Helmets - Open Face or not? - Page 2

skentellytubby · 17 Oct 2010, 13:05 (Ref:2776141)

It's easy to look 'right' with regards overalls and boots and be legal/safe. Various people make nice retro stuff. OMP have a whole range.

But helmets - totally different. Personally I'm not a fan of the bright white full faces most people wear, but there isn't a lot of choice is there?

Although open faced helmets look good (eg Richard Attwood, especially with the scarf and goggles), personally I wouldn't wear an open face in an open cockpit car, but you'd think someone would design something of some sort that looks the part in a <70's open car.

Even the open faced jobs look very modern. Even if someone could design something how many would Arai or Bell sell? OMP's Ghibli open faced jobs look much more like the right thing but I've never seen anyone wearing one.

terence · 17 Oct 2010, 15:35 (Ref:2776178)

Quote:

Originally Posted by John Turner

Nope. Sir Stirling was given special dispensation to wear his original type helmet as it is part of the 'Stirling Moss' image and trademark. He has, I'm sure, signed a clause accepting liability for doing so. His is a 'one off' and unsurprisingly a special special case; a living legend and national treasure. Sorry, but I don't think anyone else is likely to qualify!

You are correct John,after years of lobbying,the MSA gave in as long as the paperwork was signed.

grantp · 17 Oct 2010, 19:20 (Ref:2776251)

Quote:

Originally Posted by John Turner

Nope. Sir Stirling was given special dispensation to wear his original type helmet as it is part of the 'Stirling Moss' image and trademark. He has, I'm sure, signed a clause accepting liability for doing so. His is a 'one off' and unsurprisingly a special special case; a living legend and national treasure. Sorry, but I don't think anyone else is likely to qualify!

John I agree - there can't tbe too many drivers still active from that era!

However if the idea of a faux openface helmet were to take off, so to speak, I see no reason why they should not be a mandated requirement. Heck, the cars are often valued at huge amounts yet are risked on track so I really cannot see the driver baulking at a few quid extra for some highly personalised pseudo openface design helmets when the primary reason for doing so is to ensure they are fully protected, in terms of head protection, and the historic 'brand' is more specifically and accurately preserved. That would surely add to the value would it not?

I do agree that the Stirling Moss 'brand' is entirely unique though I note tha t so was Winston Churchill and his cigar but that does not stop people attempting to airbrush the cigar form history.

zefarelly · 17 Oct 2010, 19:38 (Ref:2776265)

ROOF did a flip up full/open face skid lid for old mods and the like a few years ago . . .. f***ing naff is the polite way to describe it, I doubt it was strong and you looked like a BBC TV presenter

like everything 'safety' related, its a personal choice . . I'll wear a cork/leather soup bowl style riding a vintage lambretta round town approaching bicycle pace, but anything nearing coiffure disrupting speed, in, or on anything and I'll do my best to avoid a visit to the dentist!!!

midgetman · 17 Oct 2010, 20:30 (Ref:2776290)

Professionally speaking, I think wearing an o/f helmet in any car is daft. In an accident there's all sorts flying around even a closed cockpit.

Zef, many years back my mate had an accident on his Fizzie - barely any faster than your putt-putt - and slid down the road on his tinted visor. If he'd been wearing an o/f that would have been his face. He was ugly enough to start with.

Look I'm all for period authenticity but we killed/hurt a hell of a lot of good blokes in the "good old days", it's a good job we're not going back there.

Sorry for the surfeit of "goods".

marc sproule · 18 Oct 2010, 03:35 (Ref:2776413)

Gordon Johncock had a rather extreme version of a full-face helmet at one point........

http://www.flickr.com/photos/4668198...7623311357576/

http://www.flickr.com/photos/4668198...7623311357576/

http://www.flickr.com/photos/4668198...7623311357576/

There were others who also had smaller openings. At the moment I have only these of Tom Sneva and Kevin Cogan in my flickr uploads...

Sneva....

http://www.flickr.com/photos/4668198...7623311357576/

Cogan.....

http://www.flickr.com/photos/4668198...7623311357576/

I have a number of other shots with helmets featured fairly prominently in this set......

http://www.flickr.com/photos/4668198...7623311357576/

Eventually there will be a lot more helmet-centric images in this set.

zefarelly · 18 Oct 2010, 08:14 (Ref:2776494)

Quote:

Originally Posted by marc sproule

Gordon Johncock had a rather extreme version of a full-face helmet at one point........

http://www.flickr.com/photos/4668198...7623311357576/.

