Is it time? - Page 3

GP Racer · 22 Dec 2003, 13:59 (Ref:818210)

Dirtfan, I think your the first guy I've heard come up with the most important reason for why TG created the IRL.

Usually, all we hear is belly-aching about how TG is greedy, money-hungry, egotistical, etc. etc. and we paint him as the only bad guy in this ugly mess.

Seems to prove the adage "there are two sides to every story"...

Dov · 22 Dec 2003, 15:19 (Ref:818244)

GP, we have been through this discussion a million times! We all know that it wasn't only TG's fault for the split in '96....the other clowns on the CART BoD made a mess of things too, but since then TG has not tried to meet CART halfway and do what's best for Open Wheel Racing in NA and most importantly it's fans and unite the two series as one again! Now if you trust TG enough to run a merged series, well that's your prerogative, but it's also mine not too!!!

GP Racer · 22 Dec 2003, 17:36 (Ref:818322)

Geez, sorry to get you so upset Dov, but I must have missed the last few discussions...

PS - What will we make out of Gentilozzi if he splits up the venerable Trans-Am series, the oldest continuing series in the US? Will he still be the knight in shining armor, that rode up to save CART, or the new devil re-incarnated?

Dov · 22 Dec 2003, 18:02 (Ref:818342)

Quote:

Originally posted by GP Racer
Usually, all we hear is belly-aching about how TG is greedy, money-hungry, egotistical, etc. etc. and we paint him as the only bad guy in this ugly mess.

Quote:

Originally posted by GP Racer
To bad that Dov and Manoz can't get past there hatred of TG.

(1)I wasn't and am not upset with you GP. (2)I'm just tired of talking about TG all the time when it's obvious that most people on the CART forum stand on one side of the fence or the other when it comes to how they feel about Tony George.

P.S. I don't care about USAC or Trans-AM, my only interest is CART and it's future...it may sound cold, but ChampCars has always been my favourite racing series and you have to always look out for #1! Btw, I do like Trans-Am racing...it's a fantastic racing series...

GP Racer · 22 Dec 2003, 18:19 (Ref:818352)

I too worry about the future of CART along with many other series. To many of them seem to be in trouble or in the midst of big changes. Its getting alittle crazy!

I think what we all want is stability.

Cheers Dov

Dov · 22 Dec 2003, 18:32 (Ref:818365)

"Stability"...that's the word! You hit the nail right on the head with that one, GP....I think we're all getting sick and tired of the business side of racing and we just want to get back to discussing the happenings on the track, which hopefully we will soon be able to do...

Cheers GP

jjspierx · 22 Dec 2003, 19:35 (Ref:818419)

Quote:

Originally posted by Dov
Dirtfan, was it possibly the Fran-Am V6 cars you saw in Phoenix? Btw, I've been watching ChampCars since the early 80's so I am a fan of ALL oval racing. Most of the new CART fans today (96 to the present) don't share that passion....they would rather have a schedule filled with road/street courses, which I like equally as much as I do the ovals. CART's diversity has always been it's biggest selling point and I hope that PG, KK and GF don't ever forget that.

Nope, Fran-am didn't start here in Amereca till 2002, and that was just Fran-Am 1600, and 2000. Fran-Am V6 hasn't even started yet, 2004 will be its first season in America. My best guess is what he saw was Gran-Am.

Also, I'd like to say I have been watching Indycar since 85(I was 5 years old) but I've loved it ever since. I think a few ovals are ok, but no I'm not a huge fan of them, never have been. Also, I don't see any need for Superspeedways. I think they are dangerous and I think the most talented driver doesn't have as much chance of winning at a Superspeedway as he would at a road course, or small oval. I just wanted to share another perspective from someone who's watched CART since the days of LOTS more ovals.

dirtfan · 22 Dec 2003, 20:15 (Ref:818447)

Phoenix runs Grand-Am's now, but they looked like NASCAR, so it may have been Trans-Am back when Gentilossi was racing. Anyway, they were big V8s and they put on a good show.
Too many sound-alike names confuse old pharts like me.
Check out all the "Sportsman" classes in NHRA, everything from Ford Pintos to Nitro Dragsters???

macdaddy · 22 Dec 2003, 20:17 (Ref:818451)

Looked like NASCAR? I saw ARCA as a support race at Michigan.

