Home  
Site Partners: SpotterGuides Veloce Books  
Related Sites: Clubmans Rallycross Your Link Here  

Go Back   TenTenths Motorsport Forum > Other Motorsports > Rallying & Rallycross

Reply
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
Old 31 Dec 2023, 13:05 (Ref:4190353)   #26
AndyS
Veteran
 
Join Date: Feb 2010
England
N Yorks
Posts: 941
AndyS should be qualifying in the top 10 on the grid
The issue for me is the use of promoters by the FIA. In its current form it doesn't work. They exist purely to make money. Calling them promoters is misleading as they actually don't seem to do much promoting. They should be called what they are, commercial rights holders. That, in reality, is their sole reason for being, to do deals for the TV coverage, hosting fees and sponsorship to the highest bidder. There is seemingly very little emphasis on the best interests of the sport.

You need it run by people who have the sport as their first and foremost interest. I'm sure there is a reason, but why the FIA don't run their various categories in house I've never understood. Probably the opportunity to make a load of money, I suspect! In House they can still do deals but the best deal for the promotion of the sport, not the annual profit margin. Clearly they can't run it at loss, but equally they don't need to run it to squeeze every last penny out of it.

It's blindingly obvious what needs to change, but whenever they have these reviews, nothing ever changes other than a bit of tinkering round the edges and gimmicks. They only need to look at the aforementioned recent RAC to see how it can be done. Oliver Solberg made the comment about how it worked so well and that the people organising the WRC could learn a lot from it.
AndyS is offline  
Quote
Old 31 Dec 2023, 16:42 (Ref:4190384)   #27
justracing
Veteran
 
justracing's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2010
United Kingdom
West Sussex
Posts: 2,480
justracing should be qualifying in the top 10 on the gridjustracing should be qualifying in the top 10 on the grid
The WRC is heading the same way as the Andros trophy.
justracing is offline  
Quote
Old 1 Jan 2024, 10:33 (Ref:4190493)   #28
flatlandsman
Veteran
 
Join Date: Jul 2023
Ireland
Daventry
Posts: 670
flatlandsman has been held in scrutiny for further testing
Another sad bit of news, the guys running VHS rallies on youtube are calling it time. A great channel adding considerably to our enjoyment and being very careful about what they posted and making sure to do it right. I gather this is just tiredness and also a lack of financial return, but also probably a serious amount of work been done.

Hope it is nothing more sinister than Duke or some arse getting uppity about 40 years footage being free on a social media channel!
flatlandsman is offline  
Quote
Old 2 Jan 2024, 10:01 (Ref:4190581)   #29
Firehawk505
Rookie
 
Join Date: Aug 2022
United States
west coast of the USA
Posts: 23
Firehawk505 should be qualifying in the top 10 on the grid
Points are interesting to ponder, but it's 2am, so I'll wait on that. I'll just say that rallies seem so short now compared to the 70's. I love watching old videos of, say, the Safari Rally, which, IIRC, used to actually be pretty long.
Firehawk505 is offline  
Quote
Old 5 Jan 2024, 21:11 (Ref:4190901)   #30
NaBUru38
Veteran
 
NaBUru38's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2009
Uruguay
Las Canteras, Uruguay
Posts: 10,701
NaBUru38 is going for a new world record!NaBUru38 is going for a new world record!NaBUru38 is going for a new world record!NaBUru38 is going for a new world record!NaBUru38 is going for a new world record!NaBUru38 is going for a new world record!NaBUru38 is going for a new world record!NaBUru38 is going for a new world record!
Quote:
Originally Posted by AndyS View Post
The issue for me is the use of promoters by the FIA. In its current form it doesn't work.

