750MC Pembrey

[racer-gal]

Originally Posted by The STIG

In my humble opinion, they were the worst drivers of the lot. Even worse than the Stockhatches. Yes, young drivers need somewhere to learn, but why can't they stick to karts?

Because karts and cars are totally different..? And if they went straight to senior championships wouldn't they make the same mistakes..?

We have to remember that the drivers *including myself from july* are only 14 to 17. And for their age, some have amazing ability. On Saturday the driving standards were perfect. Viv was more than happy with them. And then on Sunday the weather conditions changed completely so for quite a few this was their first race in the wet. Yes some drivers had the odd glitch here and there. But as someone said, the championship is there to learn. So just let them do exactly that without complaining about it all the time..?!

[Tim Falce]

[Tim Falce]

or do you all expect them to be perfect like Kimi Raikkonen?

[The STIG]

Originally Posted by Abbie44

how do you know they didn't look?

because if they had looked, they wouldn't have pulled out in front of a much faster competitor... would they?

[MOM]

Originally Posted by The STIG

Lets see, what was wrong?

Cutting across straight out of the pits (you could partially blame me I suppose, but I did try and get them enough space and show them the blue too)
Rejoining a track without looking first (with inevitable consequences)
Ditching a car right on the edge of a circuit and not bailing out for a good 2 minutes, then going and sitting on the edge of the tyre wall.
Deliberate pushing and shoving - BTCC style driving.

In my humble opinion, they were the worst drivers of the lot. Even worse than the Stockhatches. Yes, young drivers need somewhere to learn, but why can't they stick to karts?

Stig, as the mother of one of the Saxmax drivers I think you are very hard on them. Apart from marshalling, just what is your race experience? Yes they make mistakes but remember they are all young drivers learning the craft. Why should they stick to karting? The driver that parked on the side of the circuit could have been injured so why did the marshals not get to her quickly? And before you ask I have supported motor sport for more than 20 years, being the wife of a former driver and I have seen many experienced drivers make more mistakes than these young people. Rather than knock them why not offer constructive criticism.

[racer-gal]

Go MOM

[Abbie44]

Originally Posted by The STIG

because if they had looked, they wouldn't have pulled out in front of a much faster competitor... would they?

true but has it dawned on you that they might be new?
Give them a bit of slack before you start putting them down already in their second race!!

[The STIG]

Originally Posted by racer-gal

We have to remember that the drivers *including myself from july* are only 14 to 17.

The age is irrelevant. once the helmet goes on, they're racing drivers and should behave in both a sporting and [relatively] safe manner. Shoving your fellow competitors off the track is not very sporting! There's accidental contact and then there's "out of my way, I'm coming through". Having said that, I have for a long time suggested that the limit on racing cars should be closer to 18.

On Saturday the driving standards were perfect... And then on Sunday the weather conditions changed completely so for quite a few this was their first race in the wet. Yes some drivers had the odd glitch here and there. But as someone said, the championship is there to learn. So just let them do exactly that without complaining about it all the time..?!

The race was very close on Saturday, and there was much less argy bargy going on, but Sunday more than made up for their good behaviour. If it's your first race in the wet, you'd take it easy, back off a little untill you get used to it - I think all of them had winning in mind and drove like they were in the dry without giving themselves a chance to get used to the conditions. Learning is great, but it should have been done before they even get near a car, not whilst they're racing it and knocking 9 bells out of each other.

And before anyone asks, no I don't like Ginetta Junior either. I don't like the fact that all the drivers have to be chaperoned everywhere (in a tightly packed Parc Ferme area, this is just plain dangerous), and I especially don't like the whole child protection thing of "be carefull of what you say or do with these drivers", presumably in case of litigation.

[The STIG]

Originally Posted by MOM

The driver that parked on the side of the circuit could have been injured so why did the marshals not get to her quickly?

