HSCC Finals, Silverstone, 18th Oct, 2008

[delta]

Ok poor old Garry was knocked for his undertray finnishing at the adaptor plate. As co founder of Historic FF2000 i for have no probs with drivers having an extra plate under the engine as long as the rivets are 6" apart. Reason back in the 70's when men were men we just had armco to hit if you fell off, now all the namby pamby single seater drivers "thats me as well" can fall off into gravel traps and yes fill the car and bell housing with gravel and no matter what you do the bloominmg stuff gets everywhere including clutch and often jamming clutch down as driver has clutch depressed when entering the gravel. So a tray under the engine will stop any stones or anything else ending up where you dont want it. Got an idea as poor old Garry was clobberd i am going to honour him and call them" Critcher Trays " . If thats ok with you Gazza.

[RTH]

Talk of needing a tray reminds me of this :-

http://uk.youtube.com/watch?v=Sv5iEK-IEzw

[Peter Mallett]

I hate you. Possibly the best Eddie Izzard sketch.

Back to the thread. It is a '94 Benetton!

[delta]

See Garry it was worth getting knocked by the scrutineers. Thanks GTH that was a very funny scetch.

Originally Posted by RTH

Talk of needing a tray reminds me of this :-

http://uk.youtube.com/watch?v=Sv5iEK-IEzw

[delta]

Sorry RTH.Oooops

[White flag man]

Originally Posted by RTH

Talk of needing a tray reminds me of this :-

http://uk.youtube.com/watch?v=Sv5iEK-IEzw

Sorry Gerry, but thank you RTH, brilliant

[Gary Critcher]

LOL indeed! Thanks for that Iain. So, it's just me and Dan Gurney having parts of cars named after them?? I'm in good company! Excellent!

[Matthew Sturmer]

interesting that it was only you who was disqualified Gary as the 3rd place Elden has been running with a full length undertray all season. At least when I was pulled for an over height wing at Snetterton all cars were checked and 4 others also fell foul. It was like being back at school as the 5 of us waited outside the CoC's office to be told we were being disqualified.

[zefarelly]

rules is rules . . . Ford did actually make a very effective sandwich plate to stop detritus entering the bellhousing

one rarely sees them fitted in any car, but they do serve a purpose

[Gary Critcher]

Actually, I wasn't the only one disqualified, the guy who finished behind me (i.e. last) went the same way I did. And yes, waiting for the CoC to ready himself did indeed feel like being up in front of the 'beek' at school!! LOL

[John Turner]

Never mind detention, school exercise book down the back of the trousers time, chaps!

More pics, eventually - I'm all behind too, but not literally, I hope!

[Tonto]

Were you led into a small private room and invited 'to assume the position' known as 'a Mosley' I believe...........

[zefarelly]

you've been there before Tonto?

[Tonto]

Of basement flats with 5 ladies of the night? Sadly not. Of the Clerks office, sadly yes! Although twas in the old days before whipping became fashionable.

[jhh911]

As the owner of the '3rd place Elden', I take issue with the suggestion that I have been running illegally all season and ask Mr Sturmer to check his facts before pointing fingers. He needs to understand the difference between a 'stress-bearing panel' and what falls into the category of 'bodywork'. I have indeed had an undertray on my car all season, the sole purpose of which is to keep debris and water out of the engine. As per regulations the bolt centres are more than 15.25cm apart and the tray is readily removable like any other piece of bodywork.Had it been riveted, as appears to be in Gary's car, it would be classed as 'stress-bearing' and therefore outside the regulations. The first 8 finishers, obviously including myself, were subjected to extensive post-race scrutineering, including stripping the engine. Had any illegalities been found, I too would have been disqualified. NB. Formula Fords I raced in period also had undertrays fitted adhering to exactly the same regulations.

[johngee]

I don't want to be pedantic (Oh - alright then, I do ) but I suspect that the penalty involved was 'exclusion'. 'Disqualification' is a different penalty and far more serious!

[Alan Morgan]

The result sheet says "Cars 87 & 89 Disqualified by Clerk of Course decisions"

[rogerwills]

This is superb and way more exciting than anything that ever happens on here or is going on in the world. Can we have more of this sort of thing - MGB checks, V8s, etc. Lets put some spice in this hobby of ours.....

[terence]

Roger,I did start the ball rolling elsewhere,then you deserted the thread.

[rogerwills]

Yes, but nobody ever came back with something like this......

Originally Posted by jhh911

As the owner of the '3rd place Elden', I take issue with the suggestion that I have been running illegally all season and ask Mr Sturmer to check his facts before pointing fingers. He needs to understand the difference between a 'stress-bearing panel' and what falls into the category of 'bodywork'. I have indeed had an undertray on my car all season, the sole purpose of which is to keep debris and water out of the engine. As per regulations the bolt centres are more than 15.25cm apart and the tray is readily removable like any other piece of bodywork.Had it been riveted, as appears to be in Gary's car, it would be classed as 'stress-bearing' and therefore outside the regulations. The first 8 finishers, obviously including myself, were subjected to extensive post-race scrutineering, including stripping the engine. Had any illegalities been found, I too would have been disqualified. NB. Formula Fords I raced in period also had undertrays fitted adhering to exactly the same regulations.

Thats what got me interested again....

And is interesting, rather than the usual dross about 2 litre MGBs that we all know about, light E-types, hooky Cobras, big engined V8s etc etc....

Yawn, even making myself sleepy.

See here is someone with real facts about real cars.

More please.

[terence]

Sleep tight.










Bullet maker perhaps.

[jhh911]

To further clarify: My demon supposed 'full-length' undertray was on show for to all to see at Oulton. If picture works the removable part can be seen on the ground under car,also holes for rif-nuts are visible under engine.Keep it secret, but my unfair advantage is actually my 13 stone of weight carrying me past people under braking plus the thought of my bus pass in just over a years time.

[johngee]

Originally Posted by Alan Morgan

The result sheet says "Cars 87 & 89 Disqualified by Clerk of Course decisions"

I can't comment on this specific instance but I've only ever known of 'disqualification' being used in very different circumstances.

[john ruston]

The fact is that one car had an unstressed member and the the other a piece that was deemed to be stressed and presumably to make car stiffer and thus outside the rules.If this is the case Gary should be stood down but I am sure he will explain position.Whoever jhh is he has every reason to be p......d off with people as is usual in Historic racing making up unsubstantiated accusations

[John Turner]

Can we keep this in perspective please. Welcome to John HH, who clearly joined to respond to Matthew's reference to the length of the undertray on the Elden and the inference he drew from that comment. Entirely understandable, and I'm glad that yet another driver was moved to join our Ten Tenths community. To be fair to Matthew, he was merely attempting to understand why Gary's undertray was illegal and John's was not, maybe overlooking the fact that one was a stressed member, and the other not so.

As for Gary, knowing him, I can't imagine it was an intentional evasion of the regs and I'm sure that he would be the first to admit that since he tends to circulate towards the back of the field he's hardly obtained the 'unfair advantage'. I'm sure that over the winter that car will have it's undertray reduced in length!

Whilst I also note Roger's excitement at the prospect of discussions such as these, it's maybe one for another thread, since this one is about a specific meeting and I think that we have probably covered this particular issue in full and it is time to move on. I can say that my pictorial review of this meeting will start, hopefully, soon!