HRT and TOLL RACING kicked out of 2007 championship???? (MERGED x2) - Page 3

**GTRMagic** · 20 Feb 2007, 00:07 (Ref:1845944)

And a Holden owned legal entity purchased the 2x HRT L1 franchise licence slots back in 2003 when TWR exploded too, which was against series regulations, and there was no punishment... in the strict interpretation of the TEGA rules there is allegedly no accounting for "Force Majeure"

This seems an annual event... TEGA wants some shiny bits of paper, and bleats to the world... the accused trot out some shiny bits of paper... its all sweet come start of the season.

So will the part of Andie McDowell be played by TC?

vxfan · 20 Feb 2007, 00:08 (Ref:1845945)

Quote:

Originally Posted by Fernandez_Angel

I take it ur a holdan fan vxfan?

Unless Ford have made a VX Falcon!

manwell · 20 Feb 2007, 00:08 (Ref:1845946)

Quote:

Originally Posted by vxfan

Interesting to see some comments from Ford fans rejoicing in the thought of having these 4 cars out of the comp.
Are u the same guys who thought Rick Kelly's win was a hollow one?How hollow would a Ford win this season be without the 4 fastest Holden cars competing eh?
Oh,the hypocrisy!

Cheers,
Tony.

hypocrisy?

Your comparing apples and oranges.

Ricks victory was hollow because he took out his only rival to the championship.

If HRT/HSVDT were banned from the championship in 2007 and Ford won the championship, it wouldnt be hollow. It would be the fastest legal Fords racing against the fastest legal Holdens. How would that be hollow?

Sure it wouldnt be that the HRT/HSVDT cars are technically illegal.
But its similar to going over a salary cap. You have to follow the rules behind the scenes as well as on the ractrack.

mmciau · 20 Feb 2007, 00:09 (Ref:1845947)

Quote:

Originally Posted by just asking

.

" ...

Imagine what would happen if they decided/threatened to withdraw that financial support?
I think that would have T.C running scared.....so i think than an amicable agreement will be reached.
...."

Supreme Court Injunction for the period 1 to 4 March 2007!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Senna05 · 20 Feb 2007, 00:12 (Ref:1845948)

Ahhh, but Alan, this is not society.

In society, you break a shop front window, you go to court, get a hearing, and are sentenced. You do your time.

The Judge and state do not stand to lose money from this sentencing.

The V8 Supercar circus muct be viewed from a Micro-Society view. Implmentation of black and white rules is just, but policing with interpretation in the grey can create a scenario where sentencing can greatly impact the rest of the members of the micro-society.

Read my previous post - I'm not for this, not at all.

But, in the end, let's look at another thing - The precedence has been set. Who set it? TEGA. So, who's to blame for this? Meaning can TW sue for allowing this to happen without reprimand and then stopping it? More than likely.

This is not black and white. The judge, jury and executioner needs to be VERY carefull that if they use a gilotine on this, that the blood doesn't stain everyone else standing within 10 feet, which I can tell you it absolutely would....

Right now, I'd say TW (sadly....very sadly) has 3 aces in his hand and is waiting for another on the flop, while TEGA are hoping for a king high straight....

RotorFan · 20 Feb 2007, 00:16 (Ref:1845949)

Quote:

Originally Posted by Senna05

2) Out of protest, and 100% within their rights, they supply no more manufacturer support AT ALL to the V8 Supercar series, making all Holden teams pay for parts, etc, possibly causing the collapse of V8 Supercar as a supported 2 car category.

TEGA are playing a VERY dangerous game of Bluff that could backfire horrendously

Bluffing and burning bridges seems to be the TEGA/AVESCO way.

I don't see why its in anyones long term interests to make this kind of thing public. It might get some fans revved up but in the long term its damaging to the category and to the teams.

I like the idea that officially the teams could go for broke with testing while not officially holding any licences - that would be a TW move

TSR · 20 Feb 2007, 00:22 (Ref:1845956)

I have being saying this for a long time that there is a 4car HRT team, and all the HOLDEN fans knock me, now TEGA have produce some balls.

But me's think that both cars will be on the grid in ADL and it will all blow over, as TEGA is deal with HOLDEN.

Time will tell, time will tell.