Is that one from the 'Bell Taliban' series?

**John Turner** · 18 Oct 2010, 08:20 (Ref:2776495)

Is it my eyesight or does it not even protect his chin?

Incidentally, I'm not sure a period style helmet has much mileage given that some historic racers are using HANS devices. The number using them is surely set to increase thus rendering the visual effect of an old style helmet (albeit made with modern materials to a modern spec) superfluous, surely?

skentellytubby · 18 Oct 2010, 09:15 (Ref:2776535)

Quote:

Originally Posted by midgetman

Professionally speaking, I think wearing an o/f helmet in any car is daft. In an accident there's all sorts flying around even a closed cockpit.

I can totally see your point, but I have tried f/f helmets in a closed cockpit car and find it very disorientating. Mind you, having looked at photos that have been taken of me while on track a full face may be a good idea...

grantp · 18 Oct 2010, 10:07 (Ref:2776566)

Quote:

Originally Posted by John Turner

Is it my eyesight or does it not even protect his chin?

Incidentally, I'm not sure a period style helmet has much mileage given that some historic racers are using HANS devices. The number using them is surely set to increase thus rendering the visual effect of an old style helmet (albeit made with modern materials to a modern spec) superfluous, surely?

I think the Kevin Cogan picture sums up the design thinking. With a very reclined seating position the drivers probably thought a deep chin was not a great idea but the flame proof(ish) curtain fixed to the bottom was OK. The very narrow slots were quite typical of early full face helmets, especially Bell iirc, and were likely related to fire protection as as well as strength concerns.

I fear you could be right about the HANS devices, though there are still a number of cars out there that compete without rollover protection thus making the use of HANS moot or perhaps even more dangerous.

We need a second campaign - enhanced HANS devices with disguise to go with the Historic psuedo Open Face helmets!

SAMD · 18 Oct 2010, 11:18 (Ref:2776598)

Quote:

Originally Posted by grantp

We need a second campaign - enhanced HANS devices with disguise to go with the Historic psuedo Open Face helmets!

SZRacer · 18 Oct 2010, 12:58 (Ref:2776637)

How about painting the HANS the same colour as your race suit, thus giving the appearance that you've been shoulder-pressing 100kg for years...

Ahh, how funny this all must seem to racers of the '30s to the '70s - Or, er, at least it would do, if most of them hadn't been killed 'in combat'!!

Reminds me of the equipment advice given by Piero Taruffi in his book on race driving - a stout sweater, with waxed cotton sewn on to the shoulders for rain protection, and a pair of trousers with pockets sewn on above the knees. Oh, don't forget some goggles!

<Sigh!> When I told my 4-year old that Taruffi was known as 'The Silver Fox', he thought he was a character from Batman..the youth of today, eh??

Quote:

Originally Posted by grantp

We need a second campaign - enhanced HANS devices with disguise to go with the Historic psuedo Open Face helmets!

marc sproule · 18 Oct 2010, 14:34 (Ref:2776689)

Quote:

Originally Posted by zefarelly

Is that one from the 'Bell Taliban' series?

You are correct. Specifically it's the Burqa model.

SAMD · 18 Oct 2010, 14:39 (Ref:2776691)

[QUOTE=SZRacer;2776637]How about painting the HANS the same colour as your race suit, thus giving the appearance that you've been shoulder-pressing 100kg for years...

If that is what shoulder pressing 100kgs makes one look like.. I would stop immediately.

marc sproule · 23 Mar 2012, 20:48 (Ref:3047260)

I've created a set devoted solely to helmets that's now in my flickr sets.....

http://www.flickr.com/photos/4668198...7629543841653/

All my sets....

http://www.flickr.com/photos/46681980@N03/sets/

HRSTR5 · 24 Mar 2012, 08:00 (Ref:3047401)

Just received my new helmet and HANS, after my recent 'exploits' you might all excuse me buying all the modern kit despite racing a 1960 FJ... Destroying a helmet whilst one's head is inside it focuses the mind!

