Jos Verstappen tries his luck at Sauber

[Don K]

Originally posted by DriverT
Looking at where you are from... with the greatest of respect my friend, you would say that. Two journeymen, but I think Fisi would edge it by a considerable margin.

Maybe.
Let's weight and see.

It's ridiculous to say that Jos should not get this chance to prove himself, just because *you* think that he will fail ...

If the team is willing to let Jos have this test, I don't see why we should say they cannot do that.
But it might be a good idea if Sauber would reinsure their current drivers beforehand, that their seats are not endangered (otherwise they would essentially be throwing away a test).

If Jos fails, that might quiet down some people at this forum.
If he beats Fisi, that might give Trust (and/or Muermans) a better chance to "buy" a seat for him.

But if Jos doesn't get the test, we still don't know how fast he is at this moment.

------

Now, is there any reason left why you *don't* want Jos to do that test?

[NiceGuyEddie]

But it might be a good idea if Sauber would reinsure their current drivers beforehand, that their seats are not endangered (otherwise they would essentially be throwing away a test).

That would compromize the whole purpose of the test in the first place. It is meant to 'prove' that Jos is quicker than Fisico and c'mon, given the facts that is just a ridiculous claim to begin with. Sure, there is no solid proof, but there will never be. Not even after a shootout, for F1 is too complex to measure it specifically. One can only rely on the structural performance of a driver and in that sense, Fisico is lightyears ahead of Verstappen. Even Massa is way ahead of Verstappen.

But lets say for the sake of argument that Jos would beat Fisico, the purpose is that he then replaces Fisico. Why else would Muermans pay for a test like that if it doesn't begin him anything on the short term?

If Jos fails, that might quiet down some people at this forum.

Sure, but that is not in the interest of Muermans, nor in the interest of the man himself (Jos).

If he beats Fisi, that might give Trust (and/or Muermans) a better chance to "buy" a seat for him.

How is that? You buy a seat because there is money availabe. Only the teams that have to rely on sponsorship money will be willing to consider a driver well in his thirties who has done not all too much in F1 since Brazil 1994. A oneoff test against Fisichella won't make any difference.

Besides all that, what has Sauber got to gain? Muermans paying for the test means that Sauber gets its expences paid, but it would bring the team virtually nothing when the test could not lead to the exchange of any of their drivers for Jos Verstappen (as you suggested yourself). In that case, Sauber would merely function as a display for Verstappen, trying to sell his services to any F1 team that is even willing to pay attention. A F1team that has nothing to gain in a project, will not take part in that project.

And than we have Fisico. Would he agree and take part in this test? Why would he? Even if he should and would win hands down, why would he make himself available for something like this? Villeneuve refused to take part in a shootout and the team couldn't make him do it.

There must have gone very little thought into this little stunt, but if it gives the people at Hinwill a good laugh, than it was probably worth it.

There is no reason why Jos shouldn't be able to do that test, but it is simply not realistic to even consider it.

[minirda]

Massa-Fissi 2-2 my mistake.

This shoot-out really isn't realistic, I agree with that. I think Har Muermans is trying to mislead us all. So Eddie can pick the right moment to sack Heidi and let Verstappen join Jordan. I hope this isn't the truth, bit I can imagine this is going to happen.

[Don K]

Originally posted by NiceGuyEddie
That would compromize the whole purpose of the test in the first place. It is meant to 'prove' that Jos is quicker than Fisico and c'mon, given the facts that is just a ridiculous claim to begin with. Sure, there is no solid proof, but there will never be. Not even after a shootout, for F1 is too complex to measure it specifically. One can only rely on the structural performance of a driver and in that sense, Fisico is lightyears ahead of Verstappen. Even Massa is way ahead of Verstappen.

But lets say for the sake of argument that Jos would beat Fisico, the purpose is that he then replaces Fisico. Why else would Muermans pay for a test like that if it doesn't begin him anything on the short term?

If Jos would proof to be faster than Fisi, it would make it easier to get him a F1 seat.

How is that? You buy a seat because there is money availabe. Only the teams that have to rely on sponsorship money will be willing to consider a driver well in his thirties who has done not all too much in F1 since Brazil 1994. A oneoff test against Fisichella won't make any difference.

If Heidfeld would be able to bring sponsor money, nobody would even think of replacing him.

Jos is a driver who was fast once, and who brings sponsor money now.
If he would be a fast driver who brings sponsor money, it would be easier to find him a F1 seat.
If he would be a slow driver who brings sponsor money, it would be easier to concentrate on the correct teams.

Besides all that, what has Sauber got to gain?

Fisichella or Massa could perform a regular test, bringing much data to the team.

Unless they would have to worry about Verstappen. That's why Sauber has to reassure them in advance, that their position is not endagered.

[DriverT]

Originally posted by Don K
Maybe.
Let's weight and see.

Exactly. Lets wait and see.

