Lowndes vs. Rick Kelly (Merged x 112)

[amiers]

congrats to Rick Schumacher.

[Chatters]

This is going to continue being talked about for a looooooooooooooooooooooooong time...

[Azza500]

Originally Posted by 6.213km

On word mate... STRAWS

Cause u r clutching at them Grimace... Go to maccas and get ya self a cheese burger mate.

Wheres Billy Big Time... Holden Fans have copped enough crap from you losers for too long. Time to shovel some back your way.

Seems like the new Vodophone deals working well, lnowdes got connected pretty quickly with the on coming traffic.

Lnowdes Champion.... NOW.... well maybe drop the W and it will say NO.

holden hasnt won anything ford won manufacturers title and bathurst and rkelly underhandedly won drivers title or do you not know how to tell the differance oh and the only thing holden about his car the lights,signage,badges and body panels yes definatly a great victory for holden NOT!!!!

[barney551]

Please ... can we not turn this into another Brocky thing!!!!

Let him go.

[James63]

I think there is a point here though. Rick will never be the champion that we have seen of others in the past.

[barney551]

No need to make another thread abot it though.

[Alco]

It will be remembered in history that the Bathurst winner on 06 driving a Ford wore an armband and dedicated his win in memory of Brock.

Sadly the championship "winner" today and his red team made no mention of Brock.

Then again, there are a few people at Holden that are glad to forget the great man!

[GTRMagic]

Originally Posted by amiers

congrats to Rick Schumacher.

At least Schumacher could win races

[Azza500]

Originally Posted by Phase3

Sadly today the passing of Peter Brock really hit me, I mean, I was as upset as anybody fortunate enough to witness the deeds of the great man over the many years of his career, but today it really became evident the impact the loss of Brockie has had on Australian motor sport. You see, with the passing of Brock, the ethics of fair play, and the standards of holden motor sport died too.

People will have their own opinions on what played out today at Phillip Island, but realistically holden did not secure the drivers championship by any means they could be proud of. Garth Tander has done more damage to his reputation by the way he drove in Race 2 than I actually thought would be possible to do in any one race, the performance he showed in Race 3 go's to show the extent he was trying to manipulate the championship for his team in Race 2. Obviously his complete lack of faith in his team mates ability lead him to block to the extent that he did in that race, but the sportsmanship of such tactics is non existant, and I'm sure PB would be turning in his grave that holden needed to resort to such tactics.

I remember Brockie and Dick Johnson racing door handle to door handle at the last race of the season at lakeside for the ATCC, no paint was swapped, and Brockie came off second best, Dick won the championship, but Australian motor sport, Dick and Brockie were all winners on the day. Flash forward twenty years to today and the already infamous race 3, if it's considered sporting to win a championship by knocking your opponent out of the race, then I think I'm done with Australian motor sport.

A hollow victory rick, one for which you deserve no congratulations, craig had your measure on the day, and even with the four Walkingshaw commodores letting you by, and blocking Lowndes, still the only way you could possibly win was by taking him out.

Yes sadly today it became very evident that with the passing of Brocky, all ethics of holden motor sport passed away too.

Shame holden, shame.

couldnt agree more we should have known it was coming though after this press release just look at the title http://www.v8supercar.com.au/news/la...=&gid=22470745

[cavvy]

Fairness is in the eye of the beholder - the earliest touring cars were Jags & Holdens - Bob Jane won a couple of titles, Pitt, McKay, Geoghegan were in it to win it.

Mustangs - Geoghegan, Beechey, Jane, Moffat - doorhandles & panels, gee even a cross word.

Jane lead into the 70s with the ZL1 Camaro - no beg your pardons with the the competition.

Fifty years on the Australian Touring Car Championship has some more biff.

[amiers]

good call GTR.

[Azza500]

Originally Posted by GTRMagic

At least Schumacher could win races

and deserved everyone of his titles (by the way am a maclaren fan)

[HSE2]

* Car #15, Rick Kelly (careless driving involving car #888, Craig Lowndes)
* Car #10, Jason Bargwanna (infringement involving car # 20, Marcus Marshall)

The following cars/drivers were displayed the Bad Sportsmanship Flag:
* Car #11, Paul Dumbrell (blocking)

The IPO investigated whether any further penalty was appropriate for Car #15, Rick Kelly.
A Protest was lodged with the Stewards by Triple 8 Race Engineering, Car #888 against the inadequacy of the penalty imposed on Car #15, Rick Kelly.

[Matt H]

HSE2, linky ???

[Techo]

Seems Ford teams did'nt interfere with the results & where racing.

Shame Holden Shame !
Do anything to win for the red side the with bully tactics !!!

Fans are'nt stupid 'we know your bad sports' - Massive booing at the track.

Want a way to be a champion !! congratulations everyone knowns your style Holden...

The consistant finisher wins (history shows) ! booo booo - we all know !

[krypto71]

I blame Todd! If he wasn't there then Lowndsey would have ended up off the circuit, clear of the following cars!

