History of a Lola T492 Sports 2000 chassis?

[911thillclimber]

How about this?
The previous owner tells me the car IS a T 492, the front rad holes were cut when the chassis became a 'Karmann Ghia silhouette racer. It had a 'saloon style' roll cage and side pod mounted rads.

[911thillclimber]

[eamonn ledwidge]

Looks like a great project, however the absence of a chassis plate is a concern - there is no real reason to remove it, it was rivetted on in the first instance.

The Lola website contains details of the Sports 2000 cars with a listing of current owners who have been identified. There will be an archivist at Lola with access to all the old records who may be able to help re chassis/suspension etc. Indeed, there may even be someone on staff from the old days who can throw some light on your car & help identify it as one 'missing an action'.

An email to Lola with a few photos may help your quest.

Good luck!

[driftwood]

Looking at the front brakes they are nt S2000 sec they are F3000 brembo calipres 4 pot and vented discs
rear end is march rear uprights
looking at the Rad duct holes on side i think that full lengtgh panel is an add on to accomodate wider bodywork and nmot teh standard width lola tub
roll cage is sports car not saloon car as it would need to come down across the dash windscreen area i cannnot see mounting holes drilled or a plate that would have sat there

I think you now need to go to a S200 meeting where there will be T490-2 cars runninmg to inspect the tubs and front suspension- im not convinced the wishbones are Lola seem to big

[driftwood]

lola doesnt have many staff these days & those that are there are more young design guys than old hand workers
going to a race meeting wil be a quicker method of checking out the cars

[911thillclimber]

Thanks for the comments as ever.

Driftwood: You are very very close to the detail!

The chassis has the rivit holes for the Lola plate, and these have rivits in (tight) to blank them off!
I know of an early 490 that was 'written-off' and rebuilt, but the owner then kept the chassis plate. The side pontoon might have been replaced in the distant past by another? Could this tub be the rebuilt tub?

The 'outrigger pods' are non standard. They are 25mm wider each side than the new body (T 492) I have and are drilled to take panel clips to hold down anther body in the past.

The roll cage is nearly new. The previous owner had them made to replace the saloon style cage which was on the car in 2005 and the 'Karmann Ghia' body was ditched at the same time.

The front suspension used the Lola tub's pick-up points, as does the rear to the tub, but the rest is March F2.

This car will be a 'bitza' hillclimb car albeit with a Pinto/Hewland Mk9 box as all the mountings are there as Lola did in 77/78.

I would love to put a Rover V8 in there, but i can't stand to cut-off the lola rear frame!

This is a great project, i would love to find the 'HU' number but it is not that important. It is so far away from a real T 490/492 as to have lost a lot of it's value as a Classic Sports 2000.

Some on the Sports 2000 site hate the car and my intensions!

Ten-Tenth site has been far and away the very best site for help, thanks to you all!

Graham.

[911thillclimber]

[911thillclimber]

[911thillclimber]

Please see bottom of page 3!

[Dan Rear]

Graham, are you saying it IS a genuine T490, or was at one point? These pics certainly look like a real 1977-style T490, tho' I can't recall any in red in period. The Bell & Colvill car was, but I think that was a 1978 T492.

[Steve Wilkinson]

Originally Posted by 911thillclimber

This car will be a 'bitza' hillclimb car albeit with a Pinto/Hewland Mk9 box as all the mountings are there as Lola did in 77/78.

I would love to put a Rover V8 in there, but i can't stand to cut-off the lola rear frame!

Graham.

Graham, you can of course fit other engines besides the Pinto as the Ford Zetec and Duratec engines should bolt straight in. Beware of the Hewland Mk 9 box though as it wasn't as strong as some. A chat with Ron Hand on how to strengthen the casing should be of benefit. Also if you are just running in speed events then you will not need a reverse gear so can fit the double width first.

I would avoid putting any engine of greater than 2000cc as there are so few cars in the Over 2 Litre Sports libre class.

I wouldn't stop delving into the background of the car and I would also see if you could track down the old Special Saloon body molds!

Keep us informed of your progress and I look forward to seeing the car on track next year or earlier?

[driftwood]

The chassis has the rivit holes for the Lola plate, and these have rivits in (tight) to blank them off!OK this starts to tell us it was a pukka Lola tub what you still need to do is dot i`s cros T`s buy locating each owner to establish which car it is/ was
I know of an early 490 that was 'written-off' and rebuilt, but the owner then kept the chassis plate. that car rebuilt with its plate becomes a continuation car so its still the real McCoyThe side pontoon might have been replaced in the distant past by another? Could this tub be the rebuilt tub?could be the old shunted discarded tub if so then its just a tub not a Lola car anymore

The 'outrigger pods' are non standard. They are 25mm wider each side than the new body (T 492) I have and are drilled to take panel clips to hold down anther body in the past.removing them means yr t492 body will be a better "fit"

The roll cage is nearly new.is this a copy of a pukka T490 esk rollcage or what the guys decided would do? The previous owner had them made to replace the saloon style cage which was on the car in 2005 and the 'Karmann Ghia' body was ditched at the same time.this nameless man must have fotos of the car prior to playing around with it all

The front suspension used the Lola tub's pick-up points, as does the rear to the tub, but the rest is March F2.so the rear is full march f2 but what front uprights are utilised?

