the grid girl debate

[bella]

Originally Posted by BSchneiderFan

I'd be interested to know what grid girls do the rest of the time.

quite a few of the motorsport ones do it as a way of earning extra cash. others are indeed, professional promotional models. what are you getting at?

women are being used in our sport as decoration and lust objects for men to gawp at whether they make their living out of their appearance or not. i mean, other sports that use women in the same way include darts and boxing. haven't we gone past that kind of attitude in our sport now?

[Akrapovic]

Male models need to make money too. Why are we discriminating against them?

[bjohnsonsmith]

Originally Posted by bella

quite a few of the motorsport ones do it as a way of earning extra cash. others are indeed, professional promotional models. what are you getting at?

women are being used in our sport as decoration and lust objects for men to gawp at whether they make their living out of their appearance or not. i mean, other sports that use women in the same way include darts and boxing. haven't we gone past that kind of attitude in our sport now?

Women have been used in motorsport and the automotive industry as decoration, for as long as I can remember. It's a marketing gimmick, designed to make motorsport and cars sexy and exciting. "You buy this car and you too can attract a sexy girl like this one." "Motorsport is fast and exciting, look at all the girls it attracts."

With attitudes changing, I don't think this sort of marketing has the same relevance today as it used to and there seems to be less of it. I can't remember when I last saw a car advert, with a semi naked woman draped all over it. I see the continued use of grid-girls as a hangover from this mindset and I think it will be only a matter of time, before it is also realised that the continued use of grid-girls is becoming less relevant.

[chillibowl]

To change, or expand on, the question a bit...

Is there a larger issue with the grid culture in general which needs to be modernized?

Rather if grid girls are meant to attract fans then why is there a lack of fans on the grid? Instead we get the old rich guys, politicians, celebs etc. By design its a tradition steeped in exclusion as opposed to a more inclusive culture that most people now days require... a sentiment which I suppose is at the heart of the grid girl debate?

[MGDavid]

Originally Posted by bella

quite a few of the motorsport ones do it as a way of earning extra cash. others are indeed, professional promotional models. what are you getting at?

women are being used in our sport as decoration and lust objects for men to gawp at whether they make their living out of their appearance or not. i mean, other sports that use women in the same way include darts and boxing. haven't we gone past that kind of attitude in our sport now?

|Do you really want a society where a pretty girl no longer turns male heads?

[Akrapovic]

Originally Posted by MGDavid

|Do you really want a society where a pretty girl no longer turns male heads?

There's a world of difference between turning a head and putting them around as props to look at.

[Mekola]

You could see "Grand Prix" movie as a reflect on the grid girl debate...

[RWill2073]

The part of f1 that is the most cringe worthy is not the grid girls, although they are, but the girls lining the stairs and halls the drivers walk up to that cool-down room before the podium. Those girls aren't there for fans or to market anything. Their sole existence is to basically look like "spoils" for the victors as they do nothing but cheer for ajd smile and laugh at whatever the drivers say. It's awkward and kinda creepy.

And to the exclusion point above, I guess for grid walks where fans can walk the grid before a race, grid girls make more sense than an f1 event. There, like said, is just old rich guys and organizers and celebrities, which just makes it look more like the girls are there as spoils for the elite/rich/powerful. And to channel Dennis from "its always sunny in Philadelphia", those girls might feel an "implication", more so than if it was regular fans walking around.

[bjohnsonsmith]

Originally Posted by RWill2073

The part of f1 that is the most cringe worthy is not the grid girls, although they are, but the girls lining the stairs and halls the drivers walk up to that cool-down room before the podium. Those girls aren't there for fans or to market anything. Their sole existence is to basically look like "spoils" for the victors as they do nothing but cheer for ajd smile and laugh at whatever the drivers say. It's awkward and kinda creepy.

And to the exclusion point above, I guess for grid walks where fans can walk the grid before a race, grid girls make more sense than an f1 event. There, like said, is just old rich guys and organizers and celebrities, which just makes it look more like the girls are there as spoils for the elite/rich/powerful. And to channel Dennis from "its always sunny in Philadelphia", those girls might feel an "implication", more so than if it was regular fans walking around.

I know what you mean about cringeworthy but they are there to market the glamour of F1.

[Akrapovic]

Is that what glamour is?

[jp_olifer]

Just read the entire topic and I was surprised that no one mentioned the impact that grid girls have in attracting or repelling female fans to motorsport!
If we consider that the first product motorsport advertises are cars, women are big potential customers, purely from a marketing point of view...

[Mekola]

Originally Posted by jp_olifer

Just read the entire post and I was surprised that no one mentioned the impact that grid girls have in attracting or repelling female fans to motorsport! If we consider that the first product motorsport advertises are cars, women are big potential customers, purely from a marketing point of view...

Well, know a female marshal that is against the politics of the grid grils and is a hardcore feminist in motorsport - she manages a page about female racers in Spanish language.
Wonder if she could put her two cents on the matter...

[morninggents]

Not really bothered either way. Interested to know if anyone is forcing the girls to do the job.

[BSchneiderFan]

Originally Posted by Akrapovic

Male models need to make money too. Why are we discriminating against them?

I'd be all in favour of half-and-half grid girls and boys. Though I think we need to be realistic about the probable gender balance of motor racing fans.

