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Old 15 Apr 2005, 11:32 (Ref:1278815)   #26
Bryan Miller
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Eliminate 3 x BT18's,

F2-21-66.
F2-39-66.
F2-40-66.
All over here for many years .


F2-39-66.
Chris, for your records .New to Alistair Walker for the 1967 season , at end of season sold to Dean Rainsford of Australia with MAE and bought to Australia straight away , eng. no. 66-133 , used immeadiately in Aust. for a season before being sold to Peter Larner. ETC.ETC.

Bryan.
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Old 15 Apr 2005, 11:43 (Ref:1278819)   #27
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Chris,

F2-40-66,

By April 1967 in Singapore for Lee Hang Seng , found and purchased by the late Derry George in 1985 and retained untill 1996 when sold to Peter Larner , as he was unable to re-purchase his old F2-39-66.




Eli , I have proof in front of me which indicates your car is F2-27-66. AM 128.

Bryan.
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Old 15 Apr 2005, 12:02 (Ref:1278831)   #28
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Chris,

The above re. F2-40-66 does not fit with your call out , the car here appears to have very good provenence , and retains chassis plate.

Regards Bryan.
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Old 15 Apr 2005, 12:32 (Ref:1278845)   #29
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Bryan Miller
Chris,

F2-40-66,

By April 1967 in Singapore for Lee Hang Seng , found and purchased by the late Derry George in 1985 and retained untill 1996 when sold to Peter Larner , as he was unable to re-purchase his old F2-39-66.




Eli , I have proof in front of me which indicates your car is F2-27-66. AM 128.

Bryan.
Thanks Bryan,
Gilbert Baird car, run by Chris Meek in 1967? Would you know if that was first year they ran AM128 or was it run in 1966?
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Old 15 Apr 2005, 14:56 (Ref:1278950)   #30
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I have always had F2-27-66 as AM126 ?????? Chris Meek car.
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Old 15 Apr 2005, 15:01 (Ref:1278954)   #31
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You can also eliminate F2-6-66 It came back from Sweden 6 or so years ago and is sitting in the roof of my pals workshop awaiting restoration
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Old 15 Apr 2005, 16:29 (Ref:1279045)   #32
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ted Walker
I have always had F2-27-66 as AM126 ?????? Chris Meek car.
That would make AM128 the F2-29-66 car, wouldn't it?
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Old 15 Apr 2005, 17:06 (Ref:1279072)   #33
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Ted,

The information I have is not period unfortunately .
Eli , can only suggest you await reply from J. Hafkenschiel.
And you cannot presume that because one chassis /AM number combination is something that another combination will be xyz. It is not so.

Bryan.
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Old 15 Apr 2005, 17:25 (Ref:1279086)   #34
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Bryan Miller
Ted,

The information I have is not period unfortunately .
Eli , can only suggest you await reply from J. Hafkenschiel.
And you cannot presume that because one chassis /AM number combination is something that another combination will be xyz. It is not so.

Bryan.
I received a packet from John just this morning. No reference to the early history of the car and no reference to an ID either.

Where was your reference for AM128's link with the Baird-Meek car from?

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Old 15 Apr 2005, 19:25 (Ref:1279141)   #35
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Odd ball typo!

Quote:
Originally Posted by Dan Rear
Didn't John Hart have a BT38 around that time, maybe a 'typo' ?
Dan, as the car is identified in both the Official Programme, the Official Results and the contempoary reports as a BT18 then I am not so sure it is a typo.

HOWEVER

The following year he was in a 1.6 BT38.
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Old 15 Apr 2005, 20:21 (Ref:1279180)   #36
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Some variations from and additions to your list, Chris
No guarantees of accuracy, but some may ignite a spark

I have the following listed for 1966:
13 - MRS/Lanfranchi
15 - Natalie Goodwin
24 - David Cole (and Lamplough)
28 - Lythgoe/Rollinson
30 - Mike Walker
34 - Harry Stiller
38 - Wal Donnelly
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Old 16 Apr 2005, 08:52 (Ref:1279478)   #37
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Bryan

Re BT18 [F2.66.40]
There is an ad AS 29.11.68 'built late 66 hardly used', by Lamplough, which gives this chassis no. [Am now on my way to double check it in National Newspaper Library] Then there is a subsequent ad in A/S Jan 1969 'Used by a young Frenchman for seven races in 1967 F3, who was then given a Matra and only used the car once more' so I've assumed these to be the same car. Will confirm that Lamplough gives number.

