Outrage? Or Not? Your Comments on the ACO's Entry List - Page 2

kdr · 27 Mar 2003, 16:42 (Ref:550139)

i know the morgan looked strange...but the bmw m3 looks like an etcc car!

wasn't there nearly 100 entries a few years ago? plus the fact that the race is run on public roads makes a lot of difference to a normal race.

Nordic · 27 Mar 2003, 17:02 (Ref:550163)

I think the Morgan should have been on the list, even as a reserve.
It looks unlikey that any other MGs where entered, and as Dyson pulled out that does just leave the one car, so it is possible that all the proposed MG's are in!
I agree with KDR that while the BMW is fast it has no place in a sports car race, if BMW wanted to enter a Z8 or Z3......

On balance I would rather the A.C.O contine to pick the list and ensure that the teams are able to prepare better. We just have to expect a few 'friends' get the invite from the A.C.O.

Mal · 27 Mar 2003, 17:16 (Ref:550183)

The entry is not entirely subjective as there are a number of entries based on Merit, such and the previous years winners in each class and, I think, the winners of Petit LeMans in each class.

kdr · 27 Mar 2003, 17:20 (Ref:550187)

[QUOTE]Originally posted by Nordic
[B]I think the Morgan should have been on the list, even as a reserve.
It looks unlikey that any other MGs where entered, and as Dyson pulled out that does just leave the one car, so it is possible that all the proposed MG's are in!
I agree with KDR that while the BMW is fast it has no place in a sports car race, if BMW wanted to enter a Z8 or Z3......

or an lmr v12...

**Aysedasi** · 27 Mar 2003, 17:20 (Ref:550188)

I agree with you Mal. There's an old saying, of course, "You can't please all the people all the time.....".

And as for the BMW M3, I really can't be bothered to post what I think about this Touring Car again....

rdjones · 27 Mar 2003, 17:44 (Ref:550214)

This is my take on the MG situation. The RML car and the Chamberlian car where never going to happen. Out of the 2 the one that was most likly to happen was the RML one, I say that after reading the article in Autosport today. Where they linked Jason Plato to the drive. Now from what I understand only 5 MG EX257 where built, Dyson have 2, Intersport have 1 and not sure where the other 2 are. IMO what has happen is MG have cut there motorsport budget and the finance could not be raised to enter them, after all RML did enter one at Sebring and pull out at the last minute.

As for the Morgan, I just do not understand that, the car was the star of the show last year for me. The only reason why it didn't get is because they pull there Sebring entry at the last minute and for some reason the ACO did not like this. It should be there, it's not and that is a real shame, hopefully they will come back in 2004

Fab · 27 Mar 2003, 17:48 (Ref:550221)

The title of the thread is 'outrage or not'... so let's talk !

Outrages for me are :
- no Morgan
- only one MG
- Norma entry
- two WR (Ok for one, but two ?)
- the Halliday Durango (I'd prefer the Taurus Lola)
- Eight Porsches in GT

The good things are :
- two RFH Domes
- the Lister is here
- the new Courage C65
- the Spyker (two could have been better)
- the Maranellos, and the GT class

Let's face it : it will be a 'year between'. Nice LMP 900 class, but not so exciting, with old Panozes, old Rileys, Courage not at the top, Courage Evo (did they improved ?)... 't will be a VAG race again, but with a real battle between private teams : there is the race in the lead for me. LMP 675 class is dead, ACO killed it in not letting the MGs coming.

So : a good LMP 900 race, a real GTS battle, a Porsche cup in GT, and a 'decorative' LMP675...

Le Mans is Le Mans ! Gentlemen, start your engines

And TTenthers, let's enjoy !

KA · 27 Mar 2003, 17:49 (Ref:550224)

Quote:

Originally posted by Tim Northcutt
[B]My Thoughts:

Although tradition says "invites & alternates," why not do what American racing does?

Let all 76 entrants come to Le Mans for a week in May instead of the few PQ days...

