[Race] Goodbye Malaysia.

[Kempi]

Interesting that we today say it is said to see this one go as it was the first fullblown "Tilke-Drome" and criticized as being too clinical at first. Shows that some tracks do need some time to gain character. This definitely is one of them. Helps that it mostly produced good racing.

[S griffin]

I just want to wish my best to the sport and hope that they all come to the right places

[JeremySmith]

Originally Posted by F1Guy

Malaysian GP circuit chief executive says Malaysia wouldn't want F1 even if it was for free!

https://uk.reuters.com/article/uk-mo...-idUKKCN1C42N1

But door still open in future for a comeback??


Sad to see this circuit will no longer be on the calendar. One of the better race tracks for F1 of the Tilke designs. Sadly it will join Istanbul Park, Turkey and Buddh International in India as very good F1 circuits no longer on the calendar.

That’s bullshit of course ...

[JeremySmith]

This race will return in my not so humble opinion ..

[GTRMagic]

Originally Posted by JeremySmith

This race will return in my not so humble opinion ..

You would think so with Petronas having been a long term player in the sport..

[deley]

Some factors to consider;

The commercial model under which a country/circuit hold F1 is fundamentally broken and unsustainable,

Current F1 is essentially a marketing tool for most host countries and at some point interest in, and desirability of, it ends.

Dave

[S griffin]

The track is good, but there was never any enthusiasm from the locals. Too many empty grandstands. So can't say I'll miss it too much

[Purist]

I didn't get terribly current with F1 until the 2000 season, and it was a few more years before I saw the Malaysian GP. As such, my perception of the Sepang Circuit is perhaps less colored in a certain light than it is for some people.

Apart from the Turn 7-8 combination and the Turn 9 hairpin, the overall flow at Sepang is very good. Also, the circuit came in before the love affair with paved run-off took hold. Furthermore, this track has some uniqueness lacking in a number of Tilke's more recent designs, and Tilke also hasn't really ever "copied" anything from Sepang to his later designs.

Yes, there are other circuits I like better, but it's certainly one of the best "modern" courses out there. It ranks first or second in my book among Tilke's clean-sheet designs, up there with Istanbul. The others I feel should be mentioned as top "modern", F1-capable circuits are probably Algarve and Dubai. If there is a clean-sheet Tilke design that I might like to see F1 try that it hasn't visited already, it would be Buriram.

Sepang also wasn't thrown into a scenario like the Nurburgring GP Strecke, where that course is in the shadow of the Nordschleife, and was introduced while F1 still had the old Kyalami, Osterreichring, Zandvoort, full Paul Ricard, Brands Hatch GP, etc. on the calendar.

So, yeah, I'd definitely prefer a calendar with Sepang on it than one without, especially while F1 is still running at Shanghai, Abu Dhabi, Austin, and Bahrain. And don't get me started on how Tilke butchered Mexico City.

[F1Guy]

Originally Posted by S griffin

The track is good, but there was never any enthusiasm from the locals. Too many empty grandstands. So can't say I'll miss it too much

Do watch the race or the grandstands?

Because in many peoples opinion, the Sepang track is one of the best on the current circuit. And most drivers would agree too. F1 and other. Who cares if there was just 10 people in the stands, as long as the racing was good on TV!

[S griffin]

Originally Posted by F1Guy

Do watch the race or the grandstands?

Because in many peoples opinion, the Sepang track is one of the best on the current circuit. And most drivers would agree too. F1 and other. Who cares if there was just 10 people in the stands, as long as the racing was good on TV!

Atmosphere is important at race circuits, as it adds to the event. And you need demand to keep it going too

[crmalcolm]

Originally Posted by F1Guy

Do watch the race or the grandstands?

Because in many peoples opinion, the Sepang track is one of the best on the current circuit. And most drivers would agree too. F1 and other. Who cares if there was just 10 people in the stands, as long as the racing was good on TV!

But Formula 1 is not all about the TV viewers - so much more makes a good F1 event.

'The F1 season has been a revenue generator as it doesn’t merely encompass the race; a series of activities, shopping sales, road shows, a charity gala dinner, and public concerts are also common prior to and after the race. Fans also get the opportunity to meet and greet star racers.'

If limited numbers of fans are attending, nothing else in the F1 circus matters.
If it was only about TV viewers then surely the best solution would be to create 18-20ish good tracks in Central Europe?

[Nikki Katz]

It's a shame that tilke's better circuits end up in places that can't afford the fees Bernie set. I could easily do without Russia, china and Abu dabhi, but it doesn't really work like that.

[chunterer]

Maybe tilke can build a very similar layout for one of the prospective new country GP hosts!!!

