[FIA GT] GT1 FIA = GT1 ACO according to Stephane Ratel

[Rodger Davies]

I'm just waiting to watch Primetime's Viper in GT1...

[fiend540]

So apparently they want a maximum of 6 different cars for the series. Seems pretty silly to limit the amount of manufactures, you would think they would welcome anyone who wants to play.

[Rodger Davies]

slightly off topic, what engine is being used in Chevrolet's new GT2?

[JHamilton]

I would imagine it's a variant of the 6.2L LS3.

[Speed-King]

Originally Posted by fiend540

So apparently they want a maximum of 6 different cars for the series. Seems pretty silly to limit the amount of manufactures, you would think they would welcome anyone who wants to play.

Ratel says that no more than 24cars can be transported around the world at viable costs that can be taken over by the local race promoters. On the other hand, he wants to give every manufacturer the ability to make building those cars somewhat commercially viable. The logic conlusion is to limit the number of manufacturers.

[WMUCarGuy]

Originally Posted by Rodger Davies

slightly off topic, what engine is being used in Chevrolet's new GT2?

This year it'll use a destroked LS7.R (GT1 motor), next year it'll use a 5.5L V8, either a further destroked GT1 motor or a *****in LS3/LS9 - the SC.

[HORNDAWG]

Originally Posted by Rodger Davies

slightly off topic, what engine is being used in Chevrolet's new GT2?

As JHamilton and WMUCarGuy said, in '09 it will be the LS7.R destroked to 6.0L and in '10 and beyond it will be an LS3.R 5.5L


L.P.

[Bob Riebe]

Originally Posted by Rodger Davies

slightly off topic, what engine is being used in Chevrolet's new GT2?

It is simply a version of the LS engine.
It does not have to be de-stroked this, or a version of that.
An LS is an LS.
What ever cylinder heads are desired will be used and the same for the crankshaft & valve-train.

[notguilty]

so we have Nissan, Ford/Matech and Lambo going into the 2010 season. Any ideas so to the other three entries? Porsche Ferrari Corvette Aston Martin? Could the new Massa GT4 car be upgraded? Personely I want the Morgan to step up!

[JAG]

Originally Posted by Fogelhund

Some, but not all.......... I believe the original intention was to have GT1 strictly for cars above 5.0l. Cars in GT2 for below 5.5l. Cars inbetween could choose.

Were's the logic in this?

A Ferrari 430 and 911 GT3 have 4l-4.5l engines, but are direct rivals, price and performance wise, to large capacity cars like the Viper.

[FIRE]

Ratels 2010 GT1/GT2 plans (august '08):
http://endurance-info.com/article.php?sid=6120

[Fogelhund]

Originally Posted by JAG

Were's the logic in this?

A Ferrari 430 and 911 GT3 have 4l-4.5l engines, but are direct rivals, price and performance wise, to large capacity cars like the Viper.

Don't ask me where Steve Rat gets his "logic" from. His statement was that he wanted cars to be "superior" to other series, so that it could identified/perceived as a valid world championship.

[PorscheFanNo1]

Steve Rat should make a way to get the 911 and 430 (and similar) into the GT1 rules, let them run 100 kilo lighter for cars under 5 litre, or let them run 5% bigger restrictors, or both! Would not only be good to see them in the top class where they belong and should be, but also add some exitement as they probably would be more competetive on twisty track like Adria and less so on fast tracks like Monza and Spa, add some diversity to the feild!

[chunterer]

Originally Posted by PorscheFanNo1

Steve Rat should make a way to get the 911 and 430 (and similar) into the GT1 rules, let them run 100 kilo lighter for cars under 5 litre, or let them run 5% bigger restrictors, or both! Would not only be good to see them in the top class where they belong and should be, but also add some exitement as they probably would be more competetive on twisty track like Adria and less so on fast tracks like Monza and Spa, add some diversity to the feild!

Do the 911 and 430 really belong in a GT 'top class'??

Porsche doesn't have a big banger model basis at the moment but surely a Ferrari 599 or 612 variant truly belongs in the 'top class?

If only Ferrari could be bothered to knock something together, it would be dead easy for them to do that!!

[chewymonster]

A turbo 911 certainly has the performance to play with the others, but they can pull a Nissan and stick their SUV V8 into the 911. Too bad it's only a 4.8 liter.

Interesting that Corvette will be using a 5.5 liter V8 in the GT2, sound like it's FIA GT1 ready.

[pitviper]

Perhaps I need to apply at SRO, because I seem to be one of the only people who is actually excited about this concept ;-)

I think that there is still enough room for the new GT1, even with GT2 and GT3, and that's taking into account the hurting global economy right now. When it is on the upswing, the new GT structure will already be well established and allow even more stability when handling new teams as they begin making their way back into the fold.

Also, there plenty enough "eligible" cars in order to have three classes be well subscribed. If GT2 was the highest thing there was, there would be no place for the "true" supercars to be able to race, such as the Murc. It allows a factory or tuner to build race versions of something like the Pagani or Koenigsegg and potentially race it (don't get me started on the previous Zonda GR and CCGT attempts...). And as was stated, I certainly don't think that the F430 and 911 "belong" in the top class. At least not when they have "higher" offerings waiting in the stable. I would imagine a new GT1 Ferrari looking a bit more like this (albeit with a more appropriate rear wing):
http://www.motorward.com/wp-content/...ri_599xx_1.jpg
http://www.zerotohundred.com/wp-cont...3e3a05b5cb.jpg

The it will actually be quite interesting to see manufacturers assist a couple of teams each for the World Championship, and then potentially run the bigger "works" programmes themselves at LM24, LMS, ALMS, etc. I for one love the new GT1 cars, and would have even been happy if they would have gone even a bit more "SuperGT" with the look of the cars. I have no doubt that the Reiter Murcielago SV will look absolutely stunning, just like the new Ford GT1 does.

