[Team] Mercedes: Will they ever dominate again?

[Adam43]

Originally Posted by GT6

i bet who ever posted this thread is feeling stupid at this very moment, only 1 team in the championship so far

Only because of the typo.

[S griffin]

What typo?

[TrapezeArtist]

Originally Posted by Aysedasi

It's sad to see Mercedes in such dramatic decline. No fastest lap? They are clearly in complete disarray......

[S griffin]

I feel Mercedes are only just beginning

[Kempi]

They are certainly the best at talking their performance down. How many times have we heard they feel they are .5s behind (on a lap, on the straights, in corners, whatever) and in the end sit on top.

Ferrari is nowhere. Mercedes did great sandbagging during the testing, probably the most impressive part of their performance this year.

[S griffin]

Well I don’t think they were sure. And it’s taken a while to get up to speed. But now they are looking dangerous

I agree Ferrari are struggling and Merc, after being behind at the test, are now looking the dominant package

[wnut]

Originally Posted by Kempi

They are certainly the best at talking their performance down. How many times have we heard they feel they are .5s behind (on a lap, on the straights, in corners, whatever) and in the end sit on top.

Ferrari is nowhere. Mercedes did great sandbagging during the testing, probably the most impressive part of their performance this year.

Mercedes' only worry is that somebody wises up to the damage being done to F1 by their hybrid engine's dominance and changes the formula!

[GTRMagic]

Originally Posted by Aysedasi

It's sad to see Mercedes in such dramatic decline. No fastest lap? They are clearly in complete disarray......

Should Mr Wolff look for the exit door?

[S griffin]

That’s the last thing he needs to do at this time

[crmalcolm]

Originally Posted by GTRMagic

Should Mr Wolff look for the exit door?

Yes - his days are clearly numbered. Best to get out now and then blame the decline on someone else, keeping his own reputation intact.

It's obvious for all to see that Mercedes will soon be struggling to make the top ten, and they are only clinging on to results whilst all the bad luck goes to McLaren and Williams.

[bjohnsonsmith]

Originally Posted by crmalcolm

Yes - his days are clearly numbered. Best to get out now and then blame the decline on someone else, keeping his own reputation intact.

It's obvious for all to see that Mercedes will soon be struggling to make the top ten, and they are only clinging on to results whilst all the bad luck goes to McLaren and Williams.

Oh, the irony.

[Casper]

Originally Posted by wnut

Mercedes' only worry is that somebody wises up to the damage being done to F1 by their hybrid engine's dominance and changes the formula!

It amazes me why people think that changing things will change the running order. In my experience of motor racing the best always wins no matter what changes take place.

[bjohnsonsmith]

Originally Posted by Casper

It amazes me why people think that changing things will change the running order. In my experience of motor racing the best always wins no matter what changes take place.

I don't think that is a given. Why is a team like Williams who were the best, no longer the best? The same goes for McLaren. The best is the one who can make the most of the rules/technology at any given time and under the current regulations, that is Merecedes.

[chillibowl]

surely there are differences in where a team is in their development cycle which in turn means one team may be more adaptable/better prepared for change over another...a period of Ferrari dominance, followed by RB, followed by Merc.

all jump started by a change in the regs no?

aside from the engine regs though (where i think Merc's resource advantage can carry them through), if the sport is successful in reducing budgets then the challenge for Merc will be if they can maintain their excellence/dominance while downsizing.

generaly speaking, this is a hard thing for large corporations to accomplish.

[S griffin]

Well it depends how the development cycle goes. Ferrari had some challengers, RBR had looked good in the beginning and Merc are now ready to start dominating again

But rule changes are bound to have some effect and it’s how long they last

[Greem]

Originally Posted by S griffin

Well it depends how the development cycle goes. Ferrari had some challengers, RBR had looked good in the beginning and Merc are now ready to start dominating again

But rule changes are bound to have some effect and it’s how long they last

Merc haven't stopped dominating, really, since their favoured "eco-friendly" engine regulations were passed as The Ones and then they revealed their trick "shaft through the block" technology. Nobody else has got near in reality.

It still amazes me that we're running races faster on 50% the fuel of a few years ago and nobody is making a really big tub-thumping thing of it. That said, given the BBC Attenborough doco this evening, I'm amazed I'm still allowed to post here...

[S griffin]

Merc have had a few chinks in their armour. They have stayed on top by keeping on developing, despite what the sport throws at them

[Tourer]

Originally Posted by Casper

It amazes me why people think that changing things will change the running order. In my experience of motor racing the best always wins no matter what changes take place.

There is some truth in that but also think about recent examples of the running order being changed as a result of regulations changes:
Mercedes position in the running order changed markedly with the new engine regulations and the team has dominated through the current engine regs period. Now, I'm not suggesting that they'd be nowhere if the engine regs changed again (although it could happen) but that's one example.

Then there's Red Bull going in the other direction with the change to different engines (remember Red Bull's domination / strength prior to the changes to the engine regs).

Point is, sometimes changes DO shake up the running order - particularly if those changes are managed like the hybrid engine regs and give a free kick to any team that zigs whilst all the others choose to zag - and it turns out that zigging is the right gamble to take. The new engine regs stopped anyone who zagged from changing over to the zig path and Mercedes were off into the sunset and have maintained a lead on the engine front ever since.

Bloody good team though.

[S griffin]

Well yes, but not always. Merc were building up to the rule change, so it’s not like they came from nowhere. They were winning races the year before the rule changes

RBR seem to be hanging in there. They are still up there despite everything

Of course rule changes have the potential to mix things up, but the best budgeted teams usually end up on top. Mercedes simply have better resources than others

[bjohnsonsmith]

Originally Posted by S griffin

Well yes, but not always. Merc were building up to the rule change, so it’s not like they came from nowhere. They were winning races the year before the rule changes

RBR seem to be hanging in there. They are still up there despite everything

Of course rule changes have the potential to mix things up, but the best budgeted teams usually end up on top. Mercedes simply have better resources than others

It wasn't that many. Mercedes got their first win, at the 2012 Chinese GP, with Nico Rosberg. In 2013, they were runners up in the WCC, with three wins; Rosberg at Monaco and Silverstone, Hamilton at the Hungaroring. However, Hamilton and Rosberg between them got 9 podiums.

[S griffin]

True, but it wasn't like Honda/Brawn. Went from being a midfield team at best, to getting the title

[bjohnsonsmith]

Originally Posted by S griffin

True, but it wasn't like Honda/Brawn. Went from being a midfield team at best, to getting the title

When Mercedes came back to F1 in 2010, they were very much a midfield team for the first two years. Despite their first win at China in 2012, they only achieved two other podium finishes that year and didn't get their next win, until Monaco 2013. They won their first WCC in 2014.

[GTRMagic]

I think Mercedes should just hand the team back to Mr Brawn to run..

[bjohnsonsmith]

Originally Posted by GTRMagic

I think Mercedes should just hand the team back to Mr Brawn to run..

If anything, Ferrari ought to hand the technical directorship back to Mr. Brawn.

[S griffin]

Ferrari have lost their way since they went back to being 'Italian'