Toyota And Jordan Partnership - Page 2

**BertMk2** · 30 Jul 2004, 15:28 (Ref:1052072)

If Heidfeld doesn't get the second Williams seat then h's seriously short of options so Jordan would be the most likely seat surely? Or a return to Sauber?

Kicking-back · 30 Jul 2004, 15:35 (Ref:1052081)

Can't see Peter wanting him back a year after getting rid.

f1manoz · 30 Jul 2004, 16:10 (Ref:1052104)

If NH doesn't get into Williams, he'll stay at Jordan next year. Despite all his wailing about money, EJ knows when he's onto a good thing, and with Nick he has a driver eager to prove himself.

As for the Toyota rumours, good to hear but how much will it cost Jordan? Also, will Toyota place one of their drivers into the car in return?

Logrence · 30 Jul 2004, 16:17 (Ref:1052109)

Toyota have made the proviso that they shall only consider providing these customer engines if the engine regs don't change next season.

ParkLife · 1 Aug 2004, 16:51 (Ref:1053380)

Has Mark Smith's move to Jordan been confirmed then? Last I heard it was all rumour.

Kicking-back · 1 Aug 2004, 17:02 (Ref:1053387)

It's going to happen, but nothing's been formally announced yet.

Snrub · 1 Aug 2004, 19:23 (Ref:1053463)

I can see how having a small team running with the bigger boys is good PR for Toyota, probably better than running a $400M team and running just in front of Jordan.

For let's say ~$10M in costs, I don't see what Toyota has to lose. I don't feel sorry for Jaguar losing $20M in selling lousy engines to Jordan. I hope Jaguar/Ford drop out of F1, in part for the garbage they've saddled Jordan and Minardi with.

Logrence · 1 Aug 2004, 20:07 (Ref:1053488)

I do think Jordan and Minardi have had a choice whether they wanted to be saddled with any sort of garbage.

The way I see it they've done Formula One a favour, being the only manufacturer even willing to do a deal with the two worst teams in F1.

Phoenix1 · 1 Aug 2004, 23:07 (Ref:1053604)

Quote:

Originally posted by Snrub
I can see how having a small team running with the bigger boys is good PR for Toyota, probably better than running a $400M team and running just in front of Jordan. For let's say ~$10M in costs, I don't see what Toyota has to lose. I don't feel sorry for Jaguar losing $20M in selling lousy engines to Jordan. I hope Jaguar/Ford drop out of F1, in part for the garbage they've saddled Jordan and Minardi with.

Two things, firstly Jordan and Minardi can move up the grid if they sort themselves out. Jordan for example did so in 1999 and Minardi (all be in with super slicks) have qualified on the front row before now (1990 in the USA I thing?)

Second even if Ford are guilty of this then let us remember to look back over the years and wonder who would of stepped in the place of ford had they left F1. The grid was for many many years 2 Ferraris verus Ford powered cars. Also, for loyalty, look at CART that to would be gone without Ford. Ford and Cosworth are not charities and do actually have to make money. If Jordan or Minardi want to get rid of Ford/Cosworth then they need to sign a deal with another engine supplier - there in is a problem, no one else, currently, will supply them. If Toyota do supply Jordan or Minardi then I would expect Ford/Coswoth to step up there customer engine quality so they are sellable. Do not blame Ford for this blame BMW,Honda,Mercedes,Toyota (although I can let them off because they are still a newish team). Only Ford and Ferrari has customer engines right now and Ferrari have shown it can be useful with Sauber being every bit the Ferrari B team. Maybe next year a Minardi-Volvo Vs. a Jordan-Lexus would be good?!

DKGandBH · 2 Aug 2004, 00:42 (Ref:1053642)

I wonder if Lamborghini will ever come back to F1 ?
They have supplied Minardi in the past (as have Subaru)

David.

Dixie Flatline · 2 Aug 2004, 00:54 (Ref:1053645)

I think quite a few months ago in an issue of Motorsport in Australia, they had an in-depth interview with Ryan Briscoe, who indicated that he would love to race in '05 in F1 and said that it was a good possibility.

I would take Briscoe over Zonta if either was offered to me and I could squeeze a seat free for them and if it came with a good deal from Toyota. Zonta looked quite ordinary in the two seasons with BAR, although that might be down to the ordinary nature of the car, to a certain extent. Briscoe has been embedded in the Toyota racing team for years now, and he seems to be a genuinely nice person (he actually offered to sign an autograph for my fiance, only for neither of them to have a pen!), and if Toyota are looking long-term, a year or two experience with the "littl'uns" of F1 will do Briscoe a great amount of good for when/if Toyota want to promote him, rather than farming Zonta out.

grumpy1 · 2 Aug 2004, 01:54 (Ref:1053658)

Quote:

Originally posted by Turbo_Era
I don't like rumours, but this one is true, that would be interesting. I heard that Toyota would supply engines to Jordan, and that in exchange Ryan Briscoe would get one of the seats.

