Peugeot 2010-2011 (Temporarily Closed)

[Victor_RO]

Originally Posted by Bentley03

Does anyone think this isn't a test mule built up around a 908 tub?

That's my impression, it's a 908 all the way up to the end of the driver compartment; behind that, it's all-new all-different.

[Félix]

Definitely a 908 tub and front aero package. Some change to the wheel pod extension and the back of the car is completely new. The real 90X part on the car is the gearbox, and attached to the back of that gearbox is a new rear wing. That new bellhousing-gearbox is needed for a new engine but also to add/experiment with an electric motor. Sidepods are lower because 500-550 hp needs less cooling than 700, and they have improved the flow over the rear deck by downsizing stuff behind the tub.

Peugeot don't even know whether the 90X will be hybrid or not, and they are even open to running cars of both types at LM if they feel that's better (publicity on one side, chances of victory on the other?). The roof intake is certainly there to cool something new behind the engine; maybe a KERS system. It looks oversized and its legality could be questionable (size, distance to top) but it doesn't look temporary either since it's well finished/wrapped in reflective silver. The two snorkels could be for brakes only or left there as a decoy; but if they are for turbos, then there are two and that rules out the atmospheric engine option. A 2-liter I4 derived from the WRC engine always seemed possible to me, but I guess they comissioned a new smaller diesel.

[Laurent]

If you wanna compare 90X and 908

[Bentley03]

Originally Posted by Laurent

If you wanna compare 90X and 908

Excellent, thanks for that Laurent!

In your opinion, is this the 2011 car, or a test mule based on a 908 tub? I'm wondering if Peugeot have decided to retain the 908 tub, thus producing a 908/11?

[Laurent]

Originally Posted by Bentley03

Excellent, thanks for that Laurent!

In your opinion, is this the 2011 car, or a test mule based on a 908 tub? I'm wondering if Peugeot have decided to retain the 908 tub, thus producing a 908/11?

When you look carefully at the pix, it really seems that the nose is different from the 908 at the junction between crash-box and tub. Therefore, I think it's a brand new car and tub though yesterday, I was thinking exactly the opposite...

[Acid09]

Hm, looking at those comparisons, the front part seems to be different than the 908.

Look at the third picture, the windscreen angle is different and the front sidepods are shaped slightly different as well.

[Bentley03]

Originally Posted by Acid09

Hm, looking at those comparisons, the front part seems to be different than the 908.

Look at the third picture, the windscreen angle is different and the front sidepods are shaped slightly different as well.

Those were my thoughts too. The nose also appears to be shorter, but that may just be a trick of the camera angle.

[Bentley03]

Originally Posted by Laurent

When you look carefully at the pix, it really seems that the nose is different from the 908 at the junction between crash-box and tub. Therefore, I think it's a brand new car and tub though yesterday, I was thinking exactly the opposite...

Yep, I'm definitely coming round to that way of thinking.

I hate their application of the sharks fin. Only Oreca (with the 03) have managed to blend it in to the design with any sympathy.

[CTD]

Doesn't it seem that the front wheel arches has been made wider!?.

But Peugeot do like to do evolutions of their cars, so maybe this years car will only be a 908 Evo. 2?, and later we will see the real 90X.

But i think that Peugeot has made a 90X tub and fitted all the finished pieces (ei. Engine, transmission etc.), the remaining parts (the front end and basic aerodynamics) are simply modified to fit the 90X, and will changed later.
The advantage of this is that Peugeot can get a lot of testing km on the finished parts, and still have room for designing the aerodynamics to be fitted later on, without too many suspicious eyes.

But in the Peugeot Press Release, the "90X" is fitted with HDI FAP stickers!, do they have two chassis running?

[The Badger]

I like that roof intake ..... looks more ..... sportscar like .

That vertical fin looks hideous , infact , the whole rear end looks abysmal .

[Laurent]

Official pix were not shot in Monza, so it does not mean that they already have two differents cars ready.

[Lola T70]

Normally it has to be a new tub if it is mated to a new engine configuration which would have it's mounting points in a different position.

I am wondering by Famin's comments if they are looking at a small diesel or a petrol hybrid.

[Simmi]

Visually it is disappointing to see so few differences. To the man in the street it just looks like the old car with a numb fin added on. It's not inconceivable that Peugeot are trying new aero out in a windtunnel somewhere. Or as others have said they are playing games. Or like I said before if you have a front end package that works, why fix it.

As for Famin saying no decision has been made on a powerplant. I find that incredible if he is telling the truth. Which I highly doubt.

[Lola T70]

Originally Posted by Simmi

Visually it is disappointing to see so few differences. To the man in the street it just looks like the old car with a numb fin added on. It's not inconceivable that Peugeot are trying new aero out in a windtunnel somewhere. Or as others have said they are playing games. Or like I said before if you have a front end package that works, why fix it.