For a start, this was in my section. As soon as the car stopped I reported it. I re-reported it when the driver failed to get out, and reported it again when she did bail out. what happens with my reports is a matter for race control. However, she just pulled off with a mechanical problem, so an injury was unlikely.

Why didn't the marshals not get to her quickly? Put simply they couldn't. the nearest post to her with incident teams was post 8 - a good 800 yards away. More accurately, posts 9 (me) and 1 are closer, but on the wrong side of the track. Aside from report and wave at the car, there isn't much I can do about it without putting myself at unessasary risk.

Since this is already a double post. I'll answer Abbie by pointing out that that is one of the basics of racing, and one which should have been learnt before they even got near a car. Hopefully next year's competitors were watching and learnt from the mistakes made.

[oldpete]

Originally Posted by White flag man

And you've got the crazy gang coming!
I'm staying at Brands, well out of the way.

the crazy gang was welcome to pembery with open arm and we had great weekend and are invited back again .would like to thank the leader for taking us there.G. VINCE from old pete

[MOM]

Surely all drivers go out to win and just where do you suggest they learn before they get near a car? You cannot book lessons or test days and turn the rain on and off. Its one of those things they get with experience. Yes they get it wrong but thats how people learn. Sounds like you just don't like the young ones. What do you think happens on their 18th birthday. They suddenly develop driving skills? As for being chaperoned in Parc Ferme,as the cars are not going anywhere whats one person per car. Maybe with attitudes like yours towards the young drivers and 'the whole child protection thing' its a good job they are not on their own

[racer-gal]

Look guys. It was Zoe's first meeting, so she's only just started learning. And with all the cars being spaced out, there wasn't a sufficiant amount of time for her to get out of the car without the risk of her getting hurt. Also with her car losing all power it wasn't her choice how far off the track it stopped. What did you want her to do..? Get out of the car and push it out of the way herself..? It's the straight. The drivers could see it in plenty of time to miss it. So ease off on the subject please, as she doesn't find the comments fair.

[The STIG]

Originally Posted by MOM

As for being chaperoned in Parc Ferme,as the cars are not going anywhere whats one person per car. Maybe with attitudes like yours towards the young drivers and 'the whole child protection thing' its a good job they are not on their own

They're not going anywhere, but they are very hot! and it's not one person per car, it's 2 including the driver, plus championship organisers, scrutineers, and all manner of other people - and 32 cars in a space only just big enough to hold them all. Imagine a fire starting in the middle of that lot...

I find your insinuation rather insulting, to be honest. Through experiences with TV and elsewhere, I find that most CP measures are somewhat over the top (pointing a camera at a child, even in the background, can have ridiculously huge consequences!), even so, I would not do anything towards kids left alone or not - in fact it is a concern for their safety that drives (most) of my comments.

[racer-gal]

Originally Posted by The STIG

and 32 cars in a space only just big enough to hold them all.

Bit of an exaggeration.. There was under 20.

[Abbie44]

Originally Posted by The STIG

in fact it is a concern for their safety that drives (most) of my comments.

oh right sorry for being mistaken about this comment...quite clearly looking out for us and our safety...

Originally Posted by The STIG

Well, despite the rain this morning, not a bad day at all. great fun.

Best race of the day? I think the first hot hatch encounter with that really close finish. Worst race? Saxmax. Absolutely terrible driving and you have to wonder how some of them got through their ARDS.

[Stuart H]

looks like it's a get Stig thread again

Any way Well done to Abbie for a great drive through the pack to 6th. So close to a win as well!
Well done to Zoe for finish in the second race

[The STIG]

Originally Posted by racer-gal

Bit of an exaggeration.. There was under 20.

My mistake, I seem to have got saxmax mixed up with Stockhatch there.

[The STIG]

Originally Posted by Abbie44

oh right sorry for being mistaken about this comment...quite clearly looking out for us and our safety...

