Hill speaks out!

[pole2pole]

I just read the piece from hill. Very interesting indeed and the frightening thing about it...he is spot on. We constantly hear that formula one is the pinnacle of motor sport but one of the worst forms of wheel to wheel racing

[JeremySmith]

But we are still going to watch it aren't we! And complain about basically everything that comes to mind, and when nothing does, well we darn well look for something to bellyache about.

[Dutton]

There is always something moan about, lol.

[pole2pole]

After giving it some thought and I don't know how the rest of you think about this....But i found alot of the pre shows on ITV,s f1 coverage much more interesting than the races. A couple spring to mind. The one where we got a tour of trullies house and vineyards and the one where Mark Blundell went training with Kimi. As I say that is just a couple out of many. Now when I think back about 15 years ago all this pre show stuff got in the way of some fantastic racing now it seems to be the other way about

[Adam43]

Yes, the pre-show for Suzuka destroyed the race. Jim in the big wheel, marvellous. That pass on the last lap for the lead, pants.

[Marbot]

Originally Posted by AdamAshmore

Yes, the pre-show for Suzuka destroyed the race. Jim in the big wheel, marvellous. That pass on the last lap for the lead, pants.

Let's hope this seasons qualifying format jumbles up the grid (unlikely) as much as that one was.

[mooneyda]

Who really gives a **** what Damon Hill thinks???

Yes he done a lot for F1 during his time in the sport, but does that really count NOW? I think not!! As with everything, things change... F1 included.

F1 has always been about the money, it was just never as obvious as it is now! And I doubt when those red lights go out there is anything corporate on the minds of the teams out there competing! Its still about the racing and winning and nothing will change that!!

Anyone who worries there narrow minds about anything other than the development of the cars and the racing on the track should go on the **** with Kimi Raikkonen and see what he thinks of the ever increasing corporate world of F1 swallowing him up and taking from his concentrating on driving / development and will to win everything put in front of him......

[Adam43]

Judging by that it seems you care a lot. I am not sure there is need for such language just because people as expressing their point of view. After all that is the point of a forum (except without the language on 10-10ths)!

Originally Posted by mooneyda

F1 has always been about the money, it was just never as obvious as it is now!

Isn't that pretty much what Damon was saying?!

Originally Posted by mooneyda

Anyone who worries there narrow minds about anything other than the development of the cars and the racing on the track should go on the **** with Kimi Raikkonen and see what he thinks of the ever increasing corporate world of F1 swallowing him up and taking from his concentrating on driving / development and will to win everything put in front of him......

[mooneyda]

Originally Posted by AdamAshmore

Judging by that it seems you care a lot. I am not sure there is need for such language just because people as expressing their point of view. After all that is the point of a forum (except without the language on 10-10ths)!

Isn't that pretty much what Damon was saying?!

Well i'm sure i can express my opinion too. In the way that i know automatic stars will appear on a post and you can use your imagination to make of them what you will.. hardly offended anyone now!!

back on topic though...........

Its not the Hill comments that bother me.. I don't have a care for what his gripes are with the sport. Its the way other's get so involved in kicking F1 when it s "supposedly" down. Lower tv viewings , blah, blah , etc.

Controversy is one of the main attractions to F1. Well it was for me at first (along with loud cars screaming past you!)
happily I have grown past that and love it now purely for the cars and racing!
i just think taht if some people could watch F1 with blinkers on, concentrating on the cars and racing, they may find it to be a more enjoyable experience. Just my opinion.. Works for me!

[Mystery]

Originally Posted by JeremySmith

But we are still going to watch it aren't we! And complain about basically everything that comes to mind, and when nothing does, well we darn well look for something to bellyache about.

Are we going to watch it though. Last year I watched maybe only 6 races which is probably the lowest since I was about 10 years old. The ones I did watch were largely processional, although judging by the banter on here after some of those I missed it seems like I was unlucky. But at the end of the day, the dull races did put me off, and no amount of "oooh you should have seen this great pass at Suzuka" or wherever will necessarily win me back.

I'll be watching this year because I'm curious at how Super Aguri will get on and after that I hope there's going to be something else to keep me watching.

