360MRC, next time (2011) - Discussion re Car Eligibility etc

[MartinSmith]

Originally Posted by SAMD

Oh you are awful

Its the GTE BTW apparently the longer trailing arms make them handle better.

I'd really like to see one of those in the race

[Mike Bell]

Originally Posted by ClaireSmith

No to App K

It was a 'for instance'- but your response is duly noted!

I'm just thinking in a lot of racing too much emphasis is put on the overall winner. With an enduro like 360 the smaller and / or lower powered cars need to have their own incentives- I hate hearing 'my 999cc whatever wouldn't be competitive'! It could start with class awards bigger than overall, and chance of something extra for a particularly impressive class win?

[terence]

Originally Posted by ClaireSmith

No to App K ...as for your second suggestion ...interesting idea but have you seen who I work with in Race Control? These Clerks are simple folk and the ones at 360 dont want to be having to actually think about who the winner is, they just want to sit down with their horlicks and pipe and slippers and snooze.....and thats while the race is on!!

On a serious note....its a possibility...food for thought.

Quite good to see them all behaving,no one moaning that someone else has the TV Remote etc but I hate the wiff of Deep Heat etc as you walk through the door.

[terence]

Originally Posted by SAMD

Oh you are awful

Its the GTE BTW apparently the longer trailing arms make them handle better.

Similar theory to Large Ape's?

[MartinSmith]

Originally Posted by Mike Bell

It was a 'for instance'- but your response is duly noted!

I'm just thinking in a lot of racing too much emphasis is put on the overall winner. With an enduro like 360 the smaller and / or lower powered cars need to have their own incentives- I hate hearing 'my 999cc whatever wouldn't be competitive'! It could start with class awards bigger than overall, and chance of something extra for a particularly impressive class win?

We shouldnt hijack this thread, as it was only to decide sat or sun (btw, Sat looks like its winning both here and on the Marshal front) but you have a valid point. We may need to change the class structure because we may need to change the acceptance criteria, so for example Class could be by age as well as size, but if we take for example the race on sunday, who would have thought that a 1957 Jag would come down to a tussle with a pug 205GTI? The Jag had an 11 lap lead and all of a sudden, that was down to a lap...then less than a lap and suddenly you could not swing a cat in Race Control for the people glued to the monitors... its the beauty of endurance racing, everyone stands a chance because its a long period of time and a lot can happen .... and we dont really want to lose the spirit of the event by making it complex
but...it is food for thought and we do want everyone to feel they have a chance....even those with a disasterous "brake problem"

[simon drabble]

mind you looking at the photo's of the Jaguar it was probably more modern than the Pug!! Did it come straight from Santa Pod??!!!!
You are right however endurance is all about finisher - even Mr Mallet's dog slow capri (his words not mine) almost took a podium...!

For what it is worth I would encourage the pre 66 cars to form a seperate grid and include sports racers...

[johngee]

Originally Posted by simon drabble

For what it is worth I would encourage the pre 66 cars to form a seperate grid and include sports racers...

All noted. However, I'm fairly certain that including Sports Racers would put off as many entrants as it would attract.
We spoke at Castle Combe Simon - get 30+ of your dodgy Sports Racer mates to commit and we could be looking at a second 360MRC 6 hour 'not for profit' race.

[MartinSmith]

Originally Posted by johngee

All noted. However, I'm fairly certain that including Sports Racers would put off as many entrants as it would attract.
....

Actually, we lost an entry because we opened it to Sportscars, so, I think not.

As John said, get your Sports racers together Simon and we could run it for you, INVEST the effort into getting it off the ground

[John Turner]

I agree; no sports racers (as opposed to production sports cars) but a double header with 2 x 6 hour races would be good, but we are getting ahead of ourselves here. Let's get this one established first.

Simon, the Jaguar was not excessively quick, but it was driven very consistently.

Love the idea of a Scimmie in the race, although need to check production figures. Is it a minimum of 5000 overall or a minimum of 5000 per year? Mind you, you still have the option of an invitation class.

One other thing that I'd like to say about this is the fact that in early discussions so many people wanted this class of car 'in' or that class of car 'out' and so therefore influenced what the organisers ultimately restricted the entry to. However, It would be interesting to know how many of those who 'voted' in this discussion, then actually turned up to race. I think that we know the answer to this! So, if, for example you don't want the organisers to open up the entry to say E30 M3s and Cossies, make your commitment, pay your entry fee and be there (unanticipated illness or mechanical breakdown aside, of course).

I think that I will split this thread, shortly.

[johngee]

Originally Posted by John Turner

I think that I will split this thread, shortly.

What? Into people who want a grid full of Scimitars and 5 Series BMW's ......... and those who don't?

[SAMD]

Strewth, I'd better get this old GTE trailed off the tennis court and into the garage, 'cos it will need rebuilt before it goes near an endurance race.
I was asking about the carbs 'cos this thing has triple downdraughts, are they allowed? If it needed changed to a single the power will probably drop from about 135 to about 99bhp. Mind you it is likely to be easier on fuel which would help.

