Wilson at Jaguar! - Page 4

champcarman · 22 Jul 2003, 03:50 (Ref:667903)

A pretty stupid move by Jaguar. Pizzonia was just starting to come on strong. Has Webber got so much influence at Jaguar these days that he can get rid of a driver when he starts to pose a threat. I think Pizzonia has more talent than Wilson and I hope he can go back to Williams as their test driver and continue his F1 career.

marcus · 22 Jul 2003, 04:23 (Ref:667915)

I dont mind admitting that Im nationalistic , as F1manoz said we here in Oz have waited forever for a driver to get a good chance.

I hope Justin going to jag will spur Webber on even more.

GO AUSSIE !!!!!

Lee Janotta · 22 Jul 2003, 04:51 (Ref:667926)

Quote:

Originally posted by marcus
I dont mind admitting that Im nationalistic , as F1manoz said we here in Oz have waited forever for a driver to get a good chance.

I was speaking about the Brits. And there's nothing wrong with it, so long as it's not blind nationalism, but kept light-hearted, especially in a sporting context. Then it's perfectly healthy.

Valve Bounce · 22 Jul 2003, 05:10 (Ref:667932)

Quote:

Originally posted by f1manoz
Considering we Aussies have waited two decades for the next big thing from our shores, I think we're entitled to being VERY nationalistic and protective!

After THAT Rugby game,

let's not go down that road - I took enough stick from my sister in London as we watched the game, as it is.

More to the point - a drivers biggest enemy is his team mate (SchM not counted here). So, how Justin performs against Mark will make or break him - that is how he will be measured.

As with all budding F1 drivers, I wish Justin well. Just a pity that Ant didn't get the drive at Minardi - but then Stoddart is probably desperately trying to raise a few dollars for spare tyres for testing.

Mark Webber · 22 Jul 2003, 08:54 (Ref:668051)

Well I think this could be a silly move from Jag . Wilson in the seat for the rest of the year is a good thing and I wish him all the best (I'm sure he will drive a shock and awe campian to impress) . But as for next year Jag need a driver how can sort out a car with Mark and I don't think Wilson is the man for it at this stage .
Mark will enjoy the extra comp from Wilson and will have his measure but it will be good for the mean time to have to good drivers in the Cat

**Peter Mallett** · 22 Jul 2003, 08:59 (Ref:668059)

Wilson seems to be one of those people who can fit into a situation with ease, the lucky b'stard. So I think the concerns about experience may actually not be concerns at all.

If Mark can make the car work I'm sure Justin will provide the competition and support needed to move the Jaguars forward. Personal opinion but then so much of this subject is based on that anyway.

Burton · 22 Jul 2003, 09:33 (Ref:668086)

Pizza boy has nothing to do with Italian roots.
Its short for PIZZ(A)onia.

Dear oh Dear!

Well done to Justin tho, be good to have him back to his roots (Jag Racing formerly known as Paul Stewart Racing!)

Amaroo Park · 22 Jul 2003, 09:33 (Ref:668087)

Lets see how long it takes for Mark to make another team mate look ordinary.

Testure · 22 Jul 2003, 09:42 (Ref:668095)

Well, I think we all agree that Wilson will do just fine against Webber. He beat him in F3000, is a couple of years younger and seemed able to get up to speed pretty quickly with Minardi. Remember that he's had a a team-mate who's quite a bit handier than Webber's was last year. There again, he was no match for Zonta last year, was he?

The extra year of experience Webber has counts for a lot, though, and as far as I'm concerned is a big factor in his showing against Pizzonia. Going by the drivel in their press release, Jaguar would like us to think that the season so far has been a whitewash in Webber's favour, which I don't agree with at all. After the assurances they gave at Barcelona that Pizzonia was there 'til the end of the year, Wilson shouldn't trust that team one inch.

BootsOntheSide · 22 Jul 2003, 10:26 (Ref:668115)

Quote:

Originally posted by SALEEN S7R

Even though he wont be able to test until the Friday practise u can still be sure that he will be faster than what he would have been in the Minardi. Its a win win situation for Minardi, Jag and Wilson.