**GTRMagic** · 20 Feb 2007, 00:56 (Ref:1845968)

So who of Mr Kelly, Mr Kelly, Mr Tander or Mr Skaife will line up for Walden Motorsport in Adelaide?

TSR · 20 Feb 2007, 01:08 (Ref:1845974)

Geez GTR I'd of thought you would have had some news from the powder room on this topic. It has just popped up out of nowhere really and is now a major newspaper story.

v8babe · 20 Feb 2007, 01:12 (Ref:1845976)

wouldn't that be a funny sight seeing any of them at Walden's!

**GTRMagic** · 20 Feb 2007, 01:14 (Ref:1845979)

The powder room inhabitants are too busy singing and dancing at the prospect of HRT/HSVDT not showing up in Adelaide to make comment

They also accept however that this will blow over, as it has done the last 4 times TEGA has asked for clarity of ownership, and their joy will be short lived.

Nothing will be any different. There are more clever people inside Holden/WP than there are inside TEGA....

Quite what #7 thinks of this would be interesting to appreciate...

Sandgroper · 20 Feb 2007, 01:15 (Ref:1845980)

Quote:

Originally Posted by GTRMagic

So who of Mr Kelly, Mr Kelly, Mr Tander or Mr Skaife will line up for Walden Motorsport in Adelaide?

Hush Hush GTR...... DO I have to Purchase Walden Motosport merchandise now

spectator22 · 20 Feb 2007, 01:18 (Ref:1845982)

MN Digital site (and so MN tomorrow) says HRT/HSV have had a scare, but it was resolved yesterday. NO loss of licences altho it was threatened. Sydney papers, Ch7 and 10 (who read the papers obnviously for there news!) got it WRONG. What a media fiasco. MN was right about Jim Beam deal, right about Seton so are probably right again this week?????

TSR · 20 Feb 2007, 01:18 (Ref:1845983)

Quote:

Originally Posted by GTRMagic

The powder room inhabitants are too busy singing and dancing at the prospect of HRT/HSVDT not showing up in Adelaide to make comment

They also accept however that this will blow over, as it has done the last 4 times TEGA has asked for clarity of ownership, and their joy will be short lived.

Nothing will be any different. There are more clever people inside Holden/WP than there are inside TEGA....

Quite what #7 thinks of this would be interesting to appreciate...

What you say is 150% correct, it is all hot air and will blow over.

Dazz · 20 Feb 2007, 01:21 (Ref:1845984)

It's becoming more like F1 every day. BOOOORING!

I don't want to watch "paper trails", I just want to watch cars racing around a track.

TEGA and whoever else makes up a squillion rules that have more holes in them than swiss cheese, and when it looks to go bad they get heavy.

Get rid of all the crap rules, make it simple, make it clear, and let the racing be the focus, not the backroom fighting.

barney551 · 20 Feb 2007, 01:27 (Ref:1845987)

so you like the idea of 1 team cheating the systemto stay at/near the top!!!!

TSR · 20 Feb 2007, 01:36 (Ref:1845991)

Quote:

Originally Posted by barney551

so you like the idea of 1 team cheating the systemto stay at/near the top!!!!

Just Do It! · 20 Feb 2007, 01:48 (Ref:1845999)

You are right, TSR.

The whole handling of the Walkinshaw empire demise, the receivership "practices" employed by PriceWaterhouseCoopers in the UK - Rob Hunt headed it up, and the subsequent threats from Holden that they would render the assets worthless if they didn't have first right of purchase is just one great sham.

That Holden flew Ross McKenzie to the UK to meant with Hunt et al at PWC to buy the assets was a "forced hand" position that the receivers bowed to....caved in to in real truth. Apparently all the documentation still sits in the PWC office in the UK that handled the demise of TWR.

Holden said that if they didn't buy the assets, then they would immediately withdraw the Holden support and staff for the team, along with the intellectual property of the brand Holden Racing Team, which is apparently licensed by Holden to the Holden Racing Racing Team. Holden also said that if any party that they didn't approve of got hold of Holden Special Vehicles, then they would immediately withdraw contracts for supply of all Holden componentry and the use of the Holden Special Vehicle name.

Essentially, PWC caved in and sold it all to Holden Australia, and shut out all interested parties - they numbered 4 in total, but whether that includes Holden or not remains unknown.