Originally posted by Don K
It's ridiculous to say that Jos should not get this chance to prove himself, just because *you* think that he will fail ...

OK I apologise for having an opinion, but that's what I thought this board was about. Discussion. I'm trying to cover both sides here. I don't dislike the guy, but some people's attitudes towards all things JV (and not just Verstappen) indicate a certain element of one-sidedness...

Originally posted by Don K
If Jos fails, that might quiet down some people at this forum.

This illustrates my previous point.

Originally posted by Don K
If he beats Fisi, that might give Trust (and/or Muermans) a better chance to "buy" a seat for him.

Yes indeed. But you could argue that a good driver shouldn't have to "buy" a seat (through his sponsors or otherwise). There are exceptions of course, Lauda being the usual example, but somehow I don't think he's a Lauda.

But good luck to the guy.

[minirda]

http://www.f1world.be/f1nieuws.php?id=5780_0_2_0_C

Why would Eddie offer Heidi to Frank Williams?

One possible answer: Jos

[Inigo Montoya]

Ahhh, its completely clear to me now

[DriverT]

Originally posted by minirda
http://www.f1world.be/f1nieuws.php?id=5780_0_2_0_C

Why would Eddie offer Heidi to Frank Williams?

One possible answer: Jos

So you are suggesting that Jos will get the Williams seat next year?

[minirda]

Originally posted by DriverT
So you are suggesting that Jos will get the Williams seat next year?

No. I'm suggesting that Heidfeld, will get the Williams seat immediately replacing Ralph who is under fire. Jos will get the Jordan seat and Trust has his Dutch driver in the team.

[DriverT]

Heidfeld?? Nahhhhhh...

[minirda]

Originally posted by DriverT
Heidfeld?? Nahhhhhh...

Or Fisichella perhaps. Explains why Jos is eager to negotiate with Peter Sauber.

I'm sure some racer gets kicked out the team, and i think Williams is the team where it all starts.

[Dutch chap]

Now, I suspect you are rolling on the floor laughing, but I cannot stretch enough that in The Netherlands, this is printed by serious media. Or at least somewhat serious. This is a national newspaper we are talking about.

Surely this is getting embarrassing...

It really IS getting embarrassing. Can we please stop all the Jos B***S**t now please. As soon as he gets a ride we're all interested. Till thean, let it go....

[DriverT]

Originally posted by minirda
Or Fisichella perhaps. Explains why Jos is eager to negotiate with Peter Sauber.

I'm sure some racer gets kicked out the team, and i think Williams is the team where it all starts.

Hmmmm maybe. I don't know. I cannot imagine FW will be willing to pay the severance terms of Ralf's contract to release him.

[BSchneiderFan]

Hmm. Williams haven't sacked a driver mid-season for at least twenty years, as far as I'm aware (perhaps they never have). Admittedly, they terminated Zanardi's contract a year early in 1999/2000, but that was at least during the off-season. In any case, even if they did fire Schumacher Minor (and I'd be flabbergasted), wouldn't it make more sense to put Gene or Pizzonia in the seat for the balance of the season? The only motive for taking Heidfeld would be financial, and, as Nick has next-to-no backing, it would have to be Trust paying Williams to take Heidfeld in order to clear a seat for Verstappen, for which they would also have to pay. And no-one can love Jos that much, can they?

[DriverT]

Yeah, I was saying that I see no sense in firing Ralf now. If they had wanted to do it, they'd have done it before the season started. It would indeed make more sense to replace him with Gene or Pizzonia.

The salient point is: Trust paying Williams to take a driver off Jordan's hands? Sir Frank Williams would never agree to it. It's ridiculous. It's about as likely as Ferrari hiring Pedro Diniz!

[golem]

I say give Jos a crack. He won't do it simply because 1 day is not enough to familiarise completely and Fisi is no slouch. It's that simple. But if he wanted a crack and they paid for the test, then I can't see why not if Jos's backers were willing and Fisi was willing.

I tend to this Fisi would be quite happy. I don't think he's past it yet, Fisi won't and will prove it any chance he gets. The moment he resigns himself to backmarkers is the day you will see his teammate beat him I think.

Schumacher should be getting to the stage of being past it. But he's consumately flogging everyone.

[Don K]

It looks as if Sauber doesn't want a test in which both Verstappen and Fisichella drive, before the end of the season.

Fisichella had no objection against the test.
(Still haven't found anything about whether or not Jos would want a test like that, though).

[DriverT]

... and he's supposed to be driving for Jordan anyway, so it's irrelevant now.

[Don K]

Originally posted by NiceGuyEddie
... Jos is having a look at Sauber. Well, not Jos directly but his other sponsor (in stead of Michel Perridon from Trust, who is happily married to Jordan nowadays and Jos wasn't a bridesmaid) Har Muermans is.

Apparently this has been a solo action by Muermans.

Verstappen and his management team were not very pleased by the fact that this was done without consulting them.