Pescarolo Vs. Factory Courage

[Tim Northcutt]

That's why I think the "Best Non-VAG" race will be almost (but not quite) as exciting as the Overall race itself....

To ChevyGuy...I can see the Pescas outlasting a lot of the "non-VAG" frontrunners, but I don't see them outpacing the R&S or the Panoz cars....Both are fster than the Pescas, and will continue to be so..

One note to remember....breakdowns for the R&S (like last year at LM and at Sebring) are unusual...they had podium finishes at Daytona and Sebring in 2002, and as builders, R&S has a strong history for reliability....

and unless the VAG cars have serious mechanical problems, I sure don't see anyone picking off one or two of them in the overall result.....

the VAG cars are in a league of their own...

[Fab]

Hey, at the end, this race seems pretty opened, don't you think ? Remember, lats two years, we KNEW at the start that a Joest car was mend to win... but this year ? A VAG car for sure, but which one ? If you think , just have a look on the 'overall thread'... the five VAG are mentionned for the overall victory...

We'll have a race this year, I'll bet on that !

[Chevyguy]

Tim, what have you been smoking? It's not a question of whether or not the R&S is good, it's all about location. The Daytona and Sebring are R&S territory, Le Mans is Pescarolo's and Joest's. Mr Pescarolo has been winning races there since (i'm just taking a guess) before you were born. Hey, it's sounds good, right? If your looking at test times to conclude that the R&S and Panoz are beyond the Pesca pace, think of it this way, that's one driver's fastest lap. One driver with one fast lap does not win Le Mans.

BTW, you do know I was joking when I asked what you've been smoking?

[Tim Northcutt]

To Chevyguy:

Actually, I looked at 2002 Le Mans Hourly Race Reports, but before I go into that, I want to acknowledge and agree with a number of points that you made....

1. Mr. Pescarolo is a Le Mans legend, as a driver and a team owner...and as Fab most eloquently stated earlier in this thread, he sets up his operation to run at a pace for 24 hours...after all, that is the goal at Le mans, isn't it???

2. As a long-time follower of the R&S operation, i readily admit that their chassis is a higher downforce chassis that is much better suited to a North American style road course than it is to Le Mans...and the Courage obviously is tuned and designed with European circuits, particulrly Le Mans, in mind, and....

3. It DOES take three top-notch, professional drivers to be successful at Le Mans...Pescxarolo has three, but the R&S is driven by two professionals and a good amateur driver...not to disrespect Mr. Matthews at all, because I have no doubt that he runs far faster than I would ever hope to race when he is behind the wheel, but when you look at race results, he generally runs slower than his professional counterparts when he is in the car, and in general, they tend to lose spots in the standings during his stints...he was 6-7 seconds slower per lap than his teammates at Sebring in March...that is a MAJOR factor in a race like Le Mans...

Now For My Assessment of 2002, and thus my statements, particularly between the R&S and Pescarolo....

Early in the 2nd hour last year, Matthews spun the R&S off the course and had problems getting back underway... it cost them three laps to the field, including the Pescarolo...

However, once Goosens and Theys got back in the car, they were making up one lap per hour on the top Pescarolo car and actually passed them for position during the 7th hour of the race.....in the following hours, the R&S continued to extend that advantage by nearly one lap per hour up until the 12th hour...

NOTE: I did not include the 12th hour because Pescarolo apparently had a major problem that kept them in the pits for nearly that entire time, and maybe even longer...they turned only 3 or 4 laps in that hour...it isn't fair to make an on-0track performance assessment when one of the cars isn't on the track...

In my book, a one-lap per hour difference between the cars not only indicates a performance advantage to the R&S, but where I come from, it constitutes a Serious on-the-track "Butt-Kicking"....

I'm sure that a one-lap per hour advantage would be a butt-kicking in Texas, too...would you agree???

And it is even more significant when you consider that the "Shoes" the R&S car was using to kick Pescarolo's butt with were Goodyear tires...not the Michelins that Pecasrolo was shod with...

However....2002 is "Light Years" removed from 2003:

The aero changes to the Pescarolo all seem to be significant and dramatic improvements that have made that chassis very competitive...

But R&S has made improvements, too...significant, but not as dramatic as Pescarolo's...

My biggest concern with the R&S this year is the reliability of the Yates engine...they blew an engine on Test Day in May...i hope they have it straightened out...

Bottom line:

Based on the above, I do believe that in head-to-head race conditions, that the Pescarolo will not be as fast as the R&S this year...

But we all know that Le Mans is about whether or not you finish the 24 hours...gotta do that first...I guess that we'll see come Sunday afternoon at 4 p.m. Le Mans time, won't we....

P.S. -- i haven't been smoking anything, but I may have accidentally drank a Ball Jar of Team Nasamax's "Environmentally-friendly Fuel" --
I believe they call it "White Lightnin'" in Texas, don't they???

Just kidding...

Enjoy following this week's action, and let's look back on our thought on this issue next week...

[Tim Northcutt]

Well now...

Maybe I will need that Environmentally-friendly fuel" to choke down the crow that I might be eating -- feathers and all -- after that first qualifying session...

The pescarolos were impressive!!! Also surpried by the Kondo Dome...

R&S was a big disappointment....at one point they were 7th, but even Lister turned a quicker lap later in the session and they were 3 seconds of Test Day times...

Sounds like they've got their work cut out for them....

But the Pescarolo was indeed impressive, Chevyguy...you are right thus far....I sure wasn't expecting them to be 6th quick in the first session...