[GeeRam]

Originally Posted by Jordi

I agree with what Damon says. If Kimi goes out on a bender everyone frowns nowadays and all of McLaren's sponsors are scared of the negative PR. It is way too controlled and cold.

Kimi's antics are kiddies stuff to what the drivers got up to back in the 50/60's etc......it's just back then they didn't have the world's tabloid press and papprazzi camped out on every street corner eager to destroy somebodies life at the drop of a hat.......

[shugruah]

I agree with DH, and I think that this happens in every industry... music, cinema, motorracing, even literature. The top ten selling books in every book stores that I know are about templars... that just happens because Da vinci code sold like hotecakes, and everyone starts to write about templars and secret codes and all that stuff. In music the same with hiphop. In cinema industry is the same story... this year the box office was lower (overal) than last years. lets hope hollywood understands that a film its not all about big movie stars...

When something goes right big investors come and try to make more money. they dont care if its music or f1. if it produce money they`re in!

When big money gets into anything that thing ussually lost its big supporters and fans.
Its a choice f1 have to make. many fans, sorry, many viewers or good fans.

Many viewers that want to play the new michel schumacher cellphone game for only 3.99€ or good fans that would do anything for f1 like taking vacations in the week that f1 goes to their countries and then pay big money for tickets to see 6 cars running and still have the will to go back next year.

and when good fans are off, every industry fails, dies soner or later.
and we dont wanna see f1 end like heavy metal or hiphop....lol

hill:
"they’ll go somewhere else to get it", "They can watch the Grand Prix Masters or A1 Grand Prix"
I agree! A1GP is getting good results in getting the attention of f1 fans. And i think this is a competition thats here to stay. the sheik its just one fan that didnt enjoyed to see f1, so he decided to make a funier competition.

he is like us, but with more money... if I had that money I would probably do the same.

[foreversideways]

For me Formula One just does not have the same appeal to me any more and year on year it becomes more removed from the fan, I watch it if i happen to be in the right place at the right time. In years gone by the drivers were not only exceptional in the car but out of it as well. They were larger than life individuals, risking life and limb doing something most people would not even consider doing. These types have largly moved on to more extreme sports and left us with bland kids. It is now a clinical, politically correct environment dictated to by it's car manufacturer paymasters who lets face it are the most clinical companies on the planet with there identical showrooms, clean enough to eat your breakfast off. They try to extinguish character from young drivers by bringing them up through their schools (Formula BMW) where dealing with the press and being presentable is more important than driving. They will never admit that their engine etc has failed because it looks bad. Give me James Hunt or Keke Rosberg reaching for a fag after getting out of the car after another win or fastest lap, or flooring a marshall in a rage after being bundled out of a race. It's called emotion.

[JohnSSC]

But when Michael and DC had their respective "moments" last season where they showed emotion they were pretty much skewered here on these very boards.

I would suggest, my young friends, that you cannot have it both ways here.

I do not mean this at all as an afront, but if it is raw emotion and the excitement of unevenly prepared cars dueling it out on the track, then I suggest Formula Ford or in this country Sprint Cars.

With the financial stakes as high as they are now in F1, grabbing a brew, a broad and a cigarette after a race just isn't going to make it with the sponsors. You can't have the $$$ needed to present these ridiculously honed machines driven by personalities that are, shall we say, a bit too "interesting." I mean, if you had bought stock in Vodafone would you want to see their VP of Marketing with a cigarette hanging out of his/her mouth pinching bums and drinking a bourbon (withouth the glass) whilst discussing his/her business plan?

I think not!

[Mystery]

Well if corporate $$$ are your thing then that's what you have in F1 now - good luck to you.

Me? I'll take emotion, passion and racing (i.e. potential for overtaking) any day.

Which is why when I'd just got back home in December after 12 hours travelling my family and I thought nothing of saying "forget unpacking - I want to watch Grand Prix Masters" so we did for the next hour and we were thoroughly entertained by Mansell and particularly Lammers and Stuck. If it was an F1 race I just wouldn't bother - what would be the point??

