[FIA GT] '10 GT1 WC Round 3 • Brno • May 21st-23rd

[AUSRSR]

Bamboozled as to why my live stream still doesn't work. Hasn't worked for any of the races

[Gil Abobeleira]

Much better race today, with various overtaking moves that yesterday's race lacked.

[JayBMS]

Originally Posted by NightStalk3r

Im sorry but those Lamborghini's are simply NOT safe for racing!

http://www.foltyn.cz/car/lambo.htm

they need to recall all thoes cars

[mark_l]

Originally Posted by JayBMS

they need to recall all thoes cars

When the seatbelts fail so completely and the onboard extinguisher is ejected from the car in the impact and the fuel tank fails, after all the car is mid engined and the front of the car is wrecked by fire, then that suggest the car is totally unsafe for racing.

[Marcel ten Caat]

I saw the Super Trofeo accident at Brno in real life and I was not planning to say anything about it on ten-tenths...but I will do now as I think some of the comments here are just rubbish.

First of all, the websites showing these images, especially the ones zoomed in on the driver before the car comes to a stop...let's just say I hope they enjoy their record number of hits. Most of the major websites decided not to show these graphic images and I know everything was done to take images offline at various sites including the page linked to in this thread. Imagine you're a relative and you see these images of your loved one...

Second, it's easy to point a finger at the manufacturer(s). But please refrain from any comment on who is to blame for this accident and what parts failed. A comment that these cars should be recalled or are absolutely unsafe for racing is just utter b*llsh*t. Let me assure you that the organisers and manufacturer(s) will do everything to prevent this from happening again...whatever it was that made it happen the way it happened.

Seeing just a few minutes of a video, a photo sequence of the crash or forum-talk does not give you the inside information on what happened. So let's not talk about it here as if you're all experts in this case....as you're not (and nor am I!)

Regards,
Marcel ten Caat

[rich07]

Just watched the championship race, some great battles there, so much better then the qualifying race.

[cptkablamo]

Thanks Marcel. I think that needed to be said.

[Yakuncha]

Re: Trofeo crash - Opinions made on the internet dont matter much, also there is a reason that these signs are on display everywhere at circuits

[RJC_pt]

These lanbos are not prepared by reiter, are they?

[stuart thompson]

Originally Posted by Stranger

I saw the Super Trofeo accident at Brno in real life and I was not planning to say anything about it on ten-tenths...but I will do now as I think some of the comments here are just rubbish.

First of all, the websites showing these images, especially the ones zoomed in on the driver before the car comes to a stop...let's just say I hope they enjoy their record number of hits. Most of the major websites decided not to show these graphic images and I know everything was done to take images offline at various sites including the page linked to in this thread. Imagine you're a relative and you see these images of your loved one...

Second, it's easy to point a finger at the manufacturer(s). But please refrain from any comment on who is to blame for this accident and what parts failed. A comment that these cars should be recalled or are absolutely unsafe for racing is just utter b*llsh*t. Let me assure you that the organisers and manufacturer(s) will do everything to prevent this from happening again...whatever it was that made it happen the way it happened.

Seeing just a few minutes of a video, a photo sequence of the crash or forum-talk does not give you the inside information on what happened. So let's not talk about it here as if you're all experts in this case....as you're not (and nor am I!)

Regards,
Marcel ten Caat

So just to clarify how is the poor bloke? I just hope he's ok.

[The Badger]

Originally Posted by Yakuncha

Re: Trofeo crash - Opinions made on the internet dont matter much, also there is a reason that these signs are on display everywhere at circuits

Yeah , agree with that big time .

[Marcel ten Caat]

Last update the organisers had was that he remained in intensive care in hospital in Brno, where his condition was stable.

[chernaudi]

I feel that this has to be said big time. I'm no expert on racing saftey or how to build a race car. That being said, with it being easier than ever to sue someone and get something out of it among other things, most motorsports sanctioning bodies and car makers try to do what they can to reduce the chance of injury or death in racing accidents.

However, we must understand and to an extent accept that these measures aren't cure-alls. Racing is a hazardous sport like American football, soccer/football, baseball, or any major professional sport. Each sport has it's hazards and risks for personal injury. Race drivers know that when you strap yourself into a race cars, bad things can and sometimes do happen.

Everyone does what they can, but injury or even death isn't 100% unavoidable, even with technology as good as it is today. In 2005, Julian Alfario died from a basilar skull fracture in a touring car race in Argentina inspite of wearing a HANS device, which is inteneded to reduce the chance of such an injury: http://www.motorsportmemorial.org/fo...p?db=ct&n=3295

Also, Ashley Cooper died from a broken neck and severe internal head injures at Adelade during at V8 Supercars touring series race inspite of wearing a HANS.

I'm not trying to be tasteless, but we got to remember that racing is a risky profession and that people do occasionally get seriously injured or die doing what they love to do. The appeal of racing is that ordianary men do extrodinary things. But it's just like being in the military. Those ordinary men who do those extordinary things are heroes. But those who sacrfice themselves for what they do, they are beyond heroic.

As long as it's within human nature to push the evelope and go faster and make things better from that stand point, people are going to get hurt of sometimes killed. And as long as mankind continues to learn from tragedy, things will get better from a saftey standpoint as well. However, it's better to be proactive and take every precaution to ensure saftey. Sometimes, that means walking away from the car, and it takes as big a man to do that as trying to tough it out. Brian Vickers, among others, will atest to that.

