Internationals disappoint at Bathurst - Page 2

D.R.T. · 12 Oct 2008, 00:36 (Ref:2309459)

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ospi

Menu is imo one of the greatest touring car drivers of all time yet he was 2secs off the pace when he came to Bathurst.

In a v8 supercar. Menu's first run was in 97 in the Renault in which was the fastest out there after 3 laps. Its the car boys. Calm down.

sizzle · 12 Oct 2008, 07:47 (Ref:2309825)

Quote:

Originally Posted by DAVID PATERSON

So he should, it's more than anyone on this forum has ever achieved.

Well said David, next year they will be better. All the other talk of Ickx etc forgets the top 19 in qualifying were within 1 second. Times are a little different now.

stmookeyj033 · 12 Oct 2008, 08:19 (Ref:2309873)

And no-one's mentioned John Cleland yet.......

Armco Bender · 12 Oct 2008, 08:24 (Ref:2309878)

or Tom Walkinshaw and Win Percy.

Mr Revhead · 12 Oct 2008, 08:24 (Ref:2309879)

yeah i did! look above!

David Brand · 12 Oct 2008, 08:46 (Ref:2309904)

I seem to remember Roland Dane saying he invites internationals so he can show Europe how good the Australian drivers are... presumably because the internationals get smashed and take a long time to get used to the cars.

risky · 12 Oct 2008, 09:05 (Ref:2309929)

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ospi

This place is all about the amount of laps you have done, and you just can't expect these international drivers to perform well.

imo they should only be placed with a experienced supercar driver. running around on their own with no idea what to adjust (their engineer can only suggest so much), their bound to fail.
stop pairing lead drivers...that would solve the problem.

sweetchuk · 12 Oct 2008, 09:48 (Ref:2309973)

Quote:

Originally Posted by sizzle

All the other talk of Ickx etc forgets the top 19 in qualifying were within 1 second.

Excuse me, but "all the other talk of Ickx etc forgets the top 19 in qualifying were within 1 second ...." actually forgets nothing of the kind.

I was replying to an assertion by a previous poster re the following:

Quote:

International drivers no matter how good they are with no experience at Bathurst will never do well

as well as

Quote:

This place is all about the amount of laps you have done, and you just can't expect these international drivers to perform well.

Where in that does it mention the need to recognise a timeframe between the Top 19 cars??
If Ickx (not to mention Soper, Neidzweidz, Mezera - who won with Longhursgt in '88) did not disprove that assumption in the most emphatic style possible, in reply to the person to whom I was responding , then what has an international driver got to do to disprove it to the satisfaction of your lofty expectation?

GeoffR · 12 Oct 2008, 09:59 (Ref:2309989)

Car #88 was on course for a probable top 10 finish until it was turned around at Griffins by Fabian Coulthard. Not a bad effort for their first time at Bathurst in a RWD car.

monaroCountry · 12 Oct 2008, 10:14 (Ref:2310006)

Quote:

Originally Posted by GeoffR

Car #88 was on course for a probable top 10 finish until it was turned around at Griffins by Fabian Coulthard. Not a bad effort for their first time at Bathurst in a RWD car.

#88 was never a top 10 car but was definitely a top 18 or even 15. It was by far the best international, a great drive by two great drivers. The duo shouldn't have any trouble getting a ride next year if they want to have another shot.

Mickcals · 12 Oct 2008, 10:17 (Ref:2310012)

I like how the international drivers ome over to Bathurst to try their hand.

Its something that the Bathurst "image" is based on - the internationals trying to slay this Aussie Legend.

I think overall Hynes and Giovanardi did an excellent job the the #88 car, and like Crompton said, if they could restart their weekend with the knowledge they had at 4pm this afternoon then they would have been on the money staight away.

I think if Triple 8 commit to these two drivers again next year their results will reflect it.

I was a bit disappointed with Boris Said, but then again its a matter of getting used to a "low" downforce touring car (unlike NASCAR), i think if Said was to race with a team a bit further up pit lane like Triple 888 or HRT then his results might have been better

monaroCountry · 12 Oct 2008, 10:19 (Ref:2310013)

Quote:

Originally Posted by David Brand

I seem to remember Roland Dane saying he invites internationals so he can show Europe how good the Australian drivers are... presumably because the internationals get smashed and take a long time to get used to the cars.

Its all about secrets IMO. Top teams doesnt want to have two unsigned drivers to drive at Bathurst and learn all the teams secrets, only to have them poached by another team.

International drivers adds to the flavor and also ensures that those highly guarded secrets doesnt get passed on to another team.

The top teams wants their two best drivers in one car, afterall who ever remembers 2nd place getters?

monaroCountry · 12 Oct 2008, 10:25 (Ref:2310019)

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mickcals

I like how the international drivers ome over to Bathurst to try their hand.

Its something that the Bathurst "image" is based on - the internationals trying to slay this Aussie Legend.

I think overall Hynes and Giovanardi did an excellent job the the #88 car, and like Crompton said, if they could restart their weekend with the knowledge they had at 4pm this afternoon then they would have been on the money staight away.

I think if Triple 8 commit to these two drivers again next year their results will reflect it.

