Arrows - Down the pan????Rumoured demise of Team (Merged) - Page 2

rdjones · 4 Jul 2002, 15:50 (Ref:327136)

Well it sounds they are in real trouble, BBC Sport Online are reporting that the cars are still at Leafield and look like going noware.

philmann · 4 Jul 2002, 15:51 (Ref:327139)

Financial problems top and bottom of the grid? Fags going away? Tech companies no money?

->Premier1 anyone??

;-)

**Peter Mallett** · 4 Jul 2002, 15:54 (Ref:327143)

If they don't make it will they be fined by the FIA for non-appearence?

Also and this is a bit off the wall, what if the group that was buying Prost were to rescue Arrows after they go pop for a lesser price than a going concern? Then they'd get into F1 and have the assets of a going concern. Just a thought you understand.

**Peter Mallett** · 4 Jul 2002, 15:55 (Ref:327145)

Well its back down there again.

philmann · 4 Jul 2002, 16:00 (Ref:327149)

From www.autosport.com -

"The team missed scrutineering at 1600 (BST) and has applied for an extension to allow it to get the cars to the track. But there are now serious doubts that Arrows will be able to participate in this weekend's GP. And that would have massive ramifications for the rest of the season. Arrows would face a huge fine for missing a race of the world championship."

So, yes it sounds like they would be fined - which doesm't exactly help matters - and to think, Orange had a mock up of the Arrows car at Liverpool Street Staion this week offering free tickets to Silverstone in a lucky dip!! Hoe do you say "egg on your face?"

;-)

philmann · 4 Jul 2002, 16:01 (Ref:327151)

ps - excuse the spelling!!

LucaBadoer · 4 Jul 2002, 16:01 (Ref:327153)

I Arrows are gonna go

, then why dont Jag buy their chassis?

**Spudgun** · 4 Jul 2002, 16:11 (Ref:327160)

Although IMO I think Homer Simpson could run an F1 team better than Tom Walkinshaw, I really hope they don't go bust. This is getting bad. Two teams going down within months of eachother?

But then on the other hand I think he is trying to run before he can walk. Effectively going back on Jos' contract to hire 'a proven race winner.' This isn't aimed at Frentzen, but wouldn't it be an idea to have a competitive car first? Now because of his business practices/decisions he's got legal cases coming out of his ears.

Now for my next rant:

This is more general and might help Arrows despite of Tom.

As I keep saying, give the teams more TV money!!!

There's lots of people making money on the commercial rights alone who don't give a stuff about the sport. It's the teams that make all this possible.

I can imagine them right now. They don't care. The TV rights have been sold for the next 'x' years. Their pockets have been lined.

As far as I'm aware, the total money dished out to all the teams is way way way down in percentage terms.

What is it going to take to make the FIA sit up and realise that if they don't do something half the grid are going to go down the pan?

I had to get this off my chest. End of Rant.

steve nielsen · 4 Jul 2002, 16:37 (Ref:327178)

there are 3 problems for Arrows: the Morgan Grenfell court case, the Jos Verstappen court case and they have to pay Cosworth 4 million $.(BTW: there is also a court case going on between TW and Mike Coughlan who wants to leave for Mclaren)

It could'nt have happened to a nicer bloke!

(although I feel sorry for all the others employed by Arrows)

Jordi · 4 Jul 2002, 16:38 (Ref:327179)

Poor Frentzen... He was at Prost and Prost went... He's at Arrows and Arrows is about to go...

EERO · 4 Jul 2002, 16:41 (Ref:327183)

Well summarized, Super T.

The fact is, F1 has been oblivious to the downturn in the world Financial Markets and the harsh reality has caught up with them this season. Too bad for Arrows, but TW hasn't seemed to be able to do any more for them than Jackie Oliver or Footwork did. As a name they haven't amounted to much, but as Suzy reminds us, they are people not so different from us.

Sato san · 4 Jul 2002, 17:57 (Ref:327207)

Just read it on Autosport site.

What a shame if they do miss the GP , or future ones , this years chassis is the best theyve produced .

AUTOSPORT says ....The Arrows transporters are in place in the Silverstone paddock for this weekend's British Grand Prix, but the garage doors are closed.

The team missed scrutineering at 1600 (BST), but it has been granted an extension until 1000 (BST) tomorrow morning to present its cars. But there are now serious doubts that Arrows will be able to participate in this weekend's GP. And that would have massive ramifications for the rest of the season. Arrows would face a huge fine for missing a race of the world championship.