Anyway, always wanted a painted helmet, not some garish modern design, just want to incorporate some elements such as Cross of St George and something my father's favourite period GP driver had, and if possible kind of disguise the modern helmet. Anyone got any suggestions who I might talk to for that?

I think I recall hearing that Ben Mitchell does this stuff, can anyone corroborate that or know where to find him?

I have no idea how much money is involved either, it may be madness to even consider it taking into account the rebuild costs I'm up for on the Lotus 18...

rogerwills · 24 Mar 2012, 14:57 (Ref:3047499)

Quote:

Originally Posted by HRSTR5

Just received my new helmet and HANS, after my recent 'exploits' you might all excuse me buying all the modern kit despite racing a 1960 FJ... Destroying a helmet whilst one's head is inside it focuses the mind!

Anyway, always wanted a painted helmet, not some garish modern design, just want to incorporate some elements such as Cross of St George and something my father's favourite period GP driver had, and if possible kind of disguise the modern helmet. Anyone got any suggestions who I might talk to for that?

I think I recall hearing that Ben Mitchell does this stuff, can anyone corroborate that or know where to find him?

I have no idea how much money is involved either, it may be madness to even consider it taking into account the rebuild costs I'm up for on the Lotus 18...

Jason at JLF is fantastic:

http://www.jlfdesigns.com

I think the simple designs are a couple of hundred quid and more complex around 400-500.

compte deGraves · 24 Mar 2012, 15:28 (Ref:3047510)

Quote:

Originally Posted by HRSTR5

Just received my new helmet and HANS, after my recent 'exploits' you might all excuse me buying all the modern kit despite racing a 1960 FJ... Destroying a helmet whilst one's head is inside it focuses the mind!

Anyway, always wanted a painted helmet, not some garish modern design, just want to incorporate some elements such as Cross of St George and something my father's favourite period GP driver had, and if possible kind of disguise the modern helmet. Anyone got any suggestions who I might talk to for that?

I think I recall hearing that Ben Mitchell does this stuff, can anyone corroborate that or know where to find him?

I have no idea how much money is involved either, it may be madness to even consider it taking into account the rebuild costs I'm up for on the Lotus 18...

James, Iain sorted out the painting of my helmet for me with a chap he knows. Simple design but I was really happy with the cost and the quality of the work.

Rudernst · 24 Mar 2012, 18:20 (Ref:3047568)

Quote:

Originally Posted by compte deGraves

James, Iain sorted out the painting of my helmet for me with a chap he knows. Simple design but I was really happy with the cost and the quality of the work.

Hibberds do mine
price and work ok

Rudolf

barnettracing · 25 Mar 2012, 08:40 (Ref:3047767)

Steve at SFX Designs did mine for a very reasonable price. The quality was superb. JLF is excellent if a little expensive compared to everyone else (and his waiting list is often very long).

Rudernst · 25 Mar 2012, 13:54 (Ref:3047995)

Quote:

Originally Posted by barnettracing

Steve at SFX Designs did mine for a very reasonable price. The quality was superb. JLF is excellent if a little expensive compared to everyone else (and his waiting list is often very long).

My little 5 year old son does a nice line of watercolour easter egg painting.
He also does racing helmets in watercolour and does not charge a lot, rarely more than than the equivalent of a Mars bar but a smile and little prezzie on top is always appreciated.
The quality of the work is outstanding !

There is no waiting list, just drop in for while-U-wait service, turnaroud time usually less than one hour.

Rudolf

R D P · 26 Mar 2012, 07:17 (Ref:3048488)

Rudolf - I need your address !
Since I do need my new helmet (yet unpainted) around Easter that would be a good idea....

Ralf

**Peter Mallett** · 26 Mar 2012, 10:25 (Ref:3048596)

I had my new Bell helmet finished in white, just to be different.

SAMD · 26 Mar 2012, 15:45 (Ref:3048866)

Quote:

Originally Posted by Peter Mallett

I had my new Bell helmet finished in white, just to be different.

JimW · 26 Mar 2012, 17:11 (Ref:3048908)

I seem to remember that there was a Bell with just two eyeholes. Anyone got an image of that?

Jim

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