I'm sure there is a reason, but why the FIA don't run their various categories in house I've never understood.
The reason is that the European Union intervened: https://ec.europa.eu/commission/pres...l/en/IP_99_434

Now football is undergoing similar issues: https://curia.europa.eu/jcms/upload/...cp230203en.pdf

The EU is somehow pushing for the North American model, where professional sports teams can join and leave leagues with total freedom.
NaBUru38 is offline  
__________________
Nitropteron - Fly fast or get crushed!
by NaBUrean Prodooktionz
naburu38.itch.io
Quote
Old 6 Jan 2024, 14:05 (Ref:4190935)   #31
ArnageWRC
Racer
 
ArnageWRC's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2012
UK-ROI
Nord Ouest Ingleterre
Posts: 399
ArnageWRC should be qualifying in the top 10 on the grid
Yeah, the FIA had to let go of many series. In reality, governing bodies have no business running series, that's not their remit. Let the 'experts' run, organise, promote series.....(look at the mess with road cycling, where the UCI want control, and are hopeless)

The problem is, Promoters don't seem to do much in the way of promotion - and as already said, just sell TV/ media rights. It's in their interest to have as many rounds in a series as possible, as they get the fees......look at both F1 & MotoGP - adding ever more races.....

The WRC has been appallingly run for 15+ years; too many involved think it's bigger than it actually is.
We first saw this back in the early 00s - 16 rounds in the WRC......Was completely unsustainable.....the expected returns never materialised - and manufacturers left in droves, leaving us with Citroen & M-Sport Ford......
ArnageWRC is offline  
Quote
Old 6 Jan 2024, 14:11 (Ref:4190937)   #32
ArnageWRC
Racer
 
ArnageWRC's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2012
UK-ROI
Nord Ouest Ingleterre
Posts: 399
ArnageWRC should be qualifying in the top 10 on the grid
Quote:
Originally Posted by Firehawk505 View Post
Points are interesting to ponder, but it's 2am, so I'll wait on that. I'll just say that rallies seem so short now compared to the 70's. I love watching old videos of, say, the Safari Rally, which, IIRC, used to actually be pretty long.

That's because they are so short; most are approx 300km - not even 200 miles.
Those at the top of the WRC told us that Endurance style events were no longer relevant in the 21st century. So we get the same generic event all season long....with a Power Stage on Sunday lunch time.

Some events need more freedom to do what they want; I don't have a problem with one or two short events starting on Friday morning, and ending Saturday night.
As long as we can see a proper Monte, with a final night over the Col du Turini, as once happened - and a more challenging Safari.....
ArnageWRC is offline  
Quote
Old 17 Jan 2024, 17:30 (Ref:4192209)   #33
NaBUru38
Veteran
 
NaBUru38's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2009
Uruguay
Las Canteras, Uruguay
Posts: 10,701
NaBUru38 is going for a new world record!NaBUru38 is going for a new world record!NaBUru38 is going for a new world record!NaBUru38 is going for a new world record!NaBUru38 is going for a new world record!NaBUru38 is going for a new world record!NaBUru38 is going for a new world record!NaBUru38 is going for a new world record!
The Monte Carlo Rally entry list has 70 entries.

There's just 8 Rally1 entries:

* Hyundai: Ott Tänak, Andreas Mikkelsen, Thierry Neuville.
* Ford: Sébastien Ogier, Adrien Fourmaux, Grégoire Munster.
* Toyota: Elfyn Evans, Takamoto Katsuta.

There's also 29 entries in Rally2, 7 in Rally3, 12 in RC4, 9 in Rally5, and 5 in RGT.

Last edited by NaBUru38; 17 Jan 2024 at 17:35.
NaBUru38 is offline  
__________________
Nitropteron - Fly fast or get crushed!
by NaBUrean Prodooktionz
naburu38.itch.io
Quote
Old 22 Jan 2024, 14:18 (Ref:4192891)   #34
ArnageWRC
Racer
 
ArnageWRC's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2012
UK-ROI
Nord Ouest Ingleterre
Posts: 399
ArnageWRC should be qualifying in the top 10 on the grid
Quote:
Originally Posted by NaBUru38 View Post
The Monte Carlo Rally entry list has 70 entries.

There's just 8 Rally1 entries:

* Hyundai: Ott Tänak, Andreas Mikkelsen, Thierry Neuville.
* Ford: Sébastien Ogier, Adrien Fourmaux, Grégoire Munster.
* Toyota: Elfyn Evans, Takamoto Katsuta.

