Schumacher and Montezemolo

[Bononi]

Originally Posted by squarepeg

You weren't looking at their body language. MS really didn't want to be any where near LM. MS hugged every other Ferrari team member he could reach but didn't look at LM.

Body language ? Seeing more than is showing ? And how do we like a conspiracy theory, huhn ?

There are some truths out there.

LM never liked TGF's attitude, and couldn't wait to get rid of him at first sign that he would retire.

TGF never liked LM and just made the usual PR pics whenever it was needed, no surprise that LM never watched the race at Monza, until this weekend. TGF just couldn't wait the chance to retire to make it public in a body language manner, something like Barrichello did in Austria 2002, just slowing at the last corner to let TGF win...

Oh, and Ross Brawn and Jean Todt always hated each other, but they were employees and so they worked as a team. Looks like it worked.

[Davhut]

So, will we see him in a Mercedes? Oh, I mean McLaren.

[jonboyG]

Originally Posted by JohnSSC

Well, dreaming of a team becoming "shambolic" is not a very sporting thought...

Amazing to me how much talk there is about fair play right up until the dreams of revenge kick in!

I winced every time Williams or Mc won when they ruled the roost - but I fervently hoped someone would step up to the plate to challenge them - and someone always did. I did not hope for them to collapse, otherwise what value was there in the new team, whether it be Benetton, Ferrari or a resurgent Williams or Mc (depending on who was ascendant) besting the top guy?

I want to see competition decide the outcome, not shambolic teams simply being victims/victimized.

Perhaps if Ferrari weren't destroying the sport I love I wouldn't wish such malice on them. But they are. Refuelling was only brought back because Ferrari's V12s were too thirsty. Ferrari get a special $100 milllion 'enticement' from the FIA to throw their lot in with FOM and Bernie over the rest of the teams. Ferrari destroy Montoya's title hopes because they couldn't work their tyres properly. Ferrari get the mass dampers banned because they can't get them to work, yet some how Ferrari get to keep their new rear wheel treatment, which as I see it is illegal on at least two counts - not only is it a moveable aero device, wheels are supposed to be made up from a single material - and then there's the tearing up of the rulebook regarding straightlining chicanes to gain an advantage, the blatant stage management of various races over the years...

[JABWOA]

To me LM was just looking to see where the camera was and then jump into the family photo, mugging it up, so to speak.

[Inigo Montoya]

Originally Posted by jonboyG

Perhaps if Ferrari weren't destroying the sport I love I wouldn't wish such malice on them. But they are. Refuelling was only brought back because ... <rest of rant snipped>

This is not a thread to bash Ferrari, its to discuss Michael and Luca's relationship. Either contribute to the thread topic, or step away.

[Kempi]

LM asked TGF to announce his decision by Monza. That is all. Kimi was signed at the end of 2005 (just after Alonso announced the McLaren deal) and Ferrari, legitimately, wanted to know if they need to keep Massa or not. From a team standpoint it is only fair to ask a driver who considers retiring to announce it at a point where the team can still react on it.

I very much doubt the man who has always said "MS can drive for Ferrari for as long as he wants" now says "please go". Also, Todt has already signed for 2007, even though he will move into a different position - President of Ferrari.

[strider]

There was an article about all this some time ago, I think on grandprix.com.

MS was obviously going to retire in the next year or two. It is LM's job to ensure that Ferrari stays strong and that is why he signed Kimi ages ago.

However, he wanted MS to stay next season and race alongside Kimi, but MS wasn't happy about that idea and was supported in this view by Todt. So there was a difference of opinion within the team.

Meanwhile, Massa was proving to be rather more than your usual Ferrari number 2 driver, so they weren't keen to let him go. But something had to give, because 3 into 2 doesn't go if you're talking about drivers.

In one sense, therefore, MS was put in a corner by LM, but he did originally have the option to stay, but it was not on his terms, and he has become rather used to having his own way within the Scuderia.

In fact, things have all turned out rather well. Massa has shown that he can win races as well and the likelihood is that MS will retire at the end of the season with an eighth world title to his name.

[Big-O]

I saw a article where MS said he made his mind up after Indy ... so why wait til the end of the season to announce it ???? And why ask for more time ???

[Gt_R]

I can't believe the relationship of Luca and Michael can be so easily doubted and questioned, especially by non-supporters who seem relatively keen to make stories out of conflicts.

Luca has long appreciated Michael's presence in the team. I doubt Michael will survive long driving a Ferrari if Luca had any degree of resentment. Even during tough times, the issues were handled in a professional and matured manner.

What is different is that Michael and Luca share a relationship pretty much different from the one he shares with Jean Todt and Ross Brawn. It may be less emotional and affectionate, but that's not to say they share a sour one, or one in which they try force each other out. Afterall, Brawn, Todt and MS (along with Bryne and co) are the ones that have been fighting at the front line all these seasons.

From Ferrari's perspective, Luca once said that Michael can drive for Ferrari as long as he wants... but that doesn't mean that Michael can just one morning call in to say he's not turning up for a race. Michael has to give his preference to continue or leave with sufficient time to let Ferrari make alternative plans should it need be, and all parties are aware that consideration has to be given to Massa's career as well. And given that MS is still very much part of Ferrari's family, and Luca continues to be a key leader, it's unwise to end a successful era on a sour note.

[RT]

Originally Posted by JohnSSC

The long and short of it, according to them, was that thanks to Michael, and the team he built, there are some at Ferrari who think they are smarter than they actually are and really don't "need" Michael. LM being one of them.

My prediction? If Brawn and Todt go, and I think they will, then Ferrari will return to being a glorious team with a glorious past with nothing to show for it currently.

I think Kimi has made a huge mistake.

I hope you're wrong, as Kimi is my second favourite driver (Schumi is first). However, I do believe you're absolutely right.

The one thing that helped Michael when he joined, was that Ferrari knew they were thoroughly stinking as a team, they hadn't won for many years and "the Avvocato" wanted changes.

They had to do it Schumi's way because nothing else had worked.

Today I have the impression they feel they're perfect. It will be hard for Kimi to adapt, if they (read LM) expect the Kimster to"walk on water" right away, it will be a long long year at the red outfit.