This car will be a 'bitza' hillclimb car albeit with a Pinto/Hewland Mk9 box as all the mountings are there as Lola did in 77/78.

I would love to put a Rover V8 in there, but i can't stand to cut-off the lola rear frame!no dont go down that route too much hassle plus as Steve said fit 2 litre to run in that class HOWEVER it is stil not impossible to revert to pukka lola IF you can trace the ownership in detail as the cost of buying new lola uprights etc can be counter acted by the sale of March parts ( let me know if u do wanna sell em off) and teh original wishbones etc will not be la la money brakes are street car type so nothing is that special

This is a great project, i would love to find the 'HU' number but it is not that important. It is so far away from a real T 490/492 as to have lost a lot of it's value as a Classic Sports 2000.It is still retrievable IF u can locate its history

[911thillclimber]

As ever, thank you all.

It was sold to me as a T492, and the last owner insists it is. The design of front bar is following the 490 as the 492 was different. The cage hoops are not Lola, but reprenstations of them. Well made mind, and they are staying.

The front uprights are 'custom' made, but I have not looked too closely yet, and the rear will stay as it all looks so robust.(and fits!)

As to hillclimb classes, sports Libre is poorly supported. At Shelsley Walsh last weekend there were 2 cars, 3 drivers. All are 2 litre or less (one a Pilbeam with a Millington.)

The Pinto i have on the way will go on the Hewland, and i must have a revers. You do a fair bit of reversing in the hillclimb paddock!
I can fit Mk5 gears? (4 speed box)

This car was being re-built with a 500bhp ish Cosworth engine and an FT200, but he wanted 8K for the pair, far too much for me.

If i can sell my hillclimb Impreza the car might be on for 2009, but in reality I think late 2009 for a full 2010.

I will keep on trying to get back into the car's history!

Graham

[driftwood]

1 for the pinto u will need mk8 4 speed no lsd or mk9 5 speed with lsd allow £1200-2500 for a good box
2 8k for the cossy and ft200 was a good deal go back and get yr $ out if u dont want it pleas erefer him to me i need ft200 my mate is rs cossy man will tak ethe motor
3 poorly supported classes mean YOU become the big fish in small pond = lots of trophies for you plus you assist the growth of that class by competing there !!

[911thillclimber]

Will mention the box/engine to Mike tomorrow.
The box is fully reworked, chromated etc and looks a treat.

I have a carb-free built Pinto for £750 and Mike just so happens to have 3 Mk9's under his bench....
I recon a Mk 9 with Mk5 gears and a LSD with inboard brake dogbones should be 2K (I hope)

From the Class support side, going into the class will assure an entry too!

[rcarr]

Have you tried speaking to Lola?

Could be a Chevron? The Chimp? Does anyone know of its where abouts?

[911thillclimber]

Driftwood: YHPM

The car IS a 492.
It had a Karmann ghia body on it in WHITE

It is not 'Doc' Enderby's car for sure.

Now, did Karmann Ghia make the VW Varient bodies?
Back a few pages on here was a white VW Varient and the rear wheels on that car are exactly as mine are today, but polished.

Any thoughts?

Mike has told me all he knows of the car's history.

Now is the time to discuss with Lola as I have all the facts I can find to help them, but I'm not too hopeful of finding my cars 'HU XX' chassis number.
I'll keep you informed.

Thanks so far!
Graham.

[petestenning]

Hawkers DFVW would have been around 500 BHP but wasn that out before S2000 came along ?


Pete

[driftwood]

1 the CHIMP WAS A CHEVRON b19 AND ITS RACING TODAY IN ORWELL
2 DFVW WAS DUCKHAMS DE CADANET 1972 LM CAR NOW REBUILT AS THAT CAR
3 VW variant was factory car not Karhman & Ghia where a seperate coachwork firms not factory companies

[911thillclimber]

Hillclimbing this weekend at Loton Park, and met someone there who actually raced in the Wendy Wools championship. Should get a bit of info from him tomorrow I hope!

[driftwood]

wendy wools/donington GT races whats to say I wasnt there then?!!
won the championship twice

[911thillclimber]

Just a chance conversation with him yesterday, and he had all manner of info.
He can only remember the Enderby Black Ghia and the other cars mentioned on here, and repeated everything you have already stated (never doubted your info!)
I'm still drawing a blank on this car's history.

Maybe it raced in outer Mongolia, and not Brands....

The wider side pods with sets of body over-centre clips down their lengths though means some kind of body was on it once.

[Steve Wilkinson]

Originally Posted by 911thillclimber

The wider side pods with sets of body over-centre clips down their lengths though means some kind of body was on it once.

Maybe it is the Lola that Keith Messer 'rebodied' which eventually was campaigned by Paul Turner & Ian Fidoe on the hills?

There does seem to be a lot of guesswork over this one!!!

[driftwood]

why does the seller to you not have foto of the car or call the man he got it from to write a confirmation letter of what the car was and provide a foto
if that cant be done im drawing the conclusion it was not ghia body fitted

[911thillclimber]

Steve, was at Loton today, but didn't get to Ian Fidoe who was there in the Pilbeam.
Any other info on that car ?

The recent past does seem rather misty to say the least!