There's also 29 entries in Rally2, 7 in Rally3, 12 in RC4, 9 in Rally5, and 5 in RGT.

A sport in rude health........(or maybe not)

And on the same weekend as the Rolex 24 isn't a great idea. Should have been the weekend gone.
ArnageWRC is offline  
Quote
Old 22 Jan 2024, 14:31 (Ref:4192895)   #35
NaBUru38
Veteran
 
NaBUru38's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2009
Uruguay
Las Canteras, Uruguay
Posts: 10,701
NaBUru38 is going for a new world record!NaBUru38 is going for a new world record!NaBUru38 is going for a new world record!NaBUru38 is going for a new world record!NaBUru38 is going for a new world record!NaBUru38 is going for a new world record!NaBUru38 is going for a new world record!NaBUru38 is going for a new world record!
I'm all for avoiding date clashes, but WRC and IMSA (or Formula E) are different worlds.
NaBUru38 is offline  
__________________
Nitropteron - Fly fast or get crushed!
by NaBUrean Prodooktionz
naburu38.itch.io
Quote
Old 22 Jan 2024, 15:32 (Ref:4192904)   #36
E.B
Veteran
 
E.B's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2010
United Kingdom
About 7kms East of Albert Park Melbourne
Posts: 6,520
E.B will be entering the Motorsport Hall of FameE.B will be entering the Motorsport Hall of FameE.B will be entering the Motorsport Hall of FameE.B will be entering the Motorsport Hall of FameE.B will be entering the Motorsport Hall of FameE.B will be entering the Motorsport Hall of FameE.B will be entering the Motorsport Hall of FameE.B will be entering the Motorsport Hall of FameE.B will be entering the Motorsport Hall of Fame
Quote:
Originally Posted by NaBUru38 View Post
The Monte Carlo Rally entry list has 70 entries.

There's just 8 Rally1 entries:

* Hyundai: Ott Tänak, Andreas Mikkelsen, Thierry Neuville.
* Ford: Sébastien Ogier, Adrien Fourmaux, Grégoire Munster.
* Toyota: Elfyn Evans, Takamoto Katsuta.

There's also 29 entries in Rally2, 7 in Rally3, 12 in RC4, 9 in Rally5, and 5 in RGT.

237 entries in the Historic Section according to the ACM Website.:
https://acm.mc/en/edition/26th-rally...nt/entry-list/
E.B is online now  
Quote
Old 22 Jan 2024, 16:10 (Ref:4192906)   #37
ArnageWRC
Racer
 
ArnageWRC's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2012
UK-ROI
Nord Ouest Ingleterre
Posts: 399
ArnageWRC should be qualifying in the top 10 on the grid
Quote:
Originally Posted by NaBUru38 View Post
I'm all for avoiding date clashes, but WRC and IMSA (or Formula E) are different worlds.

Well there was a time they were on consecutive weekends; Vic Elford won both in a Porsche in 1968......

I know which event will be getting the most interest - and it won't be in southern France.
ArnageWRC is offline  
Quote
Old 22 Jan 2024, 19:04 (Ref:4192926)   #38
FIRE
Race Official
Veteran
 
FIRE's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2003
Netherlands
Posts: 18,893
FIRE is going for a new world record!FIRE is going for a new world record!FIRE is going for a new world record!FIRE is going for a new world record!FIRE is going for a new world record!FIRE is going for a new world record!FIRE is going for a new world record!
Quote:
Originally Posted by E.B View Post
237 entries in the Historic Section according to the ACM Website.:
https://acm.mc/en/edition/26th-rally...nt/entry-list/
IMO more interesting than the main class...
FIRE is offline  
Quote
Old 22 Jan 2024, 19:26 (Ref:4192932)   #39
Gerard C
Veteran
 