The Snout · 22 Dec 2003, 20:40 (Ref:818470)

Quote:

Originally posted by Dov
"Stability"...that's the word! You hit the nail right on the head with that one, GP....I think we're all getting sick and tired of the business side of racing and we just want to get back to discussing the happenings on the track, which hopefully we will soon be able to do...

Cheers GP

Exactly. What ever happened to knowing the series would just be there next year and driver movements etc were the talk. Hopefully by Xmas 2004 that will be the case.

Oh and for mine, I think OWRS should go it alone and leave the IRL to do it's thing. I don't see compatibility.

Flatspot · 22 Dec 2003, 21:47 (Ref:818499)

Quote:

Originally posted by GP Racer
To bad that Dov and Manoz can't get past there hatred of TG.

I haven't posted much here because my mother drilled the "If you can't say anything nice..." thing into my head, but, if I could be added to the list above I would feel that I am in good company.

macdaddy · 22 Dec 2003, 22:40 (Ref:818526)

My mother drilled me with, "If you can't say anything nice, say something stupid."

Therein lies my excuse, and I'm sticking to it.

GP Racer · 22 Dec 2003, 23:13 (Ref:818548)

Quote:

Originally posted by Flatspot
I haven't posted much here because my mother drilled the "If you can't say anything nice..." thing into my head, but, if I could be added to the list above I would feel that I am in good company.

OK, Flatspot, its done, its official! Your in the I-Hate-TG-Registry...

Flatspot · 23 Dec 2003, 00:37 (Ref:818587)

Now, if Santa brings me that plasma TV I asked for my X-Mas list will be fulfilled. Thanks!

dirtfan · 23 Dec 2003, 00:37 (Ref:818589)

Being of the gearhead persuasion, I'm upset by the fact that CART went to cookie-cutter Cosworths, and TG went from
"buy a standard engine and let an Ed Pink type hop it up and break it if you want" to "lease a factory engine and relinquish all control to the factory engineers".
I guess that puts me into the I-aint-too-thrilled-with-either-TG-or-CART registry.

macdaddy · 23 Dec 2003, 02:49 (Ref:818633)

CART had no choice, dirtfan.

Bizzo5000 · 23 Dec 2003, 19:33 (Ref:819294)

I just want a pony.

Liz · 30 Dec 2003, 21:36 (Ref:823901)

I want a return to the variety seen on the 1979 Long Beach F1 grid. And less about how much everything costs (my mother taught me that dwelling on the price of things was vulgar) and more on what's going on out there on the track.

I hope that soon we will be able to do this.

And put me down on the list of people who, if she saw Tony George sinking for the third time in Lake Superior, could still eat her breakfast.

Hazza · 31 Dec 2003, 06:34 (Ref:824253)

How about this, OWRS allows teams to enter with IRL Chasis and engines at certain "high profile" events, like say Long Beach. They fiddle with the rev-limiters so that its a slight advantage to the CART cars and then stage the race on the same Weekend as a IRL race.

Make it big, *realy* big Budwieser Presents Best Open Wheel Racers Racing At Long Beach!

Get it on Prime Time TV, Penske and Chip will either
A) Be chomping at the bit to get in their and show their teams skills in turning right aswell as left.
B) (If it is high-profile enough), forced by the Manufacturers will want into the show.

Run an IROC race, ALMS race same day - make it *REALY* big and if an IRL team wins, they'll be back next year to do the same thing, hopefully brining their buddies, and lo! look what'll happen, mean while out at *Inthemiddleofnowhere Motor Speedway* TG will have to grin and bear as Eddie Cheaver takes a shock victory in a field of 10!

Or something.

"And while i'm dreaming, I might aswell ask for a pony"

Liz · 31 Dec 2003, 12:55 (Ref:824515)

You are forgetting the rule that TG made that nobody who drives in "our" equipment will be allowed to drive in "their" series. Since "their" equipment is completely unsuitable for a street race, you'd have to get TG to change one of his rules in our favour.

Not going to happen. Let the CCWS races proceed.

Hazza · 1 Jan 2004, 09:57 (Ref:825087)

Interesting. Thanks for pointing that out Liz.

GP Racer · 1 Jan 2004, 16:58 (Ref:825205)

Liz, I'm pretty sure that the IRL's cars can handle a street or road course without to much modification. Apparently, from what I've read, they have the kits ready in case they do go road racing.

The trouble would be in setting up the car, for the teams that have never been on road/street courses. But then again, many of there teams have that expierience from there CART days.

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