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5 Nov 2021, 12:08 (Ref:4081615) | #26 | ||
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I am mostly poking fun at you as I assume you meant "modern F1". And even then, VERY modern as for Porsche you have the 1962 winning car and then world championship winning TAG Porsche engine in the mid 1980's I am puzzled by the comment that alludes that somehow Audi might do better than Porsche in F1. I generally would think that both have quite a bit of recent top tier motorsports experience. Including building hybrid engines with very high combustion efficiency. I think the main thing that might have worn on people (myself included) is the perpetual rumor that Porsche is looking to do F1. Which be it Porsche, Audi or VAG in general. Seems to be very true at the moment. Richard |
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5 Nov 2021, 14:09 (Ref:4081628) | #27 | ||
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coming in with two new works teams seems overly ambitious so if they just came in as an engine manu then it would be with one engine with different branding right?
thus their success would be contingent on which team they supply. that begs the question which two teams would/could take on VAG engines? now days, Haas, Williams, Alfa, and Aston require an engine supply that comes with a bunch of other parts so unless VAG is going to be a works team and can supply said parts then those teams cant take a VAG engine on its own. retooling/restaffing under the budget cap makes going back to full constructor status incredibly difficult without overspending the cap (still dont really know what happens if one overspends though). Mclaren will stay with Merc as thats a long term deal iirc. Merc, Alpine, and Ferrari will stay works teams. even if Merc pulls out, they are contractually obligated to be an engine manu for a while so their supply will be around until the next Concorde period i would guess. that just leaves the RB teams and the possibility that VAG comes in as a partner for the RB engine program. and VAG could have tried to make that play before if they wanted to but didnt. why would RB take them on now that RB seem to have gotten the engine rules that suit their needs? even less so if they win a title this year. anyways, like most i await optimistically, but really i am expecting the inevitable VAG statement about how pants F1 is lol. |
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5 Nov 2021, 14:27 (Ref:4081631) | #28 | ||
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It's just my opinion. |
5 Nov 2021, 15:04 (Ref:4081636) | #29 | ||||
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Quote:
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Richard |
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5 Nov 2021, 20:30 (Ref:4081697) | #30 | |
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I could see the purchase of Sauber filling the need,but they have had many years in which such a move would have been feasible. Something makes me think they don't actually want to be pitched into head on competition with the rest,but perhaps an engine supply deal would suit.The Le Mans projects from both were based on a lot of development time in order to arrive at the one race that mattered with a superior car to anybody else.Having to do this every other weekend with a constantly developing car and with very strong opposition is a very different prospect-one that may cause a lot of apprehension within the VAG empire.
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5 Nov 2021, 21:24 (Ref:4081705) | #31 | ||||
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https://www.autosport.com/f1/news/co...-true/6738298/ Quote from Thomas Laudenbach who is head of Porsche motorsports and a VAG representative in the 2026 power unit discussion. The context is Porsche looking for more cost controls than today and how that would increase the potential for Porsche (VAG) to join F1... Quote:
https://www.autosport.com/f1/news/ne...wolff/6740483/ Quote from Toto... Quote:
My guess is that F1/FOM/FIA want VAG so badly (and to a degree so do Mercedes, etc. because if they have top level names to race against, it elevates the series and keeps it alive) that they will do what it takes to get a commitment from VAG for 2026+. They just need to get the right balance to allow VAG to feel they can jump into this and have a chance, while at the same time allowing Mercedes to feel that their experience can continue to give them an advantage. Richard |
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6 Nov 2021, 01:32 (Ref:4081747) | #32 | |
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I hope they don't enter because I think their presence will be an anti-climax.
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6 Nov 2021, 20:02 (Ref:4081844) | #33 | ||
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I don't watch spec cars racing and have no plans to change this.If the company that seems to be the engineering section of the German civil service can't keep up with the pace of development with their massive resources then they need to do some serious introspection. |
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6 Nov 2021, 22:44 (Ref:4081866) | #34 | |
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The TAG turbo was a great engine but only was there for a limited time.