Thankfully, the guy in that accident seems like he'll pull though. And hopefully, the series sanctioning body and Lamborghini will learn from this to make a better and safer product if possible. Saftey is a moving target, and you'll never make racing 100% safe. But we should commend those who try anyways.

[Matt]

Now I'm probably going to be in the minority here, but those belts failing the way they did are probably what saved him from being even more injured. If you look at the way he was laying after the car came to a rest, the majority of his body was away from the brunt of the flames, and when the AMR crew member got to him, he just had to pull him away without fiddling with anything.

If the belts had stayed like they did, he woulda been just sitting in the seat in the middle of all the fire, and the person having to pull him out would have had to deal with all the buckles needing to be undone, then lifting him out of the seat and over the rollcage out to the ground. That amount of time would have led to, most likely 3rd degree burns all over his body at the minimum.

I know we like to promote safety of racecars, but this is the time we should be glad the car failed as it did.

[Victor_RO]

Endurance-Info reports that Bartocci is now being treated for his burns and injuries in Rome, and he's on the road to recovery, although it's posted that it will probably be a "slow and painful recovery". Not surprising considering how awful that accident was.

[dxk1]

Finally saw the replay of the Championship race today. Must say, Enge/Turner drove brilliantly after Enge's opening gaffe, but the pit-work was absolutely masterful. Grosjean/Mutch also did a great job as did their pit crew. The Corvette pit-work and driving were totally uninspired except for Marc Hennerici who was able to pull his car up to 8th after a dismal start. Karl Wendlinger also seems uninterested this year.

DK

[AndrewF31]

I haven't seen Brno yet but it seems the Vettes have been slowed down, or is it all their doing? I remember at Silverstone, it was mentioned that the performance balancing was put in place for the Vettes after they did well at Yas Marina. And we saw what it meant. Hasn't FIA seen what they've done?
The Vettes didn't even dominate Yas Marina. They were in a fight the whole races with the Maserati and the Ford GT.
Why haven't they Performance Balanced the Maseratis that have been consistently near the front all season?
Part of the reason I'm ignoring GT1 and only watching GT3.

[Purist]

They DID balance the Maseratis; they ADDED 35kg to the car's minimum weight after Yas Marina. The Corvettes got 40kg after Yas Marina, probably because they were consistently the fastest cars down the straights.

The main thing that was out of kllter at Silverstone was the 50kg less that the Astons had to carry, but that got reasonably sorted for Brno.

Could someone please give a rundown of the changes so far this year? It's a bit confusing trying to dig all of the relevant figures out of those bulletins. From what I saw, the only change, aside from success ballast, between Silverstone and Brno was the weight (25kg, I think) added back onto the Aston's minimum weight.

[Peat]

New angle: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8oLVxSwhyzo

Doesn't shower the fire marshals in any more glory if you ask me....

[Yakuncha]

Thats crazy, crazy as in ridiculous,they seem more interested in putting out the fire than rescuing the driver. How many times would firemen respond to a housefire and put out the fire 1st, THEN rescue anyone who was trapped? Im still sticking with my other reply regarding this; 'Motorsport can be Dangerous'

[AndrewF31]

Originally Posted by Purist

They DID balance the Maseratis; they ADDED 35kg to the car's minimum weight after Yas Marina. The Corvettes got 40kg after Yas Marina, probably because they were consistently the fastest cars down the straights.

The main thing that was out of kllter at Silverstone was the 50kg less that the Astons had to carry, but that got reasonably sorted for Brno.

Could someone please give a rundown of the changes so far this year? It's a bit confusing trying to dig all of the relevant figures out of those bulletins. From what I saw, the only change, aside from success ballast, between Silverstone and Brno was the weight (25kg, I think) added back onto the Aston's minimum weight.

You've probably been looking at this page?
http://www.fia.com/en-GB/sport/champ.../Pages/gt.aspx

It's amazing how much information is there after just 3 races hahah.

So the Maserati is now 1235 compared to 1240 for the Vette. I don't get the differentiation and why the Ford didn't get anything. The Maseratis were far more consistent then the Vettes at Yas Marina.

That video really shows how much of a heroes those 4 guys were. And it's a shame the first one, who is seen ****ed off at the end, had to basically push the firefighter to ease the fire around the cockpit to allow them to pull the guy out.
We haven't had an update about Bartocci or Tiemann lately. Hope both are well.

[rich07]

I've read elsewhere that Tiemann is still in an induced coma but things are looking better, although still being cautious though.

[Purist]

The Maserati is fine where it is, if they pull some of the other guys up.

It's a bit skewed, since the second Matech car missed some races, but still, it looks like the Ford GTs have about the worst average results of all six cars. Next up from the bottom are the Lambos, followed by the Nissans. Even with the second Phoenix car missing Brno, the Corvettes are still third in the pecking order, and the Masers only had a slightly better average finish at Abu Dhabi by comparison.

If it wasn't for the Championship Race at Abu Dhabi, the Astons might actually have a better finishing average than the Maseratis.

The Lamborghinis and Nissans could definitely still use some easing of restrictions. The Corvettes could use some weight taken off, but I'd give them slightly smaller restrictors, because of their consistently high top-end speeds. The Fords could maybe do with a slightly larger restrictor for better top-end, or just leave them alone. The Astons, in their Brno trim, seem about right as well.

I think the Maserati overall performance has as much as anything to do with the polish and finesse of the Vitaphone team. With the current rules, the car's performance isn't inherently the issue I don't think. So, stifling the car further I suspect would put them on a significant downward trend in results going forward.

If you really want the numbers, I can post a spreadsheet to back up my thoughts on the matter.