I was a bit disappointed with Boris Said, but then again its a matter of getting used to a "low" downforce touring car (unlike NASCAR), i think if Said was to race with a team a bit further up pit lane like Triple 888 or HRT then his results might have been better

I agree with Hynes and Giovanardi, hopefully they come back next year!!!

Ive never seen an international perform like Boris Said and Mat Neal, both were junk. The level of road coarse drivers in Bathurst is so far ahead of those in America (NASCAR especially). It's not about getting used to low downforce, I would hazard a guess and say that V8supercar's have far more downforce and are better suited than NASCARS.

GeoffR · 12 Oct 2008, 10:28 (Ref:2310021)

So what happened to Richard Lyons & Allan Simonsen this year? Were they on 888 duties elsewhere?

Robert Ryan · 12 Oct 2008, 10:54 (Ref:2310048)

Quote:

For Ambrose its the track, he smashed the NASCAR regulars on every road course but not on an oval. I expected more from Boris Said since he is a road course specialist. I think Ambrose is a better road course driver than Montoya however both Ambrose and Montoya are mile ahead of the NASCAR regulars when it comes to road course.

Ambrose went through both the Nationwide and Nextel Cup regulars and roadcourse specialists like a hot knife through butter. He really impressed many US observers with his stirling run from 43rd to 3rd at Watkins Glen and was challenging the leaders.Something that had not been done before. On ovals he is now good.

williamsf1 · 12 Oct 2008, 11:06 (Ref:2310058)

simonsen is racing in the British GT series this weekend.... no doubt being paid!

cptkablamo · 12 Oct 2008, 11:42 (Ref:2310076)

Yes, Simonsen and Lyons were on other duties...not too sure about Lyons but Simonsen put the car on pole in the Brit GT finale

But no one will come to any series and immediately win no matter who they are but despite this, I do think it is important to keep some internationals coming over...it would also be nice if more V8 drivers tried their hands at other things too...say try to get a seat at Spa 24h - even it is to try something new

Pro Racer · 12 Oct 2008, 12:00 (Ref:2310088)

i think the #67 drivers really wanted to be at Bondi not Bathurst as they loved the sand traps. #88 crashed right infront of me

awesome site.

D.R.T. · 12 Oct 2008, 15:21 (Ref:2310246)

The 88 car was mighty impressive. The more the merrier in my opinion

duke_toaster · 12 Oct 2008, 16:13 (Ref:2310279)

Quote:

Originally Posted by williamsf1

simonsen is racing in the British GT series this weekend.... no doubt being paid!

I imagine so - he is being run by a bizzare outfit called christians in Motorsport. They claim that their GT3 outfit is all being funded by one rich bloke and rather donations to their organisation. Obviously it's a rather inventive means of bible bashing - bit bizzare idea given that motor races usually take place on sundays

**FIRE** · 12 Oct 2008, 20:42 (Ref:2310485)

If Boris Said had only experience in NASCAR he could use it as an excuse but that's not. He was also a BMW factory driver so he has a lot of experience with powerful V8 RWD cars. But experience on the mountain and with the cars is of course very important. Put a V8 Supercar driver in a WTCC or BTCC car and I am sure they need time to be competative.

For V8 Supercars it's good to have a few international drivers because it's giving the race more publicity in Europe.

RotorFan · 12 Oct 2008, 21:55 (Ref:2310560)

What about Ryan Briscoe? Provisional Pole at Sandown on his first attempt.

That said, I think Giovanardi is a talented driver.

If anyone was going to be pinched from BTCC, Darren Turner would have been very interesting to see. He's more of an all-round driver.

miss tmr · 12 Oct 2008, 23:35 (Ref:2310623)

What happened to drivers such as Priaulx, Rydell, Brabham, these were drivers that impressed at Bathurst..

racer69 · 13 Oct 2008, 01:46 (Ref:2310660)

Quote:

Originally Posted by FIRE

If Boris Said had only experience in NASCAR he could use it as an excuse but that's not. He was also a BMW factory driver so he has a lot of experience with powerful V8 RWD cars. But experience on the mountain and with the cars is of course very important. Put a V8 Supercar driver in a WTCC or BTCC car and I am sure they need time to be competative.

Experience in the cars is more important than track experience, plenty of overseas drivers have been quick straight off the bat (when they knew their machinery)

Quote:

Originally Posted by miss tmr

What happened to drivers such as Priaulx, Rydell, Brabham, these were drivers that impressed at Bathurst..

Priaulx was originally slated for #88, but BMW blocked it (same with Yvan Muller & Seat)

mac · 13 Oct 2008, 03:46 (Ref:2310717)

The drivers in the #88 car did a fantastic job in the race. Should have had a strong top ten result if not for a crass piece of driving from the otherwise impeccable Fabian Coulthard - can't believe he escaped punishment for that!

Similar Threads
Thread	Thread Starter	Forum	Replies	Last Post
Bathurst Champions Opt For Experience In Sandown and Bathurst Enduros	buza	Australasian Touring Cars.	2	11 Apr 2005 11:43
So who actually went to Bathurst???	Average Punter	Australasian Touring Cars.	27	22 Oct 2004 11:49
Any news on the Internationals?	marcus	Australasian Touring Cars.	15	12 Sep 2003 13:32
Bathurst	garry	Australasian Touring Cars.	32	4 Sep 2003 23:39