[cybersdorf]

Originally posted by Tim Northcutt
R&S was a big disappointment....

Who cares about practice, let's get the car sorted, and get it onto the grid. Still keeping my fingers crossed for them, bestlooking car on the grid.

[Tim Northcutt]

Point well taken, cybersdorf....but they have been a top ten car in virtually all of their races as far as qualifying and/or racing has been concerned over the past 18 months or so....

I'm sure that they will get it sorted out....their engineers are quite good....but last year they had to keep swimming upstream and ultimately it cost them via a breakdown....

I'd like to see Goossens uncork a few hot laps to give them a good starting spot....lets' see what they can do from there....

[Chevyguy]

You're right Tim, that is a description of a "serious butt kicking" anywhere. R&S turned out well. This is just qualifying though.

If you want to know more about "White Lightning", you might be better off asking the rednecks in the NASCAR forum.

[Fab]

Just wanna point out that TIM won the pole prediction contest !

Bravo Tim !

[Tim Northcutt]

I thought Courage was closer than I was.....

Wasn't his 3:32.862 or so???

I may be mistaken, because that list was a long one, but I really thought he had edged me out...

NOTE TO CHEVY GUY....

The results I quoted above on the R&S vs. Pescarolos were from last year's Le Mans Hourly Race reports, so they were under rancing conditions....

But I agree wholeheartedly with you....Qualifications are for "Show," but the action this weekend is for the "Dough"...

If I were a betting man, I'd bet that the Pescarolos will be much more likely to be running on Sunday at 4 p.m. than the R&S...

Also, I noticed the times on the Jim Matthews stints were in the 3:50 to 3:55 range...that will cost them when he is in the car....

But Tineau was fast and Goossens is Goossens...I think Marc is the most under-rated endurance driver in the business...

[Fab]

The Courage made the 9th time, with 3:40,400.

The first Bentley did 3:32,843.

Good shot for Courage, and more for the Riley & Scott, with 3:37,476...

[PascaLM]

I hope Pescarolo's team will rech the fifth place, at least !

[gttouring]

on the picture SaleenS7r posted a link to the front of the Pesca/Courage or whatever has a nose sticker that say 'Matra automobiles'
any relation to THE matra- of sports car fame- i assume so but...

[cds_uk]

Told you so, works beat Pesca, go Cochet.

[PascaLM]

I want just to say about Pescarolo team : "they'll be back"...

[JAG]

The Pescarolo team seems to just be lacking a powerful engine. The chassis with de cortanze is up there with the best.

Any chance of persuading Peugeot to lone some V10s from the 905/F1.

Also with Courage building an LMGTP for 2004 will Pescarolo run this car, build his own car, or modify the Courage LMGTP.

As the Courage will be brand new can't see any point modufying it apart from minor de cortanz details.

[Tim Northcutt]

Pescarolo needs the power boost....Mr. pescarolo was quoted in one of the LM articles on the official site saying as much...Help them out, Peugeot!!!

NOTE: I did call it correctly on R&S and Panoz...they were both consistemtly faster than the Pescas....

[PascaLM]

Originally posted by JAG
The Pescarolo team seems to just be lacking a powerful engine. The chassis with de cortanze is up there with the best.
Any chance of persuading Peugeot to lone some V10s from the 905/F1.

it's so true !

French constructors are not keen on making engines with more than six cylinders, only Renault and Peugeot made V10 for specially for F1 or '92 sportcars and Matra won LM 3 times with the melodious V12 3 litres.
But now, no V8 or V12.

SODEMO, the engine preparator, should increase the V6 peugeot displacement up to 3,5 litres at least.

[Fab]

Originally posted by Tim Northcutt
I did call it correctly on R&S and Panoz...they were both consistemtly faster than the Pescas....

Best race lap times :
- Panoz LMP-01 Elan : 03:44,386
- Courage C60 Peugeot : 03:43,670
- Courage C60 Peugeot : 03:45,414
True for the 18, not for the 17, well, theoricaly, because the point is not only to be the fastest on one lap, but to hold this pace the whole race...

I don't have the R&S best lap time during the race... the car was really good, anyway, too bad they had to retire...

[MulsanneMike]

The MkIIIC turned a 3:42 in the race. The ACO's timing stopped working for me the last 2-3 hours of the race and I see its still not viewing correctly for me so I can't exactely verify the R&S fasest lap.

[Tim Northcutt]

Goossens cranked a 3:42.4 for his (and the team's) best single lap, but he had lots of laps during their charge in the 3rd-8th hours that were around 3:43 to 3:44, and Tinseau was running 3:43s to 3:45s during much of his stint in that same stretch...

Also during that stretch, that single lap by Goosens was faster than anything that RfH #15 had turned....Lammers ran the 3:37 or 3:38 after their drive train problem that dropped them back from 5th, and he was on the hot charge to get back into contention....

They officially retired at about 7:30 a.m. Le Mans time, according to the race results for the individual cars...

According to one of the race articles on the LM site, the early R&S mishap was caused by a screw that got picked up in the left rear tire...and having it let go as he entered Indianapolis (kinda ironic, since the car was built in Indy)was not the best stretch of the course to have it happen...it's a wonder he was able to keep it off a barrier...

[dretceterini]

Obviously, the Judd/MG motor is superior to the Peugeot.

[PascaLM]

Originally posted by dretceterini
Obviously, the Judd/MG motor is superior to the Peugeot.

Of course.

The Judd V10 is made for racing only.
The Peugeot/SODEMO engine is a development of the mass produced engine from the Peugeot 607.