But seriously, had Lowndes not been stuck in harms way, and ended up with an injured car, he would have maintained a gap on Kelly after the drive thru.
We saw Lowndes cruise past whilst Rick was putting down pit lane.

So should Rick be further penalised because Davison hit Lowndes? Thats a tough one. Would it have mattered if 10 cars all pile up behind Lowndes? Would that make Ricks crime worse?

[Phase3]

It's Bathurst 1987 all over again! Until the outcome is known, is Crash Bandicoot only "provisional champion"?

Originally Posted by krypto71

So should Rick be further penalised because Davison hit Lowndes? Thats a tough one.

Would Lowndes be in the position to be hit by davison if he hadn't been spun by rick?

[wishbone]

v8 super cirus web site has the annoucement that "Kelly takes championship on day of high drama"

[The Snout]

Originally Posted by krypto71

So should Rick be further penalised because Davison hit Lowndes? Thats a tough one. Would it have mattered if 10 cars all pile up behind Lowndes? Would that make Ricks crime worse?

Thing that bothers me is Lowndes isn't parked in the middle of the road with a Holden painted bullseye on his car if Rick doesn't hit him to begin with.

As for Kelly not winning a round this year. Well, you put dollars and accountants in charge of the sport, accountants wanting reverse grids and garbage to bring in the $$$$ and up the ratings, if you think that's aok, then this is what you get.

[speedreader]

It is a shame Championship's have to be decided this way and I do find it disappointing to say the least. This incident ruined what should have been a good finish to an awesome, action packed season of high's and low's for many championship contenders

In particular I was annoyed with:-

• Skaife obviously blocking the Championship contenders in R 1. There is a difference between holding a racing line and slowing cars down by seconds per lap....

• Tander being allowed to block the Championship contenders for so long in R2 and although he was eventually penalised, where would the race have gone had the penalty been issued earlier - after all he was OBVIOUSLY blocking.... It's worth pointing out that Tander was still on track when black flagged though, not punted out of the way by an obviously frustrated but still in control (just) Lowndes

• THE incident in R3..... Just saw it again on the news and must say I think Lowndes was actually closer to the 'real' racing line than Todd Kelly meaning he (Lowndes) probably wasnt blocking anywhere near as much as first thought. It's probably more like he was racing on the more correct line because Todd was starting to run wide and as he was ahead of Rick (both visually and as per the rule book) he was entitled to race that line without being punted off....

It is interesting to read earlier in this thread the penalties given to Marcos Ambrose and even F1's Schumacher for championship based incidents in the past - Maybe both Lowndes and R Kelly should be disqualified from the last race meaning they would have finished equal on points and Lowndes would win the Championship with his 5 round wins versus Kelly's ummm, 'none'.

I have another question though - are you allowed to work on the car whilst under starters orders ? I thought that whilst the cars were on the grid, even when under a delayed start situation, they are still under starters orders but Ch 10 commentators clearly reported on (and the team confirmed) that adjustments were made to Rick's car on the grid after the first aborted / delayed start - is this legal

[cavvy]

Originally Posted by The Snout

.....accountants in charge of the sport, accountants wanting reverse grids and garbage to bring in the $$$$ and up the ratings

Snout, get your nose into the sunshine, accountants save money, sales spends it ...
an accountant who supported reverse grid, I'd like to see that !!

[Raceonly]

Amazing. Greg Murphy should find out from Rick how he got off so lightly. Well, as has been said before, Moffat, Brock and Johnson managed to win heaps of races and championships without punting each other off the track. The cars might be faster these days, but the brakes and handling are also better. Pity the standards of behaviour are worse.

That Rick copped a penalty proves that he was considered guilty. But that penalty did not really penalise him, as he still won. Defeats the purpose of handing out a penalty!

[wishbone]

Originally Posted by speedygirl

I have another question though - are you allowed to work on the car whilst under starters orders ? I thought that whilst the cars were on the grid, even when under a delayed start situation, they are still under starters orders but Ch 10 commentators clearly reported on (and the team confirmed) that adjustments were made to Rick's car on the grid after the first aborted / delayed start - is this legal

my understanding is NO, once you enter the grid you are in a parc ferme conditions up unitl the race start. so under a delayed started you are still in a parc ferme condition..

at the cams PI event earlier this year i know one team that was cautioned over working on the car on the dummy grid, facing a penity they had to leave the grid aera to work on the car before returning...

[The Snout]

Originally Posted by cavvy

Snout, get your nose into the sunshine, accountants save money, sales spends it ...
an accountant who supported reverse grid, I'd like to see that !!

Accountants like money coming in, and if prostituting the racing and the rules means bigger numbers from them to punch into their abbacus, then they'll support anything marketing tells them. This is a argument for another thread me thinks.

[billybanana]

Once an aborted start has been signalled the start procedure recommences from the 5 minute mark. Team personnel are allowed on the grid until the 2 minute mark. The only mention of working on a car whilst on the grid in the regs comes under the "Restart" umbrella where a race has been stopped. I can't see anything specific which states you cannot do anything to the car after an aborted start.

Sorry fellas but you're clutching at straws if you're looking to disqualify Rick 'cause of this.