Gerard C's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2013
France
My place
Posts: 11,330
Gerard C is going for a new world record!Gerard C is going for a new world record!Gerard C is going for a new world record!Gerard C is going for a new world record!Gerard C is going for a new world record!Gerard C is going for a new world record!Gerard C is going for a new world record!
Quote:
Originally Posted by FIRE View Post
IMO more interesting than the main class...
+ 1! Thanks E.B
Gerard C is offline  
__________________
Celui qui est parti de rien pour arriver nulle part,n'a de merci a dire a personne.Pour ceux qui vont chercher midi a quatorze heures, la minute de Vérité risque de se faire attendre longtemps.
Quote
Old 26 Jan 2024, 18:01 (Ref:4193445)   #40
justracing
Veteran
 
justracing's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2010
United Kingdom
West Sussex
Posts: 2,480
justracing should be qualifying in the top 10 on the gridjustracing should be qualifying in the top 10 on the grid
Quote:
Originally Posted by NaBUru38 View Post
The Monte Carlo Rally entry list has 70 entries.

There's just 8 Rally1 entries:

* Hyundai: Ott Tänak, Andreas Mikkelsen, Thierry Neuville.
* Ford: Sébastien Ogier, Adrien Fourmaux, Grégoire Munster.
* Toyota: Elfyn Evans, Takamoto Katsuta.

There's also 29 entries in Rally2, 7 in Rally3, 12 in RC4, 9 in Rally5, and 5 in RGT.
Sorry to correct your normally accurate post but Seb Ogier is a Toyota driver albeit part time this year as is Kali Rovanpera in selected events I believe.
Tremendous start on Thursday night for Evans, some of the night footage revealed strong spectator support with flares and fireworks, not seen this level of spectators at the Monte for years.
justracing is offline  
Quote
Old 26 Jan 2024, 18:43 (Ref:4193448)   #41
justracing
Veteran
 
justracing's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2010
United Kingdom
West Sussex
Posts: 2,480
justracing should be qualifying in the top 10 on the gridjustracing should be qualifying in the top 10 on the grid
A couple of icy sections on the early stages today caught out Tanak and Katsuta dropping them well down the order, Neuville and Seb had strong stage finishes on Friday to close down the slim lead of Elfyn Evans. On dry roads clear of snow and virtually ice free the pace of the top runners is pretty damn quick! Really strong spectator support again on Friday's daylight stages, I'm always amazed at their level of commitment, I've only ever attended one pukka rally and it took me all day and lot of legwork to 3 stages, these spectators are from a different planet!
justracing is offline  
Quote
Old 26 Jan 2024, 19:36 (Ref:4193459)   #42
AndyS
Veteran
 
Join Date: Feb 2010
England
N Yorks
Posts: 941
AndyS should be qualifying in the top 10 on the grid
Really hoping Evans does it this year and wins the title. If it's not to be then I'd prefer it to be a Hyundai just for the sake of variety if nothing else.
AndyS is offline  
Quote
Old 27 Jan 2024, 16:06 (Ref:4193553)   #43
NaBUru38
Veteran
 
NaBUru38's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2009
Uruguay
Las Canteras, Uruguay
Posts: 10,701
NaBUru38 is going for a new world record!NaBUru38 is going for a new world record!NaBUru38 is going for a new world record!NaBUru38 is going for a new world record!NaBUru38 is going for a new world record!NaBUru38 is going for a new world record!NaBUru38 is going for a new world record!NaBUru38 is going for a new world record!
Quote:
Originally Posted by justracing View Post
Sorry to correct your normally accurate post but Seb Ogier is a Toyota driver albeit part time this year as is Kali Rovanpera in selected events I believe.
Oops! I was too busy copying and pasting that I forgot to read...
NaBUru38 is offline  
__________________
Nitropteron - Fly fast or get crushed!
by NaBUrean Prodooktionz
naburu38.itch.io
Quote
Old 28 Jan 2024, 17:08 (Ref:4193919)   #44
Gerard C
Veteran
 