McKenzie did the deal, and flew home. SkaifeSport got HRT, financed by GMAC so the solid story goes. He was to get $1 million a year in salary plus a share of all HRT merchandise profits and an additional sum to ensure that the team was paid for in about 5-7 years - can't recall exactly.

The Kellys got what was known as KMart Racing, despite a strong interest expression from Greg Murphy, who had picked up KMart and delivered them to Holden, and thus doing so allowed Holden to set up a "semi-factory" team.

Murphy would later be "rewarded" for his efforts, and possibly for turning down the Pirtek drive at SBR, with strong Holden support for his own team.

The thought of the day felt that the Kellys were offered KMart Racing in return for their loyalty and dedication in helping Holden Young Lions at about the time that Todd graduated from a Formula Holden to the HYL Supercar. John had, in Holden's opinion, very generously built the HYL workshop and never invoiced Holden for that.
That helped cement Todd into the Holden stable as just reward for the "struggling rural Victorian farmer's" help.
I wonder how much opinion changed when the truth came out about their wealth later on. The Kellys are very savvy people indeed!!

Steve Carter · 20 Feb 2007, 01:56 (Ref:1846003)

Quote:

Originally Posted by GTRMagic

Mr Kershler had better watch out, he might lose his TEGA media accreditation for telling the 'truth'

Dont think so GTR - good beat up headline no teeth in it - of course they wont throw HRT and Toll out - the story gave V8SA nearly a full page of much needed press - theyll give Kershler a medal!!

Next weeks full page expose' Skaife has sex with under aged monkey' or 'Which Holden driver is really a trans gender??' god the mind boggles

stmorri · 20 Feb 2007, 02:13 (Ref:1846013)

Quote:

Originally Posted by just asking

Imagine what would happen if they decided/threatened to withdraw that financial support?

The same thing would happen as when Ford withdrew in the '70's......life goes on with or without them......bring in Toyota......and there will still be other Holden teams representing the brand......HRT/HSV aren't indespensible.

Muznik · 20 Feb 2007, 02:16 (Ref:1846015)

I pretty much agree with Senna05.

It wont happen due to Holden's might and possile backlash. (Same if it was Ford/Stone Bros, FPR or T8)

Now if it was WPS they'd be up a well known creek.

I think the obvious problem should be removed = TW.

Surely he's making enough from his customer business that he doenst need to drag 2 x teams into this.

As a Holden/HRT fan I just wish it would be sorted once & for all.

Dazz · 20 Feb 2007, 03:04 (Ref:1846035)

The question really is, why is it now a drama two weeks before the start of the year if they have been looking at it for so long?

Steve Carter · 20 Feb 2007, 03:13 (Ref:1846042)

Quote:

Originally Posted by Dazz

The question really is, why is it now a drama two weeks before the start of the year if they have been looking at it for so long?

Dazz - its straight up publicity nothing more - timings perfect......

Senna05 · 20 Feb 2007, 03:15 (Ref:1846045)

Quote:

Originally Posted by Dazz

The question really is, why is it now a drama two weeks before the start of the year if they have been looking at it for so long?

Once again to my Micro-Society point -

When in a Tribe, just like Survivor, you force hands by leaving things to the last minute. With a threat like this, I think the aim MIGHT be to try and push holden into a corner and push TW out of any money mking position with the group....

If they hit them up in October, lots of time to throw ideas around and make something that is "Demi-Legal".

This way, they have to do something or face exclusion.

....or have Holden pull out.

There's alot more to this, and I'm not going to claim I know, and I doubt many would know. i just get the feeling that Uncle Tom may have ****ed off the wrong person. (and let's hope the wrong person gets rid of Uncle Tom!)

PS - Ford pulled out in the 70's. You still had the Comaro's coming on, Mazda turned up, you had a swag of other teams supported by dealers.... This day and age, how many Holden teams would we have without Holden's support? Probably JDR... I'm pretty sure Holden are keeping GRM afloat as a favour for running the Munro's.

hail · 20 Feb 2007, 03:24 (Ref:1846048)

Quote:

Originally Posted by stmorri

The same thing would happen as when Ford withdrew in the '70's......life goes on with or without them......bring in Toyota......and there will still be other Holden teams representing the brand......HRT/HSV aren't indespensible.

Gatetakings are!

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