Set a given number, or an approximate number, of "accepted slots" for GT and GTS numbers that will be part of the 50 who will ultimately race...

Make EVERYBODY qualify for the "List of 50" to come back in June..based on set qualifying sessions the last 2-3 days of the week....

That's not a million miles away from what they did a few years ago anyway- it's definitely a much better idea, as I can't see any kind of logic to whatever criteria they currently use....

Quote:

Was Knighthawk one of them?

Didn't Knighthawk sell their MG to Dyson?

Tim Northcutt · 27 Mar 2003, 18:38 (Ref:550285)

I don't know...so much has happened ove rthe last winter, that they could have done exactly that...

kdr · 27 Mar 2003, 18:46 (Ref:550300)

did morgan enter...or did the team put all their eggs in the tvr basket?

am i right that its the same team that would have entered both cars? help!

Tim Northcutt · 27 Mar 2003, 18:49 (Ref:550303)

To Mal:

I do agree that "some" were selected on merit, but Team Sezio, Lister, the Pilbeam in 675 don't have a lot of Merit to show for this list (at least thus far)...

NOTE: Lister ought to be on the list, only because it is a new chassis with a lot of promise, and a new chassis needs to sort the bugs out and have some time to overcome the growing pains that all builders face...

Liz · 28 Mar 2003, 00:44 (Ref:550625)

Yes, Knighthawk sold their car to Dyson. The Works MGs lost their backing, which of course means they can't run.

Alex Job Racing got an invitation (because their star drivers won the ALMS GT championship in 2002) but they won't be there; they can't afford it. Likely their drivers will be with Racers Group and Freisinger again like last year, which should be exciting! That will likely get the other TRG car into the mix.

ARE there two Spykers? And can the Zonda possibly last long enough for anyone to even know it's there? It's beautiful but even its owners say it is not ready for prime time yet.

dretceterini · 28 Mar 2003, 03:04 (Ref:550677)

I'm surprised the Durango (although it's a good looking car) and the Norma (it's a dog) got in...and the Morgan did not..and that only 1 MG made it. I also thought that only 1 of the 2 Pescarolo entries would get in (in view of the fact Courage has both an LM675 and LM900 car), and that there would be only one of the Racing for Holland Domes.

I'm not all that surprised at the 2 WR entries, in view of the fact that they have a long LeMans history, having been connected to WM/Peugeot going back to the late 70s...

Osella · 28 Mar 2003, 03:52 (Ref:550687)

Does the ACO smoke crack? I sincerely hope so!
I've calmed down a little now... it's up to them who they invite and that's why it's so good in the first place. I can except the Norma as a kind of 'honorary Debora' but some middling 911 drivers will complain about it getting in the way, probably of the pit entrance...

No M3... well, at least Morgan and Spyker actually make V8 BMW-engined cars!!

I'm glad to see the Durango given a chance and am praying extra for the Taurus Lola, which has inexplicably become my favourite sportscar of late... and congrats to Mr Lammers for the two rfh entries. Keep the drivers fast, please!

And let's hope that MG does what it can...

Fab · 28 Mar 2003, 05:33 (Ref:550710)

Quote:

Originally posted by Osella
I'm glad to see the Durango given a chance and am praying extra for the Taurus Lola, which has inexplicably become my favourite sportscar of late...

I agree on that point, I hope a withdraw of a Porsche !

**Aysedasi** · 28 Mar 2003, 08:21 (Ref:550786)

Quote:

Originally posted by Osella
it's up to them who they invite and that's why it's so good in the first place.

Exactly my sentiments Osella. They've been running the greatest motor race in the world since 1923 and they should have some idea about how to do it. We can all debate over this car that got in or that team that didn't, but it won't do any of us any good. Until such time as we have some kind of strong unified championship for protos and GTs, the ACO will inevitably go its own sweet way and will pay as much (or as little) heed to Daytona and Sebring as it wants to.

