Dome LMP Discussion

[FIRE]

Originally Posted by JAG

http://www.racecar-engineering.com/a...dome-s102.html

Long wheelbase so Dome main target is Le Mans, not LMS or ALMS.

[brielga]

Originally Posted by JAG

http://www.racecar-engineering.com/a...dome-s102.html

More info here.

Whens was the last time Dome ran a factory team?

Could they use some JGTC drivers?

2006 under the Jim Gainer banner

[MulsanneMike]

Originally Posted by FIRE

Long wheelbase so Dome main target is Le Mans, not LMS or ALMS.

Can't really say that these days. The RS Spyder has a 2900 mm (114+") wheelbase but is doing just fine in ALMS...Wheelbase now has a lot to do with the overhang regulations and has become a method by which the rear wing can be moved away from the airflow disruptions of the roll over/cockpit area. Though it also allows a maximising of the underfloor area because at a 2900 mm WB, adding the 1000 mm max from and 750 mm max rear gives you the max car length. It's my understanding that the RS is using the maximum front and rear overhangs.

[ss_collins]

Dome is the works Honda GT500 team, it also runs a Nippon team for Super Aguri and Formula 3. They are well drilled

[minimangler]

Originally Posted by ss_collins

Dome is the works Honda GT500 team, it also runs a Nippon team for Super Aguri and Formula 3. They are well drilled

there are some fairly quality japanese drivers out there (but also some not so good ones). I hope they go Michelin, because imo Yokohama cant match them.

[templer]

Dome ( www.dome.co.jp) has released renderings of the final shape of the the S102. The car looks really great with some unique details ( shadow plates over between fender and monocoque, front splitter). The car will be completed til end Februar.

Regards

Markus

[ss_collins]

I'm not getting sucked in - I refuse to do work - I refuse!!!

can't wait to see this in the carbon

[chernaudi]

Originally Posted by MulsanneMike

Can't really say that these days. The RS Spyder has a 2900 mm (114+") wheelbase but is doing just fine in ALMS...Wheelbase now has a lot to do with the overhang regulations and has become a method by which the rear wing can be moved away from the airflow disruptions of the roll over/cockpit area. Though it also allows a maximising of the underfloor area because at a 2900 mm WB, adding the 1000 mm max from and 750 mm max rear gives you the max car length. It's my understanding that the RS is using the maximum front and rear overhangs.

Not to go off topic, but there goes the theory that the Audi R10's wheelbase is causing its cornering problems against LMP2 car(thus, it's mostly weight). F1 cars back in the 80's had wheelbases of 107-110 inches-which is what most prototypes had until the last couple of years. On F1 cars, when active suspension and traction control was banned, wheelbase lengths massively increased. When active suspension/TC was banned at the end of the 1993 F1 season, most F1 cars had 110-113 in. wheelbases The 1994 Williams FW16 had a short wheelbase, and was almost uncontrolable in some circumstances until a long wheelbase version came out early-mid season.

But it does go to reason why the long wheelbases from an aero stand point. Under the old LMP rules you could run a long tail car, with the slight disadvantage of more polar weight(slightly more rearward weight bias due to the extra bodywork weight), but with the advantages of reduced drag, and more downforce(especially with the old rear wing endplates). Take the Audi R8 for example. It had an overall length of 4640mm, a front overhang(front edge of the front diffuser to front wheel centerline) of 900mm, and a rear overhang of 1010mm. And it had a wheelbase of 2740mm/107.9inches, the same as an Aston Martin DB9/DBR9. The Bentley Speed 8 took that concept further, with a shorter front overhang, and longer rear overhang, but almost the same wheelbase as the R8.

The Audi R10 probably has the maximum rear overhang of 750mm, and has about an 920mm front overhang(slightly longer than the R8), and thus the long wheelbase. And that also might through out the window the fact that the size and weight of the engine of the R10 is the main reason for the long wheelbase. When one considers that the R10's engine is believed to be about as long and heavy as the Ford 351 Windsor SVO based Panoz Elan 6L8 OHV V8 engine, but the 6L8 was used in normal wheebase(107-110in) mid-engined LMP cars in the past, it seems that Audi found something in the wind tunnel, and Porsche found the same with the RS Spyder, as did Dome.

This also seems to explain the size of the Peugeot 908, which is about as big as the R10.

[knighty]

heres a better link to the pictures

http://www.dome.co.jp/news/news/dt_81b.html

yes - a very pretty looking thing!

[andy_b]

some very thick a-pillars, but very nice shape otherwise

[The Badger]

Originally Posted by JAG

http://www.racecar-engineering.com/a...dome-s102.html

More info here.

Whens was the last time Dome ran a factory team?

Could they use some JGTC drivers?

Didnt Ralph Firman do some of the testing for Dome , and their S101.5 ?

[The Badger]

I think its a disguise for a sportscar program for Robin Reliant !!! Wonder who will get the tyre contract as the front one will certainly take a hammering .... lol

http://www.dome.co.jp/news/news/upimg/news81_3.jpg

[gucom]

To be honest, I like the cockpit section from the start of the windshield to the rear of the car... other than that, I dont really like the stand-alone bodywork around the front wheels (so not really connected to the rest of the car), adding to the the "single seater with bodywork-look"...
The nose isn't the worst I've seen, but to be honest, with this new dome and the new WR (and also the 908), I hope those new rules from 2010 will change this trend in looks... the more I see these jet fighter cars, the more I like cars like the R8 with cleaner simpler lines...