As for Famin saying no decision has been made on a powerplant. I find that incredible if he is telling the truth. Which I highly doubt.

Hybrid is not an easy system to make work in an LMP1 I assume, and now I would not be surprised if they were looking at that option with a standard diesel as back up. Similar idea to what Audi did with open and closed car in 1999 (hopefully with more success)

[vyselegend]

I'm puzzled by that statement from Famin, that this is the 90X.

The front end is so 908ish (actually I still can't find any of the differences you seem to have found, for me it's 100% a 908 front cover). I want to believe that the front end will change a lot before march, but if indeed it's the 90X tub, it probably won't.

I mean, a tub is made to be safe with a certain crash structure, any changes made to the crash structure would need new tub as well (or am I wrong?). As I don't think Peugeot would risk driver safety in order to hide some aero stuff, I guess the car lapping Monza has a tub made for the 908 front crash structure (with the F1 style crashbox and the horrible struts).

I fear if this is the 90X tub we will have to live with those terrible pillars for some more years, with the addition now of the terrible fin as well. sigh...

Thinking more about it, the Le Mans package since 2009 seems awkward, with the pillars hindering the concept (or so it feels). I've always thought the only reason the pillars stayed was because they had no choice, as ditching them would have meant need for a new crash test/ homologation.
Now they have an occasion to rethink it, I can't believe they won't!

I'm pleased they choose to raise the rear lights up, R10 style. It seems they are done with rear lights being reaped off at every slight contact from behind. Top position is safer.

[merlot brougham]

You guys COULD wait for actual people associated with actual programs to confirm what the heck is going on, or you could continue the rampant speculation disguised by "I am certain..." and then flip out when someone disagrees. Of course, everyone seems to only be concerned with whether they are "right" or not. I don't think anyone wins a prize if they are right though. Sigh.

Anyway, to me it looks like a series of small optimizations at each area to create an overall different package. Which is what should be expected in this day and age. No one is going to start with a completely clean slate because of cost and time.

[Laurent]

Originally Posted by vyselegend

The front end is so 908ish (actually I still can't find any of the differences you seem to have found, for me it's 100% a 908 front cover). I want to believe that the front end will change a lot before march, but if indeed it's the 90X tub, it probably won't. .

It's not a 908 front cover.

On this image, you can clearly see that there is not anymore this sort of chamfer on each side of the nose, there was on 908. Just to make sure, look at the "Total" sticker and you will see that there is less blue on each side of it on 90X than on 908.

[CTD]

Originally Posted by merlot brougham

No one is going to start with a completely clean slate because of cost and time.

Audi did with the R15!, will do with the R18!.
Im certain () that the final 90X will be a clean sheet too.

[Lola T70]

Originally Posted by merlot brougham

Anyway, to me it looks like a series of small optimizations at each area to create an overall different package. Which is what should be expected in this day and age. No one is going to start with a completely clean slate because of cost and time.

Big problem is the regulations changed quite considerably and so will require a major change in car design but maybe not so much visually, however, people to do not forget what is good about a car and what is bad so there being a trend is not a surprise in my opinion.

[Acid09]

Originally Posted by Simmi

Or like I said before if you have a front end package that works, why fix it.

That's exactly the point, even though the 908 design is more than four years old, the car is still top of the crop... so I don't see the need for drastic changes other than those dictated by the new rules.

Audi has gone into the aerodynamic extremes with the first R15 and it completely backfired so more innovation isn't always leading to better results. Plus, like I said before, Peugeot seems to have a rather conservative approach when it comes to aerodynamics so I´m not exactly surprised that this first impression of the 90X isn't letting everyone's head explode in that regard...

[Lola T70]

In my opinion the big changes before Sebring next year with this car will be in the power system, not the aerodynamics as they already had good efficiency and grip.

[joeb]

Originally Posted by Lola T70

In my opinion the big changes before Sebring next year with this car will be in the power system, not the aerodynamics as they already had good efficiency and grip.

I agree, although the roof scoop, wing, and fin likely changes the aero a bit but they prolly have thay modeled quite nicely already.

[Aysedasi]

Originally Posted by The Badger

I like that roof intake ..... looks more ..... sportscar like .

That vertical fin looks hideous , infact , the whole rear end looks abysmal .

The fin looks stunningly awful - way worse than I'd thought it would be.......

[Lola T70]

I agree the fin is ugly but not as ugly as the accident the Gene had at Le Mans, or Ortelli or Capello in Monza.

[The Badger]

Originally Posted by Lola T70

I agree the fin is ugly but not as ugly as the accident the Gene had at Le Mans, or Ortelli or Capello in Monza.

Why not put square wheels on them all , while your at it