Gerard C's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2013
France
My place
Posts: 11,330
Gerard C is going for a new world record!Gerard C is going for a new world record!Gerard C is going for a new world record!Gerard C is going for a new world record!Gerard C is going for a new world record!Gerard C is going for a new world record!Gerard C is going for a new world record!
Final classification gives: Thierry Neuville/ Hyundai, Sébastien Ogier/ Toyota and Elfyn Evans/ Toyota.
Yohan Rossel/ Citroën C3 WRC2 category winner.
Gerard C is offline  
__________________
Celui qui est parti de rien pour arriver nulle part,n'a de merci a dire a personne.Pour ceux qui vont chercher midi a quatorze heures, la minute de Vérité risque de se faire attendre longtemps.
Quote
Old 23 Feb 2024, 08:15 (Ref:4197874)   #45
cg7aa
Veteran
 
Join Date: Oct 2003
Location:
London
Posts: 1,277
cg7aa should be qualifying in the top 10 on the grid
Hello rally fans, it's been a while. How are we all doing?

I caught up with the action from Sweden yesterday; the conditions reminded me of rally Sweden from the early to mid-2000s. It looked fantastic so that even when the overall winner was more or less guaranteed I didn't mind so much.

The stage name '#42 Brattby' is such a classy tribute to Craig Breen, whomever thought of it should be congratulated. I'm looking forward to the fan 'pure sounds' footage on YouTube. Should be awesome.

Going further back in time to the Monte, Neuville's speed was just staggering. Has any Hyundai driver ever had such confidence in the car? That must have been the sweetest of sweet spots in terms of car setup, driver feel, pace notes, the lot. He was untouchable really.
cg7aa is offline  
Quote
Old 24 Feb 2024, 11:42 (Ref:4198068)   #46
ArnageWRC
Racer
 
ArnageWRC's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2012
UK-ROI
Nord Ouest Ingleterre
Posts: 399
ArnageWRC should be qualifying in the top 10 on the grid
Second placed Evans gets more points than winner Lappi.........Tells you everything about the current WRC......
ArnageWRC is offline  
Quote
Old 24 Feb 2024, 12:40 (Ref:4198075)   #47
AndyS
Veteran
 
Join Date: Feb 2010
England
N Yorks
Posts: 941
AndyS should be qualifying in the top 10 on the grid
Just caught up on the coverage this morning. Stages looked fantastic and back the Rally Sweden of old. Superb performance by Lappi and Formeaux (not sure that's spelt right!). Title chase already looks interesting.
AndyS is offline  
Quote
Old 26 Feb 2024, 09:26 (Ref:4198298)   #48
BertMk2
Race Official
Veteran
 
BertMk2's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2003
United Kingdom
Nr Maidstone, Kent
Posts: 10,328
BertMk2 is going for a new world record!BertMk2 is going for a new world record!BertMk2 is going for a new world record!BertMk2 is going for a new world record!BertMk2 is going for a new world record!BertMk2 is going for a new world record!BertMk2 is going for a new world record!BertMk2 is going for a new world record!
Quote:
Originally Posted by cg7aa View Post
Hello rally fans, it's been a while. How are we all doing?
Welcome back

Quote:
Originally Posted by cg7aa View Post
I caught up with the action from Sweden yesterday; the conditions reminded me of rally Sweden from the early to mid-2000s. It looked fantastic so that even when the overall winner was more or less guaranteed I didn't mind so much.
Quote:
Originally Posted by AndyS View Post
Just caught up on the coverage this morning. Stages looked fantastic and back the Rally Sweden of old.
Agreed - the conditions looked really good this year and the snowbanks were there in all their glory. It looked like the stages held up pretty well so we didn't see the problems with them cutting up really badly like they have done in recent years.

Quote:
Originally Posted by cg7aa View Post
Going further back in time to the Monte, Neuville's speed was just staggering. Has any Hyundai driver ever had such confidence in the car? That must have been the sweetest of sweet spots in terms of car setup, driver feel, pace notes, the lot. He was untouchable really.
Before the event I assumed Ogier would just disappear into the distance and win with ease. Neuville certainly looked to have the car hooked up all weekend, it seemed to be one of those weekends where everything came together for him.