The V12 produced for Arrows was a dud, Focusing on GT and LMP1/2 (remember Penske LMP2) in a singular environment without the constant competitive pressure enables them to take a measured approach to development and to produce some outstanding engineering but I would question their ability to stay 'floating' on the bubble that is constant development in F1 over a long term. In their Indycar entrance during the CART era again the engine was a struggle. We all know Porsche has great engineering and a fantastic Le Mans record but that is a very focused measured environment to compete in where the opposition isn't all jumping around your throat and there is enough time to step back, sum up what you need to do to beat them, and build and develop it unhindered. Working on a tighter schedule and constant evolution by the hour is a different proposition. F1 may be a different ball game and the expense of constant development may not one they have the stomach for in the long term. |
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7 Nov 2021, 10:06 (Ref:4081928) | #35 | ||
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Porsche only ever enter to win.
They would prefer to forget about the V12. I suspect Sauber will become one of the works teams and the other brand will be a ground up job or a PU supplier. |
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28 Dec 2021, 21:43 (Ref:4091599) | #36 | ||
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"We look forward to working with you and your team, to complete this important process and to confirm our Formula 1 entry early next year.”
https://www.bosshunting.com.au/sport...-1-entry-2022/ |
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31 Dec 2021, 10:27 (Ref:4091898) | #37 | ||
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More wetting of our appetites!! Like that.
I am still of the belief that one of the marques will go all in, and the other will be as a PU Partner. Sauber is still my pick for the current outfit that VW or Audi will pick for the 'all in'. With Seidl's very strong links to Weissach, I would put McLaren top of the list for a works PU deal with Porsche. |
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31 Dec 2021, 21:20 (Ref:4091989) | #38 | |||
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1 Jan 2022, 07:59 (Ref:4092046) | #39 | ||
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is the grid capped at 20? do vag have to go in via another team or could they do it themselves as 1tth team?
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1 Jan 2022, 08:03 (Ref:4092047) | #40 | ||
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2 Jan 2022, 16:28 (Ref:4092213) | #41 | ||
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Porsche enthusiasts claim Porsche are finer engineers than Ferrari, yet Porsche Motorsport themselves don't seem to back themselves to enter F1 and do a better job than Ferrari (or Mercedes-Benz or even lowly Alpine)?! |
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2 Jan 2022, 20:11 (Ref:4092233) | #42 | ||
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2 Jan 2022, 20:40 (Ref:4092237) | #43 | ||
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2 Jan 2022, 20:52 (Ref:4092238) | #44 | |||
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Look what Red Bull did with the Honda engine program which was close to a failure before they partnered. In the cost cap era no one is going to be allowed to spend the bottomless pit of money Mercedes have or even the amounts Ferrari have done.I doubt Alpine is the level of success they are aspiring to. If they want their best chance of success ring Christian Horner yesterday.The opinions of “Porsche enthusiasts” are irrelevant. |
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3 Jan 2022, 05:33 (Ref:4092274) | #45 | ||
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Isnt McLaren's Mr Seidl a Porsche alumni?
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3 Jan 2022, 09:30 (Ref:4092282) | #46 | ||
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Indeed... he worked his way from Racing Operations Director to quickly become Team Principal of their LMP1 programme for 5 years prior to joining McLaren.
As an aside he also did a number of years with BMW from 2000, working on their F1 programme until they quit F1 in 2009 when he moved over to run their DTM return. A talented man. |
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3 Jan 2022, 09:52 (Ref:4092283) | #47 | ||
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Again irrelevant to their decision.Agree that Andreas is very talented but that doesn’t mean he will even be at McLaren in 4 years time or that the presence of someone who was running their sports car program 9 years before they come into F1 is any basis for a decision.
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3 Jan 2022, 14:38 (Ref:4092311) | #48 | |
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I don't think Seidl cares about Porsche anymore. He's moved on and cares more about McLaren now. Why would he move back to Porsche now?
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3 Jan 2022, 20:47 (Ref:4092377) | #49 | |||
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Mainly the Red Bull Racing haters who don’t want that deal to happen. |
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4 Jan 2022, 00:33 (Ref:4092402) | #50 | ||
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It's much more to do with how much Porsche were interested in Seidl's move to F1 and/or Mclaren. I strongly suspect they have kept in touch.
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