Mal · 28 Mar 2003, 10:19 (Ref:550863)

Ditto, and thankfully they do go there own way as otherwise LeMans would now, most likely, be history

Rob29 · 28 Mar 2003, 12:39 (Ref:551003)

Quote:

Originally posted by Nordic
Le mans is restricted to 50 cars for at least 2 reasons.
1. There are only 50 pit garages (48 till last year)while it would be possible to build a few more the pit straight is not long enough for 10 let alone 20 more.
2. The F.I.A goverern the capacity for the track and give the approval not the A.C.O.

Unless we know for certain that a team entered and was turned down, as with Morgan, I feel it is unfair to have a go at the A.C.O.

The Nurburgring 24hrs starts around 140 cars,and I'm fairly sure has no more garages than Le Mans.Seems they manage to share.

Martin W · 28 Mar 2003, 13:08 (Ref:551034)

Sharing pits? Sounds a bit like the BAR F1 team!

It seems the ACO can only build new pits for film companies! Presumably the film company from last year paid for the new pits. Maybe we could persuade Stephen Spielberg to make a new Le Mans movie and we could have loads of new pits to accommodate everyone!

**Aysedasi** · 28 Mar 2003, 13:15 (Ref:551043)

Quote:

Originally posted by Martin W
Presumably the film company from last year paid for the new pits.

I believe so.

We had been limited to 48 entrants at Le Mans for some years before that,

gi_gav · 28 Mar 2003, 13:15 (Ref:551045)

If any more MG-Lola's had been accepted, what would they have taken the place of?

Also, while I was really hoping for a pack of MGs to be pressuring the LMP900's in the opening hours, I'm sceptical as to whether they would have lasted much longer than that... Maybe its not so bad as it appears?

Martin W · 28 Mar 2003, 13:30 (Ref:551061)

Dyson pulled out of Le Mans because they fared so badly at Sebring. I think the MG engine will always struggle to complete 24 hours at racing speeds.

Tim Northcutt · 28 Mar 2003, 13:37 (Ref:551070)

A Few Thoughts:

1. If the MG factory didn't have the $$$ and Dyson bought the Knighthawk cars, but "withdrew" their entry due to reliability issues, what other teams are currently running MGs that could have been invited?

2. Note to Aysedasi -- maybe it is comparing apples to oranges, but from my own personal experience the world's greatest race is in Speedway, Indiana the last Sunday in May...I love both events, and Le Mans IS the world's greatest endurance race....

but nothing in auto racing compares to hearing and seeing more than 300,000 people on their feet cheering as 33 cars that "earned" the right to race take the Green Flag and roar into Turn One at the Brickyard...

If you have never experienced it, I hope that someday you will get the opportunity....it truly is "The Greatest Spectacle in Racing"

**Aysedasi** · 28 Mar 2003, 13:38 (Ref:551078)

We'll never agree on this one Tim! But I respect your right to hold that opinion

I'm also honest enough to admit that having never experienced the Brickyard, I'm not really fully equipped to make the comparison.....

gi_gav · 28 Mar 2003, 13:39 (Ref:551079)

Quote:

Originally posted by Martin W
I think the MG engine will always struggle to complete 24 hours at racing speeds.

Its not even the engine that seems to be the problem - Dyson were crippled by steering rack (#16) and suspension (#20) problems at Sebring, and MGs (i'm open to correction here) had suffered various electrical problems at Le Mans over the past couple of years.

It really is a shame, cos one of the highlights of my first Le Mans last year was Warren Hughes' Audi-chasing antics on the Saturday evening

Similar Threads
Thread	Thread Starter	Forum	Replies	Last Post
wsb entry list.....	gomick	Bike Racing	12	31 Jan 2004 23:45
BSB Entry List?	ATF	Bike Racing	1	30 Jan 2004 23:49
[FIA GT] FIA GT Entry List	SALEEN S7R	Sportscar & GT Racing	9	7 May 2003 18:59
DTC entry list	rustyfan	Touring Car Racing	20	17 Apr 2003 12:44
QLD 500 entry list	marcus	Australasian Touring Cars.	2	7 Aug 2001 03:56