Very few of my chassis numbers come solely from black books, most actually are taken from adverts at end 66 or begining 67 where numbers were quite often given

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Old 16 Apr 2005, 09:49 (Ref:1279500)   #38
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Chris,

The trail is from Lee Hang Seng, however this is not my research but the competitors from 20 years ago, so will await your advice.

Eli,

Can only suggest you ask John Hafkenschiel to double check against the name Peter McGlone.

Bryan.
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Old 16 Apr 2005, 16:18 (Ref:1279693)   #39
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Bryan Miller
Chris,

The trail is from Lee Hang Seng, however this is not my research but the competitors from 20 years ago, so will await your advice.

Eli,

Can only suggest you ask John Hafkenschiel to double check against the name Peter McGlone.

Bryan.
Bryan,

Pete McGlone exists in the Brabham register as owning a BT18. Unlikely to be Pete's as Tom Ragonetti has an entry in there as well (AM128). There are about 24 BT18 entries in the register (mine included). Of these, appears ~19 are in North America.

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Old 10 May 2005, 19:59 (Ref:1297764)   #40
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"In 1976 one John Hart competed in the Weston Speed Trials in a '1.6 Brabham-Ford BDA BT18'. Does anyone know which BT18 this was?"


This came up earlier.. This was indeed my dad in his BT18... this was ex winkleman racing Rindt car, sadly he sold it to another hillclimber who sadly died of cancer, cannot remember his name .. my dad bought it with a Vegantune engine in it and ran it in sprints and hillclimbs he sold it and bought a BT38 with the dosh, but transferred the FVA engine into the BT38 .. so it was sold as a roller with wings and stuff added.. I have loads of photos.. should start a site !!!

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Old 10 May 2005, 20:07 (Ref:1297771)   #41
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Thanks!

Quote:
Originally Posted by Doug Hart
"In 1976 one John Hart competed in the Weston Speed Trials in a '1.6 Brabham-Ford BDA BT18'. Does anyone know which BT18 this was?"


This came up earlier.. This was indeed my dad in his BT18... this was ex winkleman racing Rindt car, sadly he sold it to another hillclimber who sadly died of cancer, cannot remember his name .. my dad bought it with a Vegantune engine in it and ran it in sprints and hillclimbs he sold it and bought a BT38 with the dosh, but transferred the FVA engine into the BT38 .. so it was sold as a roller with wings and stuff added.. I have loads of photos.. should start a site !!!

Doug Hart
Doug, that's great. Thanks for the info.

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Old 11 May 2005, 17:17 (Ref:1298485)   #42
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If you want some photos at some point, just mail me direct doug@hydrogendukebox.com

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Old 11 May 2005, 18:18 (Ref:1298522)   #43
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BT18 F2-12-66 is with me here in the states (Seattle.) The car was ordered by Peter Lawson and hillclimbed in the UK during 66/67. He then sold it to Peter Blankstone who hillclimbed with it in 68 and then sold to Spencer Elton who hillclimbed it in 69/70. After Spencer it went to Rod Pickering, Rob Laughton, Robin Meade, David Wilson, Paul Shires, Paul Spires, and Michael Rigby in Canada all of which used it as mostly circuit racing. I got the car in 2002 and had it restored by Horizon Racing in Seattle. I use it mostly on the West coast and did have it down in New Zealand 2004 for the Southern Festival.

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Old 12 May 2005, 13:56 (Ref:1299192)   #44
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The Bloke who had my Dad's BT18 was Jimmy Johnston from the leeds area. The BT40 he had was sold to Paul Squires, who sadly died at a young age and before he finished the car.. sorry for getting the story mixed up earlier.

Jimmy Johnston was a friend of Peter Kaye who climbed a BT35.. This is like Six degrees !!

