someone is going to pay for it , why not build another one ?

If someone want to pay for it, they properly want to keep racing the car for more than 1 year!, and im not sure Peugeot wants the 908 to race its successor (909)!

[The Badger]

Maybe they will be represented in ALMS next year with the 908 , and the following the same .

What is it racing against in the ALMS ..... thats going to beat it on a good day ?

A Peugeot win is a Peugeot win ..... maybe a 908 in ALMS and a newer model in Europe and Le Mans ?

[CTD]

Originally Posted by The Badger

Maybe they will be represented in ALMS next year with the 908 , and the following the same .

What is it racing against in the ALMS ..... thats going to beat it on a good day ?

A Peugeot win is a Peugeot win ..... maybe a 908 in ALMS and a newer model in Europe and Le Mans ?

I think that Peugeot is very careful not to take too many eggs in their basket!.
Running the 908 (or supporting a privateer), and also having to run their own new car could be too much!. Remember that a new car needs constant development and fine tuning to be fast and reliable (see the 908 in 07 and the R15 this year), so they properly wont have the time or resources to support another team. (I think that is also what went "wrong" with the Kolles team).
A Peugoet win is a Peugeot win. Peugeot is very good at "showing of" their victories, so they'll take any victory they can get, but if Peugeot had to choose running only in ALMS, or only in LMS, then the LMS races will be more interesting choice, as Peugeot has a market in Europe, but not in America, so it would be easier for Peugeot to get a sale out of an LMS victory than from an ALMS victory. Therefor Peugeot is more likely to race in LMS than ALMS, and therefor, if they had to support a privateer, then it would likely be an LMS competitor (or Asia LMS, as they do sell some cars in Asia).

But could Peugeot just be selling their cars (/one car), and letting the team do what they want to with it?

[HORNDAWG]

Originally Posted by CTD

I think that Peugeot is very careful not to take too many eggs in their basket!.
Running the 908 (or supporting a privateer), and also having to run their own new car could be too much!. Remember that a new car needs constant development and fine tuning to be fast and reliable (see the 908 in 07 and the R15 this year), so they properly wont have the time or resources to support another team. (I think that is also what went "wrong" with the Kolles team).
I would tend to agree with this.

A Peugoet win is a Peugeot win. Peugeot is very good at "showing of" their victories, so they'll take any victory they can get, but if Peugeot had to choose running only in ALMS, or only in LMS, then the LMS races will be more interesting choice, as Peugeot has a market in Europe, but not in America, so it would be easier for Peugeot to get a sale out of an LMS victory than from an ALMS victory. Therefor Peugeot is more likely to race in LMS than ALMS, and therefor, if they had to support a privateer, then it would likely be an LMS competitor (or Asia LMS, as they do sell some cars in Asia).
This, not so much. Depending on the TV package, Peugeot could very well get more exposure from running in the ALMS. It will be interesting to see just who, and where, will run a 908, if any?


But could Peugeot just be selling their cars (/one car), and letting the team do what they want to with it?

This last part is, IMO, a 'no fracking way' scenario! There is to much IP in the 908 for Peugeot to let it out of their hands.




L.P.

[Speed-King]

This, not so much. Depending on the TV package, Peugeot could very well get more exposure from running in the ALMS. It will be interesting to see just who, and where, will run a 908, if any?

I am still wondering where you Americans get that idea from? Peugeot complained about Eurosport having too small an impact broadcast wise to justify their presence in the LMS, and while MotorsTV might offer full flag to flag coverage of ALMS (or perhaps not!) their reach is in turn much smaller than Eurosport's, which everyone can receive with a basic satellite dish. Motors is hardly anywhere available in Germany and further to the East.

[HORNDAWG]

Originally Posted by Speed-King

I am still wondering where you Americans get that idea from? Peugeot complained about Eurosport having too small an impact broadcast wise to justify their presence in the LMS, and while MotorsTV might offer full flag to flag coverage of ALMS (or perhaps not!) their reach is in turn much smaller than Eurosport's, which everyone can receive with a basic satellite dish. Motors is hardly anywhere available in Germany and further to the East.

Having a larger base to draw an audience does not mean it will get/have a larger audience or market share, for any particular program. Also the amount of time (length) that a race is actually shown expands the exposure possible for any participant, period.

But as this is all speculation, we will see what Peugeot wishes to do in the near future, I would imagine.




L.P.

[HORNDAWG]

Klien in doubt for 2010. Here





L.P.

[Tom908V12]

There was already rumours Klien was leaving the team, same for Brabham...wondering who Peugeot-Sport will chose as replacement

[LeMans.pt]

Originally Posted by HORNDAWG

Having a larger base to draw an audience does not mean it will get/have a larger audience or market share, for any particular program. Also the amount of time (length) that a race is actually shown expands the exposure possible for any participant, period.

But as this is all speculation, we will see what Peugeot wishes to do in the near future, I would imagine.

Agree, but even so, it was Peugeot and Audi who made pressure on ACO in order to change from Motors TV to Eurosport in order to have more exposure. The fact is that here in europe, Europsort is accessible on every cable provider or satellite and Motors TV isn't. For an exemple, here in my country (portugal) the two main cable operators (more that 70% share of the market: more than half of the population), Eurosport is available on the basic package on both of them, but motor is only available as an option on the second biggest cable operator. The Europsort transmission is... well... ridiculous, an besides the excellent job made during Le Mans, the Le Mans Series had only the 'right' for the live feed during the 15 first minutes, and the last half an hour. An 30 minutes highlights on race day by night (and half of it was publicity) an an hour review on Wednesday On some regional broadcasts, like Eurosport UK, or Europsort Gemany, the home races had a little more exposure, but on Eurosport International, that was it.

Even through the eurosport web player, only Catalunia, Spa and Algarve had the full race broadcast (on a 5 euros/month payment). Nurburging and Silverstone were not....