[BILTEL]

Originally Posted by johngee

What? Into people who want a grid full of Scimitars and 5 Series BMW's ......... and those who don't?

And what's wrong with a BMW 535 on the grid?!! Only one though!!

[andy97]

Originally Posted by John Turner

Love the idea of a Scimmie in the race, although need to check production figures. Is it a minimum of 5000 overall or a minimum of 5000 per year? Mind you, you still have the option of an invitation class.

Why do we have to have a minimum of 5000 anyway - why do we want to exclude people with Lotii, Morgans, Scimiters, Ginettas, Rochdales, Gilberns, TVR, Darrians etc etc?

Lets get a full grid. If you have a production car, designed originally for use on the road - from a recognised manufacturer then you could enter (subject to the appropriate age restriction, whatever that becomes). Min production figure - 5!

[MagnetON]

Originally Posted by Mike Bell

It could start with class awards bigger than overall, and chance of something extra for a particularly impressive class win?

The class trophies were the same size as 2nd overall. I wanted to ensure that the person that actually managed to get the furthest over the 6 hours got something a little bit bigger. Looking at the invoice, 40mm to be exact!

Next you'll be wanting me to spring for 3 trophies per class and 3 overall!

While I knew it was certain that at least one team would pick up two trophies it was rather a laugh to find out we'd supplied 9 trophies for an 8 car grid!

[Mike Bell]

Originally Posted by MagnetON

The class trophies were the same size as 2nd overall.

Next you'll be wanting me to spring for 3 trophies per class and 3 overall!

And very nice looking trophies they were! If there are enough entries next year 3 per class should happen- but not suggesting you have to fork out for them! Plenty of time to get some more sponsorship, hopefully.

Great to meet both EP and yourself, btw!

[johngee]

Originally Posted by MagnetON

While I knew it was certain that at least one team would pick up two trophies it was rather a laugh to find out we'd supplied 9 trophies for an 8 car grid!

Well I hope you approved of the 9th recipient - I certanly did!

[Mike Bell]

Originally Posted by johngee

Well I hope you approved of the 9th recipient - I certanly did!

After vacating the car at 75 minutes or so I heard some of the commentary and remarked what an impressive job the guy was doing. Then it clicked who it was. John Hindhaugh most definitely deserved the final award!

A in my book! John, hope you come back next year!

[MagnetON]

Originally Posted by johngee

Well I hope you approved of the 9th recipient - I certanly did!

Yeah, top class bloke.

[MagnetON]

So... what race license do I need to drive???? And any suggestions as to who's car I'd fit in???

[Tim Falce]

Originally Posted by MagnetON

So... what race license do I need to drive???? And any suggestions as to who's car I'd fit in???

Being a foreigner you may need an International C

[MagnetON]

Originally Posted by Tim Falce

Being a foreigner you may need an International C

Ok, I know that Jocks are considered foreigners!! however.....

My (limited) understanding is that as I hold a UK passport my license has to be issued by the MSA.

[MGDavid]

Originally Posted by andy97

Why do we have to have a minimum of 5000 anyway - why do we want to exclude people with Lotii, Morgans, Scimiters, Ginettas, Rochdales, Gilberns, TVR, Darrians etc etc?

Lets get a full grid. If you have a production car, designed originally for use on the road - from a recognised manufacturer then you could enter (subject to the appropriate age restriction, whatever that becomes). Min production figure - 5!

all very well until a GT40 enters... IIRC the concept was (in part) to be the antithesis of the Spa 6 hours. Hence no sports-racers, no yank-tanks, no open cars, no turbos. I do think mandatory List 1A tyres needs a serious look, to even things out and keep cost down. I'm already being egged on by claims that I can't make an A series last 6 hours....

[Tim Falce]

Originally Posted by MGDavid

all very well until a GT40 enters... IIRC the concept was (in part) to be the antithesis of the Spa 6 hours. Hence no sports-racers, no yank-tanks, no open cars, no turbos. I do think mandatory List 1A tyres needs a serious look, to even things out and keep cost down. I'm already being egged on by claims that I can't make an A series last 6 hours....

When was the last time a GT40 finished the Spa 6 Hours?

[Tim Falce]

Originally Posted by MagnetON

Ok, I know that Jocks are considered foreigners!! however.....

My (limited) understanding is that as I hold a UK passport my license has to be issued by the MSA.

I would expect a Nat B would suffice unless of course Claire and John want the race to have Nat A status.

[johngee]

Originally Posted by Tim Falce

I would expect a Nat B would suffice unless of course Claire and John want the race to have Nat A status.

Stupid boy! It'll be a full FIA International next year!

Seriously Grant, I believe that there's still reciprocity (and that's easy for me to say!) between Motorsport Ireland and the MSA licences. I'll check it out for you