Do you think that trying to push each other off constitutes safe racing? Motorsport is and always will be dangerous but there is no need to make it more dangerous than it already is by bad driving.

[MOM]

The only additional people in Parc Ferme with under 18's is the responsible adult. All other personnel would be there in any formula!!! I am sorry if you took the comments re child protection the wrong way, I was not insinuating anything but you certainly come across as having a downer on the young ones. Why not answer the questions about where they might get the experience etc, instead of getting huffy.

[racer-gal]

Bad driving..?

Haven't we already tried to explain that it's a LEARNING championship..?

[Stuart H]

We had very little contact down at the hairpin!

[Bodysnatcher]

I think lots of people (old and new to 10ths) aught to take time out and read the FAQs - especially the bit about personal attacks.

[Abbie44]

Originally Posted by The STIG

Do you think that trying to push each other off constitutes safe racing? Motorsport is and always will be dangerous but there is no need to make it more dangerous than it already is by bad driving.

okay,

saturday- who made contact with who?
as far as i know andy tibbs went off due to driver error.

sunday- there was a bit of contact but nothing more than stock hatch, infact there was less.

so please do not have the cheek to make accusations like this, like i said before, if your looking out for our safety go to the clerks of the course or indeed the saxmax team. Also, im sure most of the saxmax drivers would appreciate you discussing this face to face instead of hiding on the internet.

[The STIG]

Originally Posted by MOM

The only additional people in Parc Ferme with under 18's is the responsible adult. All other personnel would be there in any formula!!!...

True enough, but that one extra person makes a big difference. If they're not absolutely essential they shouldn't be there.

Why not answer the questions about where they might get the experience etc, instead of getting huffy.

I help run a stock hatch team - entering the championship next year. The reason we're entering next year and not this year is simply to gain as much practice and testing as possible before entering racing. To this end we have engaged the services of a very good professional driver coach, and intend to regularly do track days for practice. this also gives great practice for handling the car in a crowded circuit - which should explain why I was mostly seen well off the racing line avoiding getting in anyone's way (I'm short and I didn't have good rear visibility). I digress. Why can't the saxmax drivers do one of these? Too young? No RTA licence?

There's karting, and yes, they are very different to cars but they do help with learning racecraft. Even a few arrive and drive sessions at your local indoor centre would help. There's a whole myriad of racing schools who could possibly help, and then it's a case of testing as much as possible before taking the start. If no wet days are available, then lots of racing schools offer a low grip training course in a skid car. it's not the same thing, but it should help enormously. Failing that, decamp the entire field to MIRA or somewhere and use the handling circuit with the sprinklers on?

However the best experience for basic driving skills is on the road, which is where you learn how to deal with unexpected scenarios and all conditions.

[Abbie44]

Originally Posted by The STIG

True enough, but that one extra person makes a big difference. If they're not absolutely essential they shouldn't be there.

I help run a stock hatch team - entering the championship next year. The reason we're entering next year and not this year is simply to gain as much practice and testing as possible before entering racing. To this end we have engaged the services of a very good professional driver coach, and intend to regularly do track days for practice. this also gives great practice for handling the car in a crowded circuit - which should explain why I was mostly seen well off the racing line avoiding getting in anyone's way (I'm short and I didn't have good rear visibility). I digress. Why can't the saxmax drivers do one of these? Too young? No RTA licence?

There's karting, and yes, they are very different to cars but they do help with learning racecraft. Even a few arrive and drive sessions at your local indoor centre would help. There's a whole myriad of racing schools who could possibly help, and then it's a case of testing as much as possible before taking the start. If no wet days are available, then lots of racing schools offer a low grip training course in a skid car. it's not the same thing, but it should help enormously. Failing that, decamp the entire field to MIRA or somewhere and use the handling circuit with the sprinklers on?

However the best experience for basic driving skills is on the road, which is where you learn how to deal with unexpected scenarios and all conditions.

and get the money from where?