[Team] Scuderia Toro Rosso: Now with HONDA

[S griffin]

Mansell more before he came to F1 and even when he got there, to begin with there were only flashes of form. And Damon looked steady to begin with, but eventually he became a champion

[chunterer]

Originally Posted by knighty

Irvine, Barachello, Massa.......dare I say Rosberg & Bottas too.......they were all nothing special when they started and all took about 5-10 years to mature

Rubens was an ace on the way up and had the drives been kinder to him was quite capable of being a multiple race winner imho.

I would say the same applies to Rosberg & Bottas. Both were highly rated in junior formula and as usual in F1 you don't get to show what you can really do until you get your backside into a decent car.

Massa was pethaps a surprise because he came into F1 from unfashionable series in Euro 3000. So he was kind of below the radar? But clearly someone somewhere knew he was really good!

[Mike Harte]

Originally Posted by chunterer

Massa was pethaps a surprise because he came into F1 from unfashionable series in Euro 3000. So he was kind of below the radar? But clearly someone somewhere knew he was really good!

The problem with Massa is that he is very fragile, and is in constant need of warm strokes to get anything out of him. One only needs to hear some of the radio traffic between his engineers and him to understand that. He also requires repeated instructions to get a move on, and I think that the pit wall often got a little fed up with having to push him.

[S griffin]

I just want to say that the best thing about the Brazilian Massa is that relationship with the great Rob Smedley

[GTRMagic]

So... if Mr Gasly is running in Japan, and Mr Sainz is off to Renault (In Mr Webber's seat... ) just who will drive for STR at CotA??

Did Renault pull the trigger too early?

Story Here

Mr Button to rave? Or Mr Hartley?

[S griffin]

Sounds like someone didn't get everything in place beforehand

[steve_r]

Very strange - if true. I did not know that Honda put such importance into Super Formula.

I guess one of the Red Bull rejects could be brought in from Formula E, to sit alongside Kvyatt who is presumably Red Bulls next reject.

[broadrun96]

Three other sites I read regularly for motorsports all said Honda did not push for him to win and would rather he ran F1 than try for the title. When it was just a test run, they said they would like him to come back. I think STR may not have talked with Honda since, all the reports from Masashi Yamamoto say he has no problems with Gasly running at Austin now that the seat is his.

[GTRMagic]

Hartley Lined Up For Austin, Maybe 2018

[peebee2]

Some really strange behaviour. Let a driver go to a fierce competitor and then realise you don’t have a replacement. Hartley would be somewhat desperation. Better Palmer.

[GTRMagic]

Originally Posted by peebee2

Some really strange behaviour. Let a driver go to a fierce competitor and then realise you don’t have a replacement. Hartley would be somewhat desperation. Better Palmer.

Has me wondering if Potsid helped secure the seal for Mr Hartley..

[S griffin]

Hey, if Lotterer can come in do a good job with Caterham, there's no reason why Hartley can't with Toro Rosso. I for one would welcome him

[RWill2073]

Why is Hartley considered desperation? He is a very high level driver, with red bull sponsorship, correct? Seems like a good opportunity to evaluate his skill in f1 without a huge commitment.

[gert]

For me the 'desperate' part is that they "have to" turn to a driver they dropped from their junior program.
I think that's quite funny.

Granted, he is (again) sponsored by Red Bull at the moment, but after he had to leave the Red Bull junior program and was a Mercedes test driver, he was wearing Monster logos (a Mercedes sponsor) so he was totally "out of the family" at that point.

Interesting how a number of dropped Red Bull junior still got decent careers after their exit.
* Brendon Hartley -> Le Mans winner, FIA WEC champion
* Neel Jani -> Le Mans winner, FIA WEC champion
* Sebastian Buemi -> FIA WEC champion
* Mirko Bortolotti -> Blancpain Endurance Cup champion + Blancpain GT overall champion
* Mikhail Aleshin -> Formula Renault 3.5 champion

There may be more...

[FIRE]

Not every Marlboro sponsored driver became a F1 driver.

[chillibowl]

still it is a bit unfortunate though...a number of highly regarded juniors just got stuck/squeezed out behind a couple of really highly rated and successful graduates from their program....but such is life in sports.

looking forward to seeing what Hartley can do.

one of the highlights of this season has been the number of one off drives we got to see. Giovinazzi, Gasly, Button, Di Resta, and now Hartley...good times!

[GT6]

i hope he does well, he has been a star in WEC and certainly he has to do something after the porsche pull out of WEC

[F1Guy]

STR may need Honda engines for the last round in Abu Dhabi.

https://uk.reuters.com/article/uk-mo...-idUKKBN1DB0K3


Or is this simply a squabble over a five points?

[crmalcolm]

Originally Posted by F1Guy

STR may need Honda engines for the last round in Abu Dhabi.

https://uk.reuters.com/article/uk-mo...-idUKKBN1DB0K3


Or is this simply a squabble over a five points?

Ted Kravitz describes it as nothing to do with the points at all. The whole argument is centred around both being critical of each other, and STR alluding to deliberate sabotage of their engine performance.
If Renault do go ahead and withdraw supply, then RBR will no doubt be affected by the situation too.

[S griffin]

Well, I can't see RBR having the Renault engine beyond 2018

[GTRMagic]

Renault seem a bit ballsier these days..
Having McLaren as a willing partner in your back pocket seems to play out to mean the Regie don’t need to take crap from team energy drink....

[S griffin]

Yes I think the McLaren deal could be the killer blow for RBR

[loon]

How funny would it be if Renault snatch away their engines from Red Bull

[Mekola]

In the last races, Honda is giving signs their engine is now better... Is not noted due to the heavy penalties, but is probably the Japanese company could do a happy surprise next year... Toro Rosso people could be glad about the matter. We'll see.

[knighty]

it would not surprise me if the main RedBull team make a last moment switch to Honda Power for 2018.......either way they will have a hard 2018 season with Mclaren coming into the Renault fold, and 2018 is their last with Renault engines, so why not double up the efforts and do all they can to bring the Honda package on sooner???.....they have nothing to lose, as this looks like their only choice for the year after in 2019........if Porsche come along, it will be in 2020.