[S griffin]

Well he did well with Austin. And that's a great place to hold a GP

[chunder]

Apart from the fact it doesn't make any money!!

Sepang will be fine, they have MotoGP, which will get a huge crowd due to better links between the country and a few decent Malay riders they have now, plus Honda and Yamaha really push bikes over there, huge market for them.

And the tickets are cheaper, hosting fees far less, so the track can drop the prices a bit.

Are we learning?

[S griffin]

Yes, at least MotoGP brings in the crowds, so it's gonna be alright with that series still coming

[Purist]

Chunterer, your suggestion just highlights another issue many have with the newer tracks in F1, that they're all just too samey. Going from Austin to the Croatia proposal just doesn't seem like a positive step.

The thing you can do is try to incorporate similar kinds of elements in multiple designs, but you've still got to build in a good amount of individuality. About the best comparison I can think of for this would be looking at VIR and Road Atlanta.

Griffin, no I really can't say that I find Austin to be that great. It has some interesting elements, but the way it went together, it just doesn't seem to all fit quite right. And some pieces just seem unnecessary. And you have that one, outlandishly big hill at Turn 1, while signature sections like the Esses and that long right-hander just look so flat and rather featureless, in no small part because of the oceans of paved run-off that take away frames of reference.

[FIRE]

Shame this track will not return.

[S griffin]

It's funny when you see the calendar from 1985-91. 15 out of 17 GPs of that time are on next season's calendar, showing it's come full circle again

[chunterer]

Originally Posted by S griffin

It's funny when you see the calendar from 1985-91. 15 out of 17 GPs of that time are on next season's calendar, showing it's come full circle again

But how many of the actual venues?

[S griffin]

Originally Posted by chunterer

But how many of the actual venues?

First of all misstyped, should have said 1986-91.

11 I'd say if you count the Red Bull Ring

[NaBUru38]

11 circuits were already used in the late 1980s: Monaco, Silverstone, Hockenheim, Spa-Francorchamps, Paul Ricard, Red Bull Ring, Montreal, Mexico, Interlagos, Suzuka (1987), and Hungaroring (1986).

Montmeló was added in 1991 and Melbourne in 1996, but F1 has a long tradition in Spain and Australia.

[Purist]

They may be the same venue, or on the same site, but you're going to have a hard time arguing that the Red Bull Ring is the same as the old Osterreichring, or that the current Mexico City (where EVERY corner has been changed) has much of anything to do with that earlier iteration.

Presumably, Paul Ricard will use the Long Circuit (I'm not gonna be happy if they chicane the Mistral for 2018, but I can almost expect that they will), whereas from 1986 on, they used the Short Course, following Elio de Angelis' testing crash in the Brabham.

And they took off 1987 to redo half the circuit at Montreal.

Interlagos didn't return until 1990, and on a course that was just about halved compared to what they last used in 1980. For 1981-89, they were at Jacarepagua.

Of course, compared to back then, the post-2001 Hockenheim is almost unrecognizable.

Spain returned, to Jerez, after a hiatus from Jarama in 1981.

Hungary was practically getting its start in '86, as the only prior GP was way back in 1936.

It's still that core of Monza, Monaco, Spa, and Silverstone, with everything else fluctuating around those.

Thinking back to the '80s, it's too bad Estoril got redone specifically for MotoGP, though I'm not sure it would be much better anyway once Tilke had a go with it for F1.

And with Max Verstappen, rumblings of Zandvoort are heard here and there; Assen's probably closer to being ready for F1 though.

[chunder]

Estorils changes I am not sure were done for bike racing, it was changed in the early 90's for F1 as there was a barrier on the outside of the track near the end of the lap with a huge drop on the outside and they couldn't do much about it. Bit like Tamburello, but even worse.

Don't think it was anything to do with bike racing, as MotoGP did not really start going there until I think 1999. Superbikes raced there before then, but raced on a slightly different layout anyway.

Assen is far too short to be an F1 track, and they don't have a massive sponsor to push it through anyway like Austria do. Zandovoort would be great but I doubt the people owning it have the money to invest in the necessary improvements.

[NaBUru38]

Originally Posted by Purist

They may be the same venue, or on the same site, but you're going to have a hard time arguing that the Red Bull Ring is the same as the old Osterreichring, or that the current Mexico City (where EVERY corner has been changed) has much of anything to do with that earlier iteration.

Of course, compared to back then, the post-2001 Hockenheim is almost unrecognizable.

It's still that core of Monza, Monaco, Spa, and Silverstone, with everything else fluctuating around those.

Silverstone has been remodelled several times, doesn't that count?