Still..i bet Steve Nielsen is happy !

Sodemo · 4 Jul 2002, 18:16 (Ref:327211)

Yes! I too saw a mock - up Arrows at Paddington Station, had a chat to one of the Orange girlies, though she didn't seem interesting in talking, just trying to make me fill in one of their cards...

Poor Arrows, having only 20 cars on the grid is looking a bit desperate and to think at the start of the year we were looking at a 24 car grid...

Don K · 4 Jul 2002, 18:43 (Ref:327225)

Quote:

Originally posted by Sato san
Still..i bet Steve Nielsen is happy !

I doubt it.
It means that Verstappen won't get his money, even if he were to win this weeks court case.
And it also means that Verstappen will have to face more drivers all struggling to get into a decreased number of seats for the 2003 season.

Speedworx · 4 Jul 2002, 19:36 (Ref:327248)

Seems the cars have arrived at Silverstone.

**Spudgun** · 4 Jul 2002, 19:39 (Ref:327250)

Hmmm.. I'm wondering if this has anything to do with Phoenix.

Walkinshaw was rumoured to be linked with the whole thing by supplying technical expertise to the so-called 'team'.

Is Walkinshaw more involved than everybody thinks? Perhaps he invested in Phoenix and since all the bust up is a bit short of cash. The reason I say this is under normal circumstances, surely he would have known the financial situation at the start of the year. He would have know the legal position with Jos.

To be this short of cash when we're nowhere near the end of the season, he surely must have seen some signs in the winter. So why did he sign Frentzen and not another pay-driver?

Are there any skeletons in Tom's cupboard?

Speedworx · 4 Jul 2002, 19:41 (Ref:327253)

Its mainly because he hasn't paid Cosworth, they won't give him any engines.

Sodemo · 4 Jul 2002, 19:49 (Ref:327258)

I wonder if they still have those Aisatechs kicking around somewhere?

Maybe Walkinshaw should try sending Lauda some flowers? that may help

903cc · 4 Jul 2002, 19:57 (Ref:327262)

It is all very clear why TW was blocking Minardi's claim to money. it seems TW just as motivated as PS. Many people on this forum should eat their words about Paul ...

Yoong Montoya · 4 Jul 2002, 20:04 (Ref:327265)

Quote:

Originally posted by The Monster
I wonder if they still have those Aisatechs kicking around somewhere?

No, Minardi have those now.

Sato san · 4 Jul 2002, 20:05 (Ref:327269)

Quote:

Originally posted by Don K
I doubt it.
It means that Verstappen won't get his money, even if he were to win this weeks court case.
.

Thats a good point , i hadnt thought about that , thats a double whammy for Jos then .

Niki Lauda has given Arrows boss Tom Walkinshaw a deadline of tomorrow morning to settle his debt for the team's supply of Cosworth engines.

So that means that they have got to get passed by scrutineering as well as get the money they owe to Cosworth by Tomorrow 11 am .

Tristan · 4 Jul 2002, 20:08 (Ref:327271)

903: of course this was the case. We all knew Arrows was after the money. I must admit, I am very suprised it has come to this. They just don't have the money to buy the engines. What about Orange?? What about this company the British teams have set up?? I can't see them missing this race, for it'd be suicide for them to even contemplate it.

NiceGuyEddie · 4 Jul 2002, 20:12 (Ref:327276)

Walkinshaw has said many times before that the costs in F1 have reached ridiculous high levels over the past eight years. The financial base of Arrows shouldnt be that wobbly, having two major sponsors (Orange and RedBull), but apperantly it is. If the lawyers are correct, it will be a miracle of Arrows makes it to the grid this weekend. So they probably won't.

F1 is really taking a real leap for the worse.

Yoong Montoya · 4 Jul 2002, 22:04 (Ref:327346)

I always thought Minardi would retire from F1 before Arrows. If this rumour proves true, I stand corrected. But if Arrows do go bust, where will Frentzen and Bernoldi go? Would they be forced to retire from F1 without even finishing the 2002 season? If they were, it would be a great shame.

**Adam43** · 4 Jul 2002, 22:14 (Ref:327355)

YM, it would be a great shame. Frentzen is driving well and Bernoldi is not doing to bad (overtook Michael, briefly, in Malaysia). Arrows also have a pretty decent car this year too and they are putting some bigger teams to shame.

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