[Akrapovic]

Originally Posted by BSchneiderFan

I'd be all in favour of half-and-half grid girls and boys. Though I think we need to be realistic about the probable gender balance of motor racing fans.

Which is what WEC do (on the grid certainly, I don't know about the paddock). They also dress them all in white jeans and a dark blue T-shirt, with a small WEC logo on them. They are also limited to holding the nations flags at the front of the grid, not in front of each car.

However...if we were to introduce male grid boys onto the BTCC grid and dressed them in lycra...well, then there would suddenly be a lot less people who want that gender balance. It'd also demonstrate just how utterly ludicrous some of the outfits are.

But if we're going down the route of a 50/50 split and sensible clothes, then I'd still make it a fan competition.

[bella]

Originally Posted by BSchneiderFan

I'd be all in favour of half-and-half grid girls and boys. Though I think we need to be realistic about the probable gender balance of motor racing fans.

we're not looking at 50-50 by any means, but there's an awful lot of low key f1 and motorsport fans who are young women, particularly who don't attend races. i'd go as far as saying that the groups of young women who meet up and watch f1 together at several grands prix is probably about equal to the groups of young men... hungary in particular has a HUGE following of young women.

[Graz]

Originally Posted by morninggents

Not really bothered either way. Interested to know if anyone is forcing the girls to do the job.

Obviously they're not being forced. They are models 'doing their job.' The point is more is it really necessary to have a half naked girl there in the first place. I'd say no, I think it's demeaning and unnecessary.

By all means have people (and not just 'perfect' models) stand there if needs be but with clothes on. Like the halo, just stop doing it and people will get used to it. Surely we're there to watch the cars anyway, not leer at the dolly birds.

[ASCII Man]

I wasn't even aware they were still there, but I don't think you should cater to a minority that doesn't even show up to races that just might be offended. That's PC gone too far.

[NaBUru38]

Originally Posted by RWill2073

The part of f1 that is the most cringe worthy is not the grid girls, although they are, but the girls lining the stairs and halls the drivers walk up to that cool-down room before the podium.

Those girls aren't there for fans or to market anything. Their sole existence is to basically look like "spoils" for the victors as they do nothing but cheer for ajd smile and laugh at whatever the drivers say. It's awkward and kinda creepy.

Those are very recent. Alonso didn't have them when he won championships with Renault.

[Akrapovic]

Originally Posted by ASCII Man

I wasn't even aware they were still there, but I don't think you should cater to a minority that doesn't even show up to races that just might be offended. That's PC gone too far.

That makes the assumption that men can't be offended by it either.

[morninggents]

Originally Posted by Graz

Obviously they're not being forced. They are models 'doing their job.' The point is more is it really necessary to have a half naked girl there in the first place. I'd say no, I think it's demeaning and unnecessary.

By all means have people (and not just 'perfect' models) stand there if needs be but with clothes on. Like the halo, just stop doing it and people will get used to it. Surely we're there to watch the cars anyway, not leer at the dolly birds.

To whom is it demeaning? And presumably the people/company behind it must feel it is necessary or they wouldn't pay for it. I, too, would be there to see the cars/racing and probably wouldn't notice if they were there or not. Surely folks don't pay top rank motorsport event prices just to leer!

[Graz]

[QUOTE=morninggents;3789997]To whom is it demeaning? And presumably the people/company behind it must feel it is necessary or they wouldn't pay for it. I, too, would be there to see the cars/racing and probably wouldn't notice if they were there or not. Surely folks don't pay top rank motorsport event prices just to leer![/

Seriously? Stick male models out there in speedos and let's see the reaction. I bet you'd notice that...but it's no different.

The sponsors or their marketing depts obviously have a dim view of Motorsport if they think we need half naked body beautifuls to bolster the appeal.

I don't know, I can't work out if people are sitting on the fence or think it's ok for Motorsport to maintain archaic views that weren't right in the 70s let alone now.

[MGDavid]

Originally Posted by Graz

Obviously they're not being forced. They are models 'doing their job.' The point is more is it really necessary to have a half naked girl there in the first place. I'd say no, I think it's demeaning and unnecessary.

........

the whole of motorsport is unnecessary so let's stop that too shall we.
It's bad for the planet, bad for the environment, bad for utilisation of precious energy resources, it endangers life, it offends and impinges on people who live near tracks etc etc.

[bjohnsonsmith]

Originally Posted by Graz

Obviously they're not being forced. They are models 'doing their job.' The point is more is it really necessary to have a half naked girl there in the first place. I'd say no, I think it's demeaning and unnecessary.

By all means have people (and not just 'perfect' models) stand there if needs be but with clothes on. Like the halo, just stop doing it and people will get used to it. Surely we're there to watch the cars anyway, not leer at the dolly birds.

It's a marketing hangover. I remember in my teens seeing car and bike adverts in magazines, with women being used to promote the product. Check this Esso ad out.

[alan1302]

Originally Posted by MGDavid

the whole of motorsport is unnecessary so let's stop that too shall we.
It's bad for the planet, bad for the environment, bad for utilisation of precious energy resources, it endangers life, it offends and impinges on people who live near tracks etc etc.

No, that's just a little silly.

It's not a about getting rid of something that is unnecessary but getting rid of something that is demeaning to women...and something I personally don't think is needed anymore in motorsport.