It's not really that simple though. If Wilson qualifies 18th with only the Minardis behind him, a second behind Webber, it would be a respectable redsult in my view, considerign that he'd've had no testing behidn the rookie time in which he has to learn the track (it's nothing like the same as in 2001 when he last drove there), however he would get criticised by many for being that near the back. I think he'll have to hit a reasonable pace quite quickly if he wants to secure the drive for 2004.

Valve Bounce · 22 Jul 2003, 10:39 (Ref:668124)

I think Jaguar are running out of people to fire.

JohnSSC · 22 Jul 2003, 10:57 (Ref:668141)

Press Release - Jaguar Racing - Department of Personnel Sacking:

"We would like to announce now that the only employee left to sack is Mark Webber. We are extremely dissappointed with his competent performance thusfar, giving us no actual reason to sack him. As everyone else has been sacked however, we expect to sack him shortly before we in the Jaguar Department of Personnel Sacking are ourselves, sacked.

In Redundancy We Trust,

The Jaguar Racing Department of Personnel Sacking"

.

Glen · 22 Jul 2003, 11:06 (Ref:668150)

Interesting point about the no testing - bad time of year to get a new drive. He will be allowed shake-down runs and car-fitting/installation type laps, since the testing ban does have a tiny bit of flexibility (I think it might be 20 laps... can't be sure). More or less though he'll just have to get in the car with Webber and Pizzonia's data and set-ups and go for it. In this sense it is lucky for him that Jaguar are in the Heathrow agreement, because at least he'll get the Friday morning session to aclimatise.

Don't expect too much of Wilson for a race or two then - for a start he's only in his first year - also he's a different shape to the average driver (although Webber is in fact taller than most) - added to which he won't be able to do a test session (although Minardi can't afford to test anyway!) - and the icing on the cake is he's got Webber to contend with... he might be a nice enough bloke, but he takes no prisoners on the race track and he's already seen off Pizzonia!

Cynic · 22 Jul 2003, 11:36 (Ref:668178)

I can't understand why people think this deal is hard on Pizzonia. There are plenty of examples of drivers who were great in every "junior" formula, but simply couldn't handle F1. In any case, Webber has scored most of Jag's points this season and Pizzonia didn't exactly set the world alight in F3000.Both Wilson and Alonso before him have been able to show their talents despite being saddled with a poor car. Pizzonia couldn't do anything with a half-decent one. Yes the deal appears to be tough on him, but that's life.

**Peter Mallett** · 22 Jul 2003, 12:11 (Ref:668207)

Quote:

Originally posted by Glen
..he might be a nice enough bloke, but he takes no prisoners on the race track and he's already seen off .............

You could be talking about either of them.

**Bononi** · 22 Jul 2003, 12:58 (Ref:668274)

Quote:

Originally posted by BootsOntheSide
It's not really that simple though. If Wilson qualifies 18th with only the Minardis behind him, a second behind Webber, it would be a respectable redsult in my view, considerign that he'd've had no testing behidn the rookie time in which he has to learn the track (it's nothing like the same as in 2001 when he last drove there), however he would get criticised by many for being that near the back. I think he'll have to hit a reasonable pace quite quickly if he wants to secure the drive for 2004.

Well, second to that press release, Jaguar needs both drivers performing. And the way they see things, Wilson must perform really well these last 5 races.

high contrast · 22 Jul 2003, 14:01 (Ref:668351)

We live in a world of media hype and politics!
The secret is to translate a Press Release, dodge the spin and try and understand the real reason behind the statement and the niceties! F1 is a fast moving business of high flying finance and gamesmanship!

Pizzaboy is just one of it's many victims (by the way in Britain its a term of endearment to make a pun out of someones name)

Let me put this one by you...F1 is at the sharpend of the current economic slowdown...Arrows has gone, Jordan's skint and Minardi's struggling to pay their bills...Kiesa's backers offer Minardi $$$ for a few races...Minardi offer Wilson and his $$$ to Jaguar in lou of payment for their V10s! Jag/Cosworth happy!...Minardi happy!...Wilson/JP happy!...Kiesa happy!...Fans/media happy!...Pizzaboy on the subs bench (tough)

How does that sound?