Has anyone heard anything about it?

It's maybe just speculation, but I guess that both teams would benefit from that.

T

What you have heard about Toyota suppling engines in exchange for Brisco getting a start is true but you have the wrong team.Toyota and Paul stoddard have been in negotiations for the past month and from the info I have its nearly a done deal.
Minardi have a one year engine deal where as Jordans is for 2 years.More to the point EJ is talking to Mercedes if you belive the paddock rumours.

The Grumpy1

Turbo_Era · 2 Aug 2004, 02:44 (Ref:1053668)

Quote:

Originally posted by Dixie Flatline
Zonta looked quite ordinary in the two seasons with BAR, although that might be down to the ordinary nature of the car, to a certain extent.

Imho Zonta is one of biggest wastes of talent in F1. I followed him in Jr Formulas and he was exceptional up against the likes of Montoya. Also very good at McLaren, sometimes even quicker than Hakkinen and Coulthard.

Anyone would look ordinary in that BAR team... Trust me, Zonta had a much harder time with Craig + Jacques than Pizza boy ever had at Jaguar for example.

I'd like to see him racing again... but I also think that Briscoe deserves a chance to show what he's capable of... At least he's expected to be better than Klien.

Turbo_Era · 2 Aug 2004, 02:57 (Ref:1053672)

Quote:

Originally posted by grumpy1
Toyota and Paul stoddard have been in negotiations for the past month and from the info I have its nearly a done deal.

2 good things for Paul S: an Aussie driver and also a better engine deal. Not bad.

mountainstar · 2 Aug 2004, 06:39 (Ref:1053699)

Quote:

Originally posted by grumpy1
What you have heard about Toyota suppling engines in exchange for Brisco getting a start is true but you have the wrong team.Toyota and Paul stoddard have been in negotiations for the past month and from the info I have its nearly a done deal.
Minardi have a one year engine deal where as Jordans is for 2 years.More to the point EJ is talking to Mercedes if you belive the paddock rumours.

The Grumpy1

I'll believe when it is actually a done deal and is announced.

Dani Filth · 2 Aug 2004, 07:43 (Ref:1053733)

F1racing.net .
Jordan sold aparently ..

Christopher · 2 Aug 2004, 13:03 (Ref:1054037)

This be good.

Minardi 2005 - Toyota
Ryan Briscoe
James Courtney
Will Davision/Will Power - Test Driver.

Kicking-back · 2 Aug 2004, 13:06 (Ref:1054041)

Sadly for you, the world of F1 does not revolve around Australia - so the chances of that happening are nil

nkh · 2 Aug 2004, 16:55 (Ref:1054243)

if Minardi is getting a Toyota engine, will they also get some input for the 2005 car? (like Sauber and Ferrari). Just putting a more powerfull engine in the same old Minardi won't move them much forward.

Kicking-back · 2 Aug 2004, 17:04 (Ref:1054247)

er, it's only grumpy1 who's saying Minardi - most reports say Jordan.

Super Tourer · 2 Aug 2004, 17:40 (Ref:1054265)

The Minardi Toyota rumour was based around Toyota 'placing' Briscoe in a drive as part of a contra deal. Elsewhere, I have read that Toyota have told Briscoe he needs towards contribute towards an F1 budget, which may only extend to Toyota Australia supporting him directly, so in effect it is wooden dollars being pushed around a table.

However, if this is the case, the 'price' of a drive may be a factor and Minardi would be cheaper.

This is going to one of those deals with several deals beneath it IMO. For example EJ has offered use of the Jordan wind tunnel as part of an engine deal to Toyota. A lot also depends on Toyota's and Jordan's joint aspirations.

IF Jordan is sold gets major investment and is able to hire a good design team, then all of a sudden EJ represents a useful foil to a team like Toyota, who have failed to make a great impact and by rotation blame either the car or the drivers for lack of performance. A decently penned Jordan, with at least one good driver in the car would provide a benchmark for the factory team and some impetus to 'get on with it, as it were.

nkh · 2 Aug 2004, 23:29 (Ref:1054515)

as we're talking about rumours I assume one can be as good as the other... The Jordan link seams more likely, but it still got me thinking about how Minardi could use the engines if they get them.

Kicking-back · 3 Aug 2004, 08:57 (Ref:1054808)

The Jordan one is a properly sourced speculative piece, from a respected news organisation.

The Minardi one is dreaming!

nkh · 3 Aug 2004, 15:34 (Ref:1055214)

but an interesting dream!

Logrence · 3 Aug 2004, 20:07 (Ref:1055501)

Quote:

Originally posted by Kicking-back
The Jordan one is a properly sourced speculative piece, from a respected news organisation.

The Minardi one is dreaming!

Speculative piece!

Some hack's dreaming versus our dreaming.

I know which one I prefer.

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