Why did Sir Frank pass on DC's services - Page 3

RWC · 11 Jan 2005, 05:20 (Ref:1197844)

Frank didn't even consider dc because he's too slow.

No manipulating of arguments about points and 'allmost' world chamionships can change that fact

As someone very neatly pointed out-dc *needs* to have a car that's a second a lap faster than everyone else to even have a chance at winning

Ozsport · 11 Jan 2005, 05:52 (Ref:1197850)

Quote:

Originally Posted by Teretonga

I should have said 'sheer speed' rather than 'skill'. I have every respect for Webbers ability, but like many others think that NH may turn out to be vastly underated and every bit a match for Mark, unlike Pizzonia, who although fast over a single lap, doesn't seem to 'race' as well over a full GP distance. I could be wrong about that and if it proves to be so would freely admit it...

I was trying to make the point that Mark's ability to relate to the team and pull the team around him (perhaps more so than NH who is quieter and seems more introverted) would be a deciding factor in the degree of success that Mark might experience over Nick, assuming they were both equal in terms of sheer speed.

I think Webbs has proven he will be equal of speed. Every car he has been in he has been a few places up the ladder than the car deserved.

The only thing I worry about with him is the whole "moral" idea.. My dislike of MS is due to him taking people out with a cold efficient manner. I can see webbs heading the same way. He is very near ice when he's racing (not off the track though). It will be an interesting year. For the record though I want NH to get the 2nd seat.

Gabrio · 11 Jan 2005, 09:25 (Ref:1197913)

What I don't understand is why Williams didn't take Fisichella. To me he's among the 5 top drivers today. Webber is a charger and I'm ok with that. But who's going to give technical feedback to the engineers?

Glen · 11 Jan 2005, 10:04 (Ref:1197940)

Fabio wasn't going to let Williams have Webber and Fisi in the same team - Williams had to choose.

RWC · 11 Jan 2005, 10:59 (Ref:1197976)

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ozsport

I think Webbs has proven he will be equal of speed. Every car he has been in he has been a few places up the ladder than the car deserved.

The only thing I worry about with him is the whole "moral" idea.. My dislike of MS is due to him taking people out with a cold efficient manner. I can see webbs heading the same way. He is very near ice when he's racing (not off the track though). It will be an interesting year. For the record though I want NH to get the 2nd seat.

You see that possibly happening too ?! i thought i was the only one that worried about that
I too think he will prove to be a stunningly fast,very much in the style of shu.That's probably why i'm uneasy about how he will choose when a dodgey moral choice comes along.

Kicking-back · 11 Jan 2005, 13:51 (Ref:1198115)

Quote:

Originally Posted by RWC

As someone very neatly pointed out-dc *needs* to have a car that's a second a lap faster than everyone else to even have a chance at winning

He didn't have that in most of the races he has won, but never mind....

Gabrio · 11 Jan 2005, 13:53 (Ref:1198122)

Quote:

Originally Posted by Kicking-back

He didn't have that in most of the races he has won, but never mind....

Totally agree. One year in Magny Cours he beated MS fair and square.
However DC's performances seemed to go up an down many times. Maybe it was due to him or maybe to the team.

Super Tourer · 11 Jan 2005, 14:08 (Ref:1198133)

He's always been inconsistent - his last championship win was junior FFord back in 1989.

I like DC and he can be great on his day, but over time they have become fewer and fewer. In essence DC's F1 career has been a repeat of his junior formuale racing, some notable performances but not consistent enough to put together a championship winning season.

Gabrio · 11 Jan 2005, 14:17 (Ref:1198139)

Quote:

Originally Posted by Super Tourer

He's always been inconsistent - his last championship win was junior FFord back in 1989.

I like DC and he can be great on his day, but over time they have become fewer and fewer. In essence DC's F1 career has been a repeat of his junior formuale racing, some notable performances but not consistent enough to put together a championship winning season.

Yes and furthermore DC can be a great risk for bystanders

. A few years ago ha managed to put his Williams in the pit wall scaring the hell off all the bystanders (among which I was....) and after a few GPs, he managed to spin during the formation lap in Monza.....

Glen · 11 Jan 2005, 15:49 (Ref:1198204)

Quote:

Originally Posted by Super Tourer

He's always been inconsistent...

Well at least he's consistent in his inconsistency.

BootsOntheSide · 11 Jan 2005, 17:18 (Ref:1198281)

I'm not sure Webber is 'stunningly fast' - that may be the onyl aspect of the Schumacher package he lacks. He's certainly got some pace, as well as the occasional sensationally quick lap, and could be more impressive on a regular basis if given a car that doens't chew it's tyres, but I really don't see him as a future champion. As for the possibility of him going too far in the hunt to be competitive, I think that's possible, but he's done othign of the sort yet, so we'll have to wait and see.

Snrub · 11 Jan 2005, 19:56 (Ref:1198371)

Quote:

Originally Posted by Caligula B

Frentzen-Heidfeld, Heidfeld- Frentzen, equally matched in 2003 ! What could Nick take to Williams next year that Heinz couldn't in 97 or 98. Two peas from from the same pod, thank god Mr.Head is out of the way, at least Nick has a chance, Harry Frentzen was never allowed a look

I agree that the NH being able to run with HHF was a good indication of NH's ability, but I'm not sure that the HHF Williams comparison does NH any favors.

While Williams seemed convinced of HHF's ability when signing him, HHF certainly wasn't able to perform in the harsh Williams environment. Frankly I don't understand why a team like Red Bull wouldn't try to get HHF on board over DC. I have little doubt that HHF would be a WDC if he'd been with McLaren or Ferrari in '99, whereas DC had the car and isn't a WDC.

Kicking-back · 11 Jan 2005, 20:41 (Ref:1198426)

Snrub - HHF drove a world-championship winning car in 1997 and didn't win the title - and as for winning it in a Ferrari or McLaren, well, Schumacher and Hakkinen would have been too strong for him.

mac · 11 Jan 2005, 20:53 (Ref:1198435)

Quote:

Originally Posted by BootsOntheSide

I'm not sure Webber is 'stunningly fast' - that may be the onyl aspect of the Schumacher package he lacks.

I still say you cannot put a Jag R5 on the front row of any grid without having mega speed.

We'll find out more this year though, I guess.

Pizzonia to test tomorrow. Oooh this is frustrating!

Kirk · 11 Jan 2005, 21:09 (Ref:1198451)

How do you think Nick and Pizzo feel? At least they've both been signed. It is almost unanimous from onlookers that Nick should get the drive. I don't suppose Frank is considering having those two split the 2nd Williiam's seat, perhaps via some performance clause? Whatever, it is that is causing the indecision it is indeed frustrating for everyone. Even Webber, I reckon.

foreversideways · 11 Jan 2005, 21:46 (Ref:1198490)

Well never mind Pizzaboy if you don't get it, our local place is looking for a quick delivery guy

BootsOntheSide · 11 Jan 2005, 22:44 (Ref:1198551)

KB, Frentzen simply didn't fit in at Williams, for whatever reason, whereas the more laidback and casual atmosphere at Jordan (initially) suited him more. Talent wasn't the issue in 1997, as HHF proved both before and after that season, and McLaren and Ferrari have been more stable in terms of driver support and longevity than Williams in recent years.

Rich R · 11 Jan 2005, 23:54 (Ref:1198596)

true, but hakkinen or schumacher in teams that were focused on them(whether intentional or not), are a lot tougher prospect than villeneuve was, and if frentzen couldn't beat jv i can't see him beating the other 2.

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