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Old 14 May 2005, 08:50 (Ref:1300569)   #45
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Joe

Welcome. One extra bit of history for you. From Rod Pickering the car went, in 1971 to Geoff and Tony Lambert, and was very badly bent at Ingliston in a F. Libre race. [Report in Motoring News 10.6.71 p. 19].

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Old 13 May 2006, 00:15 (Ref:1607475)   #46
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Brabham BT 18 query

Hello:

It's about time to find out about the early history of my BT18, although, working on it and driving it is more important, I suppose!

It shows the following numbers: F2-26-66 (dash) and AM 136 AD near the lhs rear shock mount. I was told that the car was owned by a Toni Palmer in 67
(based on an ad at the end of the year). As such it may have run at Caldwell Park that year and finished 2nd. I have no idea what it did in 66. Certainly
no major F2 race.

I have a log book from SCCA where it ran in the midwest (USA).

Can anybody help with information?

Thanks in advance, Walter
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Old 13 May 2006, 08:45 (Ref:1607728)   #47
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F2-26-66

Walter

That chassis number is indeed given in Autosport magazine for Palmer's car when it appears at Cadwell Park in 1967. Unfortunately we've never been able to trace it back to a 1966 owner.

It would be a great help to us if you could give us the dates, places and owners of the car listed in the SCCA logbook [by private mail if you wish]
Without these documents it's almost impossible to identify users of BT18s and 21s in American FB racing, whether in the pro series or SCCA events.

Chris
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Old 13 May 2006, 13:33 (Ref:1607881)   #48
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BT18 car #26

Hello Chris:

Thanks. You were indeed one of two people who pointed me towards Tony Palmer. Here is what I know (based on the SCCA log book):

BT 18 F2-26-66

SCCA Log book identity no.: 18-268

Category: FC

color: black/yellow (I also have a spare body panel in this color), engine: Novamotor, 1000cc (entry from 8/22/74)

(car ran on midwest and eastern tracks - mostly in the hands of novices as occasional race school entries imply )

Ownership (as far as I can read the handwriting):

Mike Bystrom (? till 1/74)

Peter E. Pontante Jr. (from 1/74)

Ed Kasprowiecz (from 4/24/77)

Denny Sideri (from 8/12/78)

Wayne Boian (from 1/10/81)

Chris Stove (from 01/84)

That's where the SCCA log book ends

Owner till end of 90's: Gennaro Russo (State of New York), GR told me me bought the car in dissembled state from a "Japanese fellow".
Gennaro used the car in local events. (first with an SCA - which broke due to cam sprocket failure, then with a FF engine).
He sold me the car with another SCA/C engine freshly refurbished (if he had this engine done in the same shop as his first one I know why his first SCA broke -
fortunately I found the flaw before mine broke. Which confirms the rule (for the amateur racer): never race anything before you took it completely apart and back together again!). I moved the car back home to Graz, Austria when I ended my 17 years in the US.

You can see the car on my webpage: http://physik.kfunigraz.ac.at/%7Ewap/BT18.html

Also, if it's indeed the Tony Palmer car, you can see a glimpse of the car in the video "Motor Racing '60s Style 1960 & 1967, which I had watched many times before I bought the car. Seems the car then was red (as it now again is).

Regards, Walter
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Old 14 May 2006, 09:45 (Ref:1609342)   #49
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Walter

Many thanks for the SCCA log. Mikael Bystrom, Ed Kasprowicz and Denny Sideri were all in Central Division and Sideri was mainly in FC. Looks like I might be able to find some 70s results for you for the car.

Chris
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Old 5 Jun 2006, 18:48 (Ref:1627822)   #50
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F2-4-66

This F3 car was at Brands Hatch at the weekend competing in the F3 Historique race. Ferdinand Gustafson (Sweden) has owned it since 1969. It went to Kurt Ahrens in Germany and then to Ronnie Peterson.

The other BT18 there was David Crowther's F2 version with Cosworth SCA, painted in green/silver Jochen Rindt/Winkelmann Racing colours.

In the same race were two BT15s, three BT21s, a BT28 and a FJ BT6.

Alan Brown
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