|
||||||||||
|
||||||||||
|
|
Thread Tools | Display Modes |
25 Sep 2020, 19:07 (Ref:4006251) | #26 | |
Veteran
Join Date: Mar 2015
Posts: 11,087
|
Anyopenroad and ascarracinguk pretty much nail this thread.
|
|
|
25 Sep 2020, 19:13 (Ref:4006252) | #27 | ||
Veteran
Join Date: Jan 2002
Posts: 6,137
|
|||
|
25 Sep 2020, 20:41 (Ref:4006268) | #28 | ||
14th
1% Club
Join Date: Jul 2001
Posts: 44,033
|
Hamilton is better than Rosberg, but Rosberg was pretty damn close. In an age of ultra consistency this means over a long year it is unlikely Rosberg would beat Hamilton. However, in one year, it fell towards Rosberg. Well done sir.
In the years one of them won the championship it was 2-1 to Hamilton. I’m happy that is fair considering how close they were. As for the team favoring Hamilton. All of the stuff above is more likely to come about when a driver is just stronger! Which Hamilton is against most! Occam’s razor. |
||
__________________
Brum brum |
26 Sep 2020, 02:34 (Ref:4006305) | #29 | ||||||
Veteran
Join Date: Jun 2020
Posts: 506
|
Quote:
Spa beforehand was seen as less detrimental to take advantage of those rules (A loophole subsequently closed). That I suspect is so galling for Hamilton fans and ironic for neutrals. A blown engine with a clear lead. It wasn't a worn engine that blew up, but was a fresh engine that wasn't being pushed. I can give you stats that demonstrate Rosberg was better than Hamilton that year, Hamilton didn't perform to his 2014 & 15 seasons, and Rosberg lifted. Objective stats that have nothing to do with reliability. Are you interested? Quote:
Rosberg led by 23pts after Malaysia (288-265) with 5 races to go. When Rosberg won the following race in Japan, that extended the lead to 33 (313-280). That's when the balance of power swung to Rosberg. Four 2nd places for the rest of the year meant he won the championship, and he drove accordingly (To my disbelief) Quote:
Quote:
1) Rosberg is of sufficient talent that even if you're inherently better than him, you can't be complacent in your own performance. 2) There's something that Rosberg has but Bottas doesn't, and it's more important than inherent talent. That is "clout" within the team. Rosberg had clout due to being at MB from the start. Bottas has none. Clout is a bigger deal because it set up how the team operates. Quote:
|
||||||
|
26 Sep 2020, 07:38 (Ref:4006322) | #30 | |
Veteran
Join Date: Jul 2013
Posts: 18,694
|
A key in how hard Rosberg pushed Hamilton is seen by how many times Nico finished second when Lewis won.
2014: 11/8 2015: 10/7 2016: 10/5 |
|
__________________
He who dares wins! He who hesitates is lost! |
26 Sep 2020, 07:59 (Ref:4006325) | #31 | |||
Veteran
Join Date: Apr 2007
Posts: 12,505
|
Quote:
When you look at the comparison for VB 2017: 9/4 2018: 11/2 2019: 11/6 Does that mean VB hasn't pushed Hamilton as hard? Or does it mean that the Merc has not been as far ahead of the field with VB in the car, so there has been more a contest with other teams? I think there are too many other variables involved for simply looking at statistics for Merc's other driver finishing second to LH to actually mean anything. |
|||
__________________
"When you’re just too socially awkward for real life, Ten-Tenths welcomes you with open arms. Everyone has me figured out, which makes it super easy for me." |
26 Sep 2020, 09:26 (Ref:4006336) | #32 | ||
Team Crouton
20KPINAL
Join Date: Oct 2001
Posts: 39,941
|
I'm just puzzling what all this has to do with the subject of the thread.....