Maybe it's my OCD, but I really like the tiered structure the way it exists right now. I wouldn't mind even having a GT3 National Championship here in the states, to go along with GT2 and GT1 in the ALMS. We have the Speed GT series, which is close-ish, and maybe they could work out the rules where GT3 spec cars were allowed in to make that series even better. I would love to see the GT3 F430 and GT3 Gallardo dicing it up there.

sheesh, it's been a while...

pit

[pitviper]

Oh, and as far as letting the GT1 class go and evolve like they did in the mid-late 90's, I think this is the best of both world's, because the way P1 is shaping up, you are able to have P1 cars that have a bit more of a GTP look to them. In fact, that Aston Martin P1 Coupe is way more "GT" looking than the Toyota GT-One certainly was. There was NO WAY you looked at the TSO20 and said instantly, "Toyota"; with one look at the Aston though, you just know...

This allows the most possible outlets without (in my opinion) saturating the market.

pit

[Rodger Davies]

Originally Posted by HORNDAWG

As JHamilton and WMUCarGuy said, in '09 it will be the LS7.R destroked to 6.0L and in '10 and beyond it will be an LS3.R 5.5L


L.P.

thanks for the clarification guys. I thought 6l too and just wanted to make sure that under the proposed loony-laws the Corvette GT2 will be in a different class to the Porsches and Ferraris with which it is built (both on and off circuit) to compete with.

[geeteeone]

Originally Posted by pitviper

Perhaps I need to apply at SRO, because I seem to be one of the only people who is actually excited about this concept ;-)

You're not alone. I agree 100% with everything you have said. I've never been able to understand the vitriol towards Stephane Ratel. He was one of the people that popularised the modern GT formula with the BPR Series, and has pretty much single-handedly kept GT racing alive since then as a concept in its own right, rather than just a sideshow to the prototypes.

What got me interested in GT cars in the first place was the big banger, large capacity cars. The snorting, fire-breathing cars such as the McLaren, Porsche GT1, Panoz, Marcos, Viper GTS-R, etc. Cars that in street form you might only get to see once in your life, but could watch on a racetrack battling each other. Forget the manufacturers for a minute, Ratel understands that it is these kinds of cars that the public want to watch.

Every few years we seem to lose the top class of GTs, and it becomes slightly more watered down. I recently re-watched some old footage of the original GT1 era, and it actually shocked me how much faster the cars looked than what we have now. If we drop to a GT2-only GT concept, we're taking yet another step in the wrong direction. My boss owns a Ferrari 430. There is a Porsche showroom down the road. I don't particularly get enthused about seeing either on a track as to me they are both very much entry-level sportscars.

I am actually quite a fan of GT3, the franchise concept has worked very well I think, and in some ways the cars look more spectacular than the GT2s, despite slightly slower laptimes. I applaud Ratel's attempt to take the GT3 idea and apply it to GT1. I think we get the best of both worlds - cars that are affordable for teams to run, but are still more awe-inspiring to watch than the current crop of GT2s.

[gwyllion]

Originally Posted by chewymonster

A turbo 911 certainly has the performance to play with the others, but they can pull a Nissan and stick their SUV V8 into the 911. Too bad it's only a 4.8 liter.

A big V8 behind rear wheels? The thing will be doing wheelies on the straights.

[FIRE]

Originally Posted by gwyllion

A big V8 behind rear wheels? The thing will be doing wheelies on the straights.

Porsche could use the Cayman....

[Purist]

And we always come back to this. The reason you have a GT1 class is for the truly top-tier cars, but also because you can't really have that full displacement range work in one GT class. You either hamstring the 8.0-litre Viper, 7.0-litre Corvette and Saleen, or leave the 4.0-litre Porsche gasping on the straights. If the LG Corvette's top-end is any indication, the 911, F430, M3, and others at the smaller end in terms of displacement could be in real trouble. And it's a double wammy to boot. It's clear that the LG Corvette has no lack of torque either, so it can pull off the corners on short circuits, AND pull the straights on larger ones.

If we're going to have a 911 Turbo in GT1, it needs to look significantly less clinical than the GT2 car. This brings me to something else, which I noticed in the photos of that Ferrari from earlier in the thread. That car, particularly with those nose air intakes, looked a bit too much like a 911 or Nissan GTR.

I'm also one of those who definitely prefers having that class of brutish, fire-breathing monsters at the top level of GT. Sorry, but the 911, F430, nd Gallardo just look too clinical to be in the "top" GT1, nor are they an F599, Murcielago, 911 GT2 (much less a Carrera GT), Saleen S7, Maserati MC12, etc. And I think my brother has a point with the GT2-class Ford GT looking slightly squished. It doesn't look bad, but really ought to be one of those cars that simply "pops" out at you, especially in racing trim.

[johntt]

The way I see it we need only one top GT class. GT3 and GT4 are good feeders and should stay.

GT1 has run its course and the best way to go is GT2, we have Porsche, Ferrari, Aston Martin, Panoz and BMW, and soon will have Corvette.

For LMS, ALMS, Asia LMS, and for any kind of World GT Championship just run GT2 cars, limit them to two works cars per series and run an independent's cup in the style of the WTCC.

[Flyin Ryan]

I know nothing of the project, does the Nissan GTR share anything with the JGTC Skyline?

[chunterer]

Originally Posted by Flyin Ryan

I know nothing of the project, does the Nissan GTR share anything with the JGTC Skyline?

Um, just the model name I think......