NOW...looking ahead to the next races...Wilson's going to be one maybe two seconds a lap quicker in a Jag...Now well see if he can cope. But what about Kiesa!!! he'll have to do a a bit of testing in front of the FIA observers to qualify for a Super License...BUT is HE fit enough to do F1?, remember he's never driven one before! Contrary to popular myth F1 cars ain't as easy to drive as none F1 drivers and fans think!

I cant wait...roll on Hockenheim.

PS: Lee Janotta...the Oz/Brit thing was funny!

Glen · 22 Jul 2003, 14:05 (Ref:668359)

Kiesa is going to find it extremely tough - I'd be very surprised if he finishes a race this season.

high contrast · 22 Jul 2003, 14:15 (Ref:668367)

Agreed Glen.

JR Ewing · 22 Jul 2003, 14:35 (Ref:668400)

Quote:

Originally posted by high contrast
But what about Kiesa!!! he'll have to do a a bit of testing in front of the FIA observers to qualify for a Super License...

Rubbish! He already qualifies for a superlicence. The observation bit is for people jumping in without the necessary licencing...

Gore · 22 Jul 2003, 19:03 (Ref:668651)

I think this is, in some ways, a smart move on Jaguar's part: Their thinking was probably that the #2 car was a write-off in terms of results this year, so they may as well bring Wilson in now and see if he's any good rather than signing him for 2004 and risk compromising next season like this with a driver who, for whatever reason, can't peform to the required level.

The timing's not great though is it, what with the testing ban and Pizzonia's performance at the Britsh GP? No doubt this was planned long before Pizzonia's impressive drive, but switching drivers during the testing restriction just risks making Jaguar look like fools if Wilson is no better than Pizzonia to begin with.

I don't really have too much sympathy for Pizzonia--all professional racing drivers know that they have to perform if they want to keep their seat. I imagine few people objecting to the reverse situation: a driver using performance clauses in his contracts to leave an uncompetitive team because he is good enough to be wanted elsewhere. To go back to an earlier post, the message this sends to aspiring drivers is that if you can't enter Forumla 1 like Senna, Schumacher, Raikkonen etc. did, you should look at a different career.

high contrast · 22 Jul 2003, 19:22 (Ref:668658)

Quote:

Originally posted by JR Ewing
Rubbish! He already qualifies for a superlicence. The observation bit is for people jumping in without the necessary licencing...

Not even regular F1 test drivers with International A licenses qualify for an FIA Super License. 2 days observation is the norm.

Mekola · 22 Jul 2003, 19:27 (Ref:668662)

Quote:

Originally posted by high contrast
Let me put this one by you...F1 is at the sharpend of the current economic slowdown...Arrows has gone, Jordan's skint and Minardi's struggling to pay their bills...Kiesa's backers offer Minardi $$$ for a few races...Minardi offer Wilson and his $$$ to Jaguar in lou of payment for their V10s! Jag/Cosworth happy!...Minardi happy!...Wilson/JP happy!...Kiesa happy!...Fans/media happy!...Pizzaboy on the subs bench (tough)

You forgot to say: Derek Hill happy! He saved his seat at SuperNova when he was about to be out of F3000 when SuperNova decided turned down their sister DBA team and moved DBA team leader Kiesa to the second SuperNova car.
Derek Hill saved his SuperNova seat unless another driver came to the team with fresh money.

paulzinho · 22 Jul 2003, 19:32 (Ref:668669)

Hmmm another thought... Jag have had 5 drivers in a year and a half..... not bad going that!

high contrast · 22 Jul 2003, 19:36 (Ref:668675)

Quote:

Originally posted by Splatz the Cow
Lets hope Jaguar want Wilson for his talent and not Nationanality, as I thought they were over that.

If its a genuine deal, it should be good for Wilson.

You could have given them more options...eg: Money, bring some...and don't want any!

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