|
||
__________________
280 days...... |
26 Sep 2020, 09:54 (Ref:4006342) | #33 | |||
Veteran
Join Date: Apr 2007
Posts: 12,505
|
Quote:
In the context of this thread - would a challenge from Max as a team-mate at RBR be something LH would welcome, or want to avoid? |
|||
__________________
"When you’re just too socially awkward for real life, Ten-Tenths welcomes you with open arms. Everyone has me figured out, which makes it super easy for me." |
26 Sep 2020, 10:37 (Ref:4006346) | #34 | ||
Veteran
Join Date: Jul 2013
Posts: 18,694
|
Quote:
Or maybe you need to stop trying to read too much into things. If you think Bottas has done as well as Rosberg in terms of Hamilton, well I have yet to see enough to convince me, good as Valterri. You can’t paint things up, when not just stats, but performance also shows it too |
||
__________________
He who dares wins! He who hesitates is lost! |
26 Sep 2020, 10:42 (Ref:4006348) | #35 | ||
Veteran
Join Date: May 2007
Posts: 3,211
|
I am not sure Verstappen will win a WDC at at all, he has the talent but I can see it is possible that the younger drivers coming through may move the goal posts so to speak and MB's long domination has certainly prevented him from being a WDC already. In ordinary circumstances he could just have been a WDC already but MB have effectively blocked his way so far.
If MB continue their winning ways which is more likely than not how many years do you think Verstappen has to wait his chance? He has just about gauranteed that a move to MB is out of the question because his contract is out of phase with everyone else's. RB do not look like they are going to return to the podium within the next decade and all in all I would not put a bet on his WDC chances at all. Time will tell of course but brilliant drivers before him have not won either. Quote:
|
||
|
26 Sep 2020, 11:13 (Ref:4006350) | #36 | |||
Veteran
Join Date: Apr 2007
Posts: 12,505
|
Quote:
I was trying to establish what you meant by saying that the statistics of Rosberg being second to a Hamilton win being 'key'? Please don't take any query for clarification as a criticism - sometimes it might just be that people are trying to get a better understanding of the point you are trying to make..... |
|||
__________________
"When you’re just too socially awkward for real life, Ten-Tenths welcomes you with open arms. Everyone has me figured out, which makes it super easy for me." |
26 Sep 2020, 11:13 (Ref:4006351) | #37 | |||
Veteran
Join Date: Jan 2002
Posts: 6,137
|
Quote:
Max is surely talented and determined enough, that is not the problem. He may end up as a multi-time champion but he may as well end his carreer without a title at all. Nobody can tell. Eveything has to be in order at exactly the right, there is too many circumstances out of his control. Same is true of course for Leclerc (and other upcoming talents). Just imagine Ferrari gets its acts together in the next few years. We may see a Ferrari-Leclerc dominance. Or if Mercedes keeps doing what it is doing, then maybe Lewis' eventual successor (Russell? or someone else) will pick up where Lewis left. |
|||
|
26 Sep 2020, 11:18 (Ref:4006353) | #38 | ||
14th
1% Club
Join Date: Jul 2001
Posts: 44,033
|
|||
__________________
Brum brum |
26 Sep 2020, 12:32 (Ref:4006368) | #39 | ||
Team Crouton
20KPINAL
Join Date: Oct 2001
Posts: 39,941
|
|||
__________________
280 days...... |
26 Sep 2020, 12:44 (Ref:4006376) | #40 | |
Veteran
Join Date: Jul 2009
Posts: 5,260
|
User joined yesterday, makes one post, edits profile to have a commercial link as their home page...
Looks like a duck to me! |
|
__________________
Walk a mile in someone else's shoes. When they realise you have, you'll be a mile away and you'll have their shoes. |
26 Sep 2020, 14:48 (Ref:4006407) | #41 | ||
Veteran
Join Date: Jan 2002
Posts: 6,137
|
|||
|
26 Sep 2020, 14:56 (Ref:4006410) | #42 | ||
Team Crouton
20KPINAL
Join Date: Oct 2001
Posts: 39,941
|
|||
__________________
280 days...... |
26 Sep 2020, 15:42 (Ref:4006421) | #43 | ||
The Honourable Mallett
20KPINAL
Join Date: Feb 1999
Posts: 37,576
|
|||
__________________
I've decided to stop reaching out to people. I'm just going to contact them instead. |
27 Sep 2020, 00:21 (Ref:4006584) | #44 | ||
Veteran
Join Date: Jun 2020
Posts: 506
|
Verstappen will be in F1 til he's 45, and will have his period to cash in on success. Similar to how it's evolved for other wunderkinds like Vettel and Hamilton.