Quote:
Originally Posted by ArnageWRC View Post
Second placed Evans gets more points than winner Lappi.........Tells you everything about the current WRC......
Quote:
Originally Posted by AndyS View Post
Superb performance by Lappi and Formeaux (not sure that's spelt right!). Title chase already looks interesting.
The points system is certainly odd, there's no way the event winner should be leaving with less point than anyone else. Pleased for Lappi to get the win though, enjoyed his stage end interviews as well Formeaux had a great event too - I must admit I don't really have high expectations of him but he certainly put in a good drive and took advantage of others failings to pick up a strong result. A little bit gutted for Katsuta, he was quick in Sweden last year and had good pace again this year, he looked to be on for a great result until a small error took him into the snowbank. On the flip side Rovanpera never really looked like he got into the groove at all, he even described his own driving as "embarassing" at one point.

Sweden is probably my favourite rally of the season and it certainly delivered again this year. The only real downside is the lack of depth in the Rally1 field, a couple of retirements and it all looks a bit thin at the front.
BertMk2 is offline  
Quote
Old 28 Feb 2024, 17:38 (Ref:4198685)   #49
cg7aa
Veteran
 
Join Date: Oct 2003
Location:
London
Posts: 1,277
cg7aa should be qualifying in the top 10 on the grid
Quote:
Originally Posted by ArnageWRC View Post
Second placed Evans gets more points than winner Lappi.........Tells you everything about the current WRC......
Well, yes and no. I'm not overly keen on the new points system and the old points system was the least of the WRC's problems at the top end! It's tinkering around the edges of a championship which is in a precarious position however spectacular the top bunch of cars are: one of the two and a bit bona fide manufacturer's pulls out and that's a dead championship but I digress massively!

Back on topic, the overall winner does have the option of pushing for the points too it must be remembered. Circumstances and choice might prevent that but there's nothing stopping them in theory. Evans wasn't simply handed the points on a plate. He drove for it. I remember going to rally Finland in 2007 and being disappointed by the driving in the top class on the Sunday. The podium position drivers had no need to push and so they didn't, they just drive through which for me as a spectator was dull.

There you go, my two cents...

Last edited by cg7aa; 28 Feb 2024 at 17:45.
cg7aa is offline  
Quote
Old 17 Mar 2024, 14:44 (Ref:4201660)   #50
Tel 911S
Veteran
 
Join Date: Mar 2013
Posts: 1,081
Tel 911S should be qualifying in the top 10 on the gridTel 911S should be qualifying in the top 10 on the grid
Found a program on TV last night called Sport Stuff TV .
Had the ARCTIC LAPLAND rally on , so had to watch it .
It was from February . Very fast stages in snow with high snow banks and quite a good event .
Not an event I have ever done .
When I was doing European Championship events a few years ago I avoided winter rallies as they were too cold and needed very good knowledge of studded tyres
.Although I was offered a very good deal to do some . Which included the use of a heated underground garage while there . It was then I worked out that the diesel service van fuel would freeze up if left outside overnight .

So never did any Winter rallies , but watching last night I thought it was a very good event and thought I should have had a go .
Tel 911S is offline  
Quote
Reply


Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off

Forum Jump

Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
2024 RVSC Silly Season (With Poll) Jack65 Australasian Touring Cars. 360 24 Oct 2024 13:33
[LM24] Le Mans 2024 - 15/16 June 2024 - Who is Going? Aysedasi 24 Heures du Mans 660 17 Jun 2024 15:06
IMSA What future for Sebring after 2023 or 2024? Speed-King North American Racing 37 30 Mar 2022 19:01
No Factory GT teams starting 2024 C6R Racing Fan ACO Regulated Series 26 24 Aug 2021 01:28
Historic Road Rallying/ Endurance Rallying andy97 Rallying & Rallycross 1 26 Feb 2009 13:56


All times are GMT. The time now is 17:26.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.11
Copyright ©2000 - 2024, vBulletin Solutions Inc.
Original Website Copyright © 1998-2003 Craig Antil. All Rights Reserved.
Ten-Tenths Motorsport Forums Copyright © 2004-2021 Royalridge Computing. All Rights Reserved.
Ten-Tenths Motorsport Forums Copyright © 2021-2022 Grant MacDonald. All Rights Reserved.