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Old 12 Nov 2007, 17:06 (Ref:2065744)   #51
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#15 tkm 4/ should be qualifying in the top 10 on the grid
yes, yes i am shocked!

http://www.itv-f1.com/News_Article.aspx?PO_ID=41274

ms to make a comeback? :P
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Old 12 Nov 2007, 17:13 (Ref:2065750)   #52
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f1manoz should be qualifying in the top 5 on the gridf1manoz should be qualifying in the top 5 on the gridf1manoz should be qualifying in the top 5 on the grid
I think this is a mighty big coup for Honda and will revitalise a stale, stalling team. I wouldn't be surprised if Honda have waved a big fat chequebook at Ross while also now demanding success.

Button would have been dancing to this news.

Now all they need to do is design a reliable, efficient car...
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Old 12 Nov 2007, 17:20 (Ref:2065761)   #53
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davyboy: I think you have a valid point re the Japanese style. However, I expect Ross has been negotiating for some time (Button's comments) and he probably has demanded complete autonomy. He likely has been promised this wether in writing or not. If he does get overruled and interfered with to any extent I expect his tenure will be a year or less.
This type of undermining is quite likely a major reason de Ferran left so quickly.
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Old 12 Nov 2007, 18:03 (Ref:2065812)   #54
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I wonder if he will tell Honda what gas Ferrari used in their tyres?

Great stuff, it will be good to have in back in F1.
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Old 12 Nov 2007, 18:08 (Ref:2065816)   #55
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Brawn was once quoted as being impressed by Button. I wonder if he's going to mentor him like he did MS?
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Old 12 Nov 2007, 18:15 (Ref:2065822)   #56
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ralf fan should be qualifying in the top 3 on the gridralf fan should be qualifying in the top 3 on the gridralf fan should be qualifying in the top 3 on the gridralf fan should be qualifying in the top 3 on the grid
Wow. Major coup for Honda. I reckon Ross needed a new challenge to entice him back to f1 and what better challenge than the Honda team who have come off a terrible season.
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Old 12 Nov 2007, 18:25 (Ref:2065826)   #57
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IIRC this was first rumoured around Monza last year...
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Old 12 Nov 2007, 18:25 (Ref:2065827)   #58
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Does anyone else want to say "major coup" before we carry on?
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Old 12 Nov 2007, 18:32 (Ref:2065833)   #59
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I'll be interested to see what he can do for the 08 car, as I'd imagine that it would be pretty close to finalising, perhaps even the main parts in the autoclave cooking.
If its as fundamentally flawed as the 07 car, not even Brawn can work miracles.
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Old 12 Nov 2007, 18:32 (Ref:2065834)   #60
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You have to say the coup was a major one for Honda.
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Old 12 Nov 2007, 18:32 (Ref:2065835)   #61
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Originally Posted by Knowlesy
Does anyone else want to say "major coup" before we carry on?

Yes, Major Coup.

Continue
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Old 12 Nov 2007, 18:34 (Ref:2065839)   #62
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Originally Posted by Leighton Irwin
davyboy: I think you have a valid point re the Japanese style. However, I expect Ross has been negotiating for some time (Button's comments) and he probably has demanded complete autonomy. He likely has been promised this wether in writing or not. If he does get overruled and interfered with to any extent I expect his tenure will be a year or less.
This type of undermining is quite likely a major reason de Ferran left so quickly.
I'm sure Brawn's well aware of the Japanese foibles and as you say has probably negotiated complete autonomy. Reality is often very different, and he may be 'given' an 'assistant' who will actually pull the strings. Dotted reporting lines are a standard feature in the organization chart of a western subsidiary of a Japanese company. I really hope I'm wrong, but I've seen it happen so many times its untrue.
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Old 12 Nov 2007, 18:50 (Ref:2065850)   #63
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So brawn is at Honda, button will be impressed but as people have pointed out they have struggled to come to terms with F1 as a factory. The original effort (1964-1968) produced two wins and this effort has produced one win...

When they came in as a supplier of engines they did well but the inference on this thread is that Japanese corportate method doesn't gel well with F1 success.
Hopefully they will learn or as someone pointed out Ross will go... just as Mike G did from Toyota...
This is Honda's last chance I think or they can forget it. They should give Ross three years of autonomy before expecting a major success.

It makes you wonder if they wouldn't be better spending half the money and simply supplying engines or working in a partnership with a team as Mercedes have done with McLaren...
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Old 12 Nov 2007, 18:55 (Ref:2065855)   #64
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jab should be qualifying in the top 3 on the gridjab should be qualifying in the top 3 on the gridjab should be qualifying in the top 3 on the grid
This is either going to be one of the dampest squibs in F1 history or it'll take Honda to the top long-term
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Old 12 Nov 2007, 19:19 (Ref:2065886)   #65
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And with Honda, it really could go either way...
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Old 12 Nov 2007, 19:37 (Ref:2065898)   #66
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Yes i guess things aren't suddenly going to change with Ross in charge. He brought in a lot of former people when he joined at Ferrari so i guess it is going to be the recruiting behind the scenes that is going to dictate his success. Also i just hope Honda give him time. It took 5 years to win a championship with Ferrari. Honda hopefully will have realistic expectations but you never know.
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Old 12 Nov 2007, 19:39 (Ref:2065900)   #67
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And with Honda, it really could go either way...
It can only go one way, surely?
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Old 12 Nov 2007, 19:46 (Ref:2065904)   #68
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Originally Posted by Peter Mallett
Brawn was once quoted as being impressed by Button. I wonder if he's going to mentor him like he did MS?
Yes I remember him saying that. Somehow I don't think Kimi was his "kind of guy" on a personality level, plus I think he's atttracted by the challenge of making a British World Champion.
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Old 12 Nov 2007, 19:55 (Ref:2065913)   #69
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Somehow I don't think Kimi was his "kind of guy" on a personality level,
What, Ross doesn't drink?

Maybe he didn't want to live in Italy anymore? Maybe he didn't want to work for Ferrari anymore, you have to fully commit otherwise it won't be enoyable. Perhaps his friends were gone.

Whatever, I'm glad to have him back. I've liked him ever since the XJR-14.
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Old 12 Nov 2007, 20:01 (Ref:2065921)   #70
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And sure it will be a very impressive come-back !
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Old 12 Nov 2007, 20:01 (Ref:2065924)   #71
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Yes, he's back on British soil where he belongs now. The man is a legend (Nurburgring 2003 aside).

What we need now is the return of his old NHS glasses, no facial fuzz and pitlane bananas. Just like old times.
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Old 12 Nov 2007, 20:14 (Ref:2065933)   #72
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Yes, he's back on British soil where he belongs now.
It is still a Japanese team.
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Old 12 Nov 2007, 20:17 (Ref:2065937)   #73
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I don't think the impact will be great next year. The 2008 car is already designed. But they should make some sort of improvement. Hopefully. I'd love to see them back at 2006 levels and I think Jens and Rubens will be up for it
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Old 12 Nov 2007, 20:24 (Ref:2065943)   #74
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Originally Posted by ralf fan
It is still a Japanese team.
In the same way that McLaren are Germans/New Zealanders.
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Old 12 Nov 2007, 20:32 (Ref:2065951)   #75
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...and what's the difference anyway ???
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