Quote:
The thing about a Verstappen/Hamilton team up, is who would the development of the car sway towards? At MB it's Hamilton, and at RB it's Verstappen. So idk what'd happen at a neutral team. |
||
|
27 Sep 2020, 00:38 (Ref:4006591) | #45 | ||
14th
1% Club
Join Date: Jul 2001
Posts: 44,033
|
|||
__________________
Brum brum |
27 Sep 2020, 00:56 (Ref:4006592) | #46 | |
Veteran
Join Date: May 2007
Posts: 3,211
|
I am glad you can be so positive about the future, how much do you charge Verstappen to read his? No one can say what will happen but drivers such as Chris Amon one of the most talented drivers to never win a WDC would agree that nothing is gauranteed in this life.
|
|
|
27 Sep 2020, 08:12 (Ref:4006644) | #47 | ||
Team Crouton
20KPINAL
Join Date: Oct 2001
Posts: 39,941
|
That team would have a many times world champion and a young pretender. Go figure.....
|
||
__________________
280 days...... |
27 Sep 2020, 10:35 (Ref:4006686) | #48 | ||
Veteran
Join Date: Jun 2020
Posts: 506
|
Quote:
Otherwise something will occur in the coming decades and Verstappen will get a lengthy spell in the sunshine to cash in on wins. How it occurs, I don't know. In the time I'd been following F1. Rule changes that take away everything that made the Williams good, and Schumacher wins with Benetton. Extreme changes occur for 98. And Mika Hakkinen gets his opportunity to cash in. (Who had similar potential as Schumacher from 1990, but was at the opposite ends of the success spectrum til 98). Big changes occur for 05, and Alonso/Renault override the Schumacher/Ferrari dominance. Further big changes for 09, and Button cashes in. Quite extreme rule changes occur for 14, and Hamilton/MB reap like never before in F1 history (Now over hauling Schumacher/Ferrari's accumulated success). Hamilton was a substantial driver in 13, but did not accumulate the success expected from his first two years in F1. He's subsequently fulfilled on that with the insurmountable advantage MB were handed. Verstappen is of similar presence to Hamilton, and a time will come for him to fill his boots. |
||
|
27 Sep 2020, 10:42 (Ref:4006692) | #49 | ||
Veteran
Join Date: Jun 2020
Posts: 506
|
Quote:
I'm not sure what a neutral team would do? It's not clear cut, and Hamilton being a WC won't be relevant. |
||
|
27 Sep 2020, 11:15 (Ref:4006713) | #50 | |
Veteran
Join Date: Jul 2013
Posts: 18,694
|
Mention of Amon and how him missing out wouldn’t happen today. Well Fred in recent seasons never exactly made the right choice of cars, much like Amon. Difference is Alonso is at least had those two titles with Renault
|
|
__________________
He who dares wins! He who hesitates is lost! |
|
|
Similar Threads | ||||
Thread | Thread Starter | Forum | Replies | Last Post |
[Driver] Max Verstappen should NOT race in F1 for 2015 | Mekola | Formula One | 386 | 16 May 2016 10:55 |
Lewis..."I tricked him!" (Massa) | F1Pete | Formula One | 68 | 13 Apr 2007 09:46 |
Should Lewis Hamilton Do GP 2? | Frank_White | National & International Single Seaters | 41 | 28 Dec 2004 14:18 |
Jos Verstappen ....how do you rate him | Sato san | Formula One | 30 | 10 Jul 2002 22:10 |
Frentzen- Why Toyota want him and the reasons he should/shouldn't go | renaultbel | Formula One | 2 | 25 Jun 2001 17:14 |