[templer]

Anybody have an idea where the ducts for the front brakes are located?
The intakes at the rear are clearly visible, but not at the front.
The outtake in the sidepod an outtake for the coolers ( perhaps too much forward for this) or an aditional outlet for the front diffusor.

What do you think?

Markus

[TRuss]

Has anyone found any news on this thing?

[nickyf1]

my god, the uglieness!!!!

[GTfour]

I like it. Dome has allways made sleek and low bodywork.
On the other hand,I too am no big fan of ever more and more areo similarities with single seaters. I think there's a job for the organisers here,to make sure the cars don't become to much "single seaters with bodywork" as gucom says. So,no more of these ugly highrise nosecones please!

For the rest,I must say I really like the roofline...

[Jeffrey-Lee]

If an F1 style nose makes an LMP go faster it should have one! Rules created with a sole purpose to tweak a car's styling, well I find that rather dubious in a high tech sport.

It's not the early nineties people, things move along, also in sportscar racing.

[Speed-King]

Originally Posted by Jeffrey-Lee

If an F1 style nose makes an LMP go faster it should have one! Rules created with a sole purpose to tweak a car's styling, well I find that rather dubious in a high tech sport.

It's not the early nineties people, things move along, also in sportscar racing.

(Un)fortunately the ACO is obsessed, with keeping the cars above a lap time of 3.30 at Le Mans. If they can do this by doing away with the F1 noses, they could kill two birds with one stone...

[FIRE]

Originally Posted by Speed-King

(Un)fortunately the ACO is obsessed, with keeping the cars above a lap time of 3.30 at Le Mans. If they can do this by doing away with the F1 noses, they could kill two birds with one stone...

Besides that ACO want protoypes to look more like road cars.

[JAG]

Originally Posted by Speed-King

(Un)fortunately the ACO is obsessed, with keeping the cars above a lap time of 3.30 at Le Mans. If they can do this by doing away with the F1 noses, they could kill two birds with one stone...

This is often repeated but is simply not correct.

The ACO are happy for cars to lap well below 3.30 during qualifying, which only a handful of cars have come close to doing in the past two decade's, even during the Group C days.

Last year they also took into account track changes which lowered lap times by a second or so.

What they don't want is to see are car's lapping significantly below 3.30, consistently, during the race. When you consider the FASTEST petrol P1 laptime was only a 3.33, it's only the diesels that are currently a 'worry', they were poting regular 3.26-30 laptimes.

I don't think there's any doubt the current R10 and 908 would pummel any previous generatation sportscar, even if it's the ultimate Mercedes C11, Peugeot 905 or IMSA GTP Toyota or Nissan.

They may be competitive during qulaifying, but they'd be way behind on race pace.

Back to the original point, I reckon we'll see rear wings slashed in size/complexity, with much fewer aero bits and bobs on the bodywork of the next generation coupes.

We could see a cleaner Group C type look.

[Speed-King]

Originally Posted by JAG

This is often repeated but is simply not correct.

The ACO are happy for cars to lap well below 3.30 during qualifying, which only a handful of cars have come close to doing in the past two decade's, even during the Group C days.

Last year they also took into account track changes which lowered lap times by a second or so.

What they don't want is to see are car's lapping significantly below 3.30, consistently, during the race. When you consider the FASTEST petrol P1 laptime was only a 3.33, it's only the diesels that are currently a 'worry', they were poting regular 3.26-30 laptimes.

Umm, yeah ,but take a look at todays LMS test day results and Audi being 3 seconds faster than Peugeot last year on a relatively short, though fast track. What will this mean at Le Mans? While I don't think that the 3.20 barrier will fall, the Audis and Peugeots might come very close in qualifying...
For the first time in almost 10 years we have an arms race between two big factories, it's only natural that these factories will push the envelope quite a bit.

And the evolution of the petrol cars -while being admittedly slower - doesn't stand still either. I wouldn't be surprised if the Aston-Lola or Oreca went below 3.30.

[TRuss]

All we need is only one major manufacturer in LMP1 with a petrol/E85 fueled engine to see some major progression in that area. If we had two more major manufacturers running petrol/E85 things could get crazy quickly. Just like with the diesel cars. I'd love to see it. As for the looks. Some have pulled off the formula nose quite well. Like the Epsilon. That car looks fantastic. I think most any would agree despite there biases. The front end on the new Lola though. Well it just seems way to large. It looks especially strange from the side.

[KA]

Originally Posted by The Badger

I think its a disguise for a sportscar program for Robin Reliant !!! Wonder who will get the tyre contract as the front one will certainly take a hammering .... lol

http://www.dome.co.jp/news/news/upimg/news81_3.jpg

Hmm, interesting comparison......
http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedi...Regal_3-30.jpg

[KA]

Originally Posted by FIRE

Besides that ACO want protoypes to look more like road cars.

I still don't see the purpose behind that- prototypes haven't looked like road cars for thirty years....