Sorry but F1 in 2005/6 in my opinion does not have the same mystique about it. It's not driven by people verging on being superheroes manhandling their beasts of 1400bhp cars around a circuit. Now those who are driving could as well be accountants for all we can tell and the sport, in my view, is the worse for it.

If it meant there wouldnt be so much money in the sport then so be it. But it would be "our" sport again and not an extension of the global corporate world.


(I can leave my soapbox here if anyone else needs it)

[BootsOntheSide]

Maybe it's because I only barely remember the drivers competing in it, but I didn't find the Masters race at South Africa all that exciting - large parts of it were processional in truth (was nice to have Murray back and on top form though).

Foreversideways does sum up a lot of the problems with F1 however. It was starting to happen by the early 90s, when the recession made it harder to attract sponsorship and as such companies were wary of sponsorsing anything with a bad image, so teams needed a more squeaky-clean image, and as the sport got more expensive it had to be more pressured and serious. However, the corporations have definitely caused this to increase.

[Big-O]

Sadly ... in a way he´s right ...

to much technology and to litle life .... its just getting to sterilized for my taste.

But still, better then nothing. And I´m not so sure "A1 Grand prix" can take "F-1's" place

[foreversideways]

Originally Posted by Big-O

Sadly ... in a way he´s right ...

to much technology and to litle life .... its just getting to sterilized for my taste.

But still, better then nothing. And I´m not so sure "A1 Grand prix" can take "F-1's" place

I think your comment also refers to life in general.
I am so glad i have been around long enough to enjoy some of the great days of GP racing from the mid 60s. Been able to stand right next to my heros in the paddock at Oulton Park during the gold cup, asked if i wanted to sit in the car etc etc, fat chance these days. I only wish i had been around to see the great days of Auto Union and Mercedes. May i suggest to some of our younger posters who feel that GP racing 2006 style is the greatest ever, that they take the opportunity to read something of the history of the sport and its characters, you may find it enlightening. I was only last night reading in Motor Sport about a young man called Hermann Lang who started as a engineer with Mercedes in the 30s after a period of unemployment and having been German sidecar champion, within a short period of time he got his chance and became their fastest GP driver winning many GP's in those monster cars. The war of course robbed him of his career as a driver and he returned to the factory as an engineer when it finished where he worked untill he retired. Not a story to be repeated in the near future i think.

[alf]

erm f1 over the last 16 years has suffered due to lack of overtaking. ie thats what we watch it for, to see the drivers pass and repass etc ( such as in moto gp). In years gone by there have been some famous hatreds or firm rivalries at least. The kind of stuff that would force you to watch, ie Mansell, Piquet. Prost and Senna
Schumacher and Hill. Schumacher and Villeneuve ( spelling sorry) etc. there just doesn't seem to be any fierce rivalries at the moment and as such the whole thing is all a little too polite, andthat is the main reason Joe Shmoe is switching off, theres just not enoughneedle to interest the public. If Alonso called Kimi a **** and cut him up a few times in testing for example, there would be a different atmos. in the paddock and that would permiate throught the scene.

As for F1 getting over corporate etc that rubbish, It has been like that for years, who ws it that sponsored DH and made him a millionare all those years ago????????

[foreversideways]

True alf but the tail is now wagging the dog.

[VIVA GT]

Originally Posted by JohnSSC

One need only go as far as this forum to read members ripping Kimi or JPM or whoever new bodily orifices for drinking or falling off their dirtbikes while playing tennis.

No wonder JPM hurt his shoulder. If he'd been drinking AND was riding his dirtbike whilst playing tennis, well, that explains it!

[neilwaynesmith]

Originally Posted by JohnSSC

" I mean, if you had bought stock in Vodafone would you want to see their VP of Marketing with a cigarette hanging out of his/her mouth pinching bums and drinking a bourbon (withouth the glass) whilst discussing his/her business plan?

Absolutely!! For one thing, it might inspire people to reach the same level if they think it gives them access to that sort of lifestyle

Stone cold professional in the office (car). Do whatever you feel is necessary to (legally) unwind out of it.

[kmsport]