Surfers Paradise 2009

[Piglet]

I'm not sure how well know it was but the cars only arrived at Brands Hatch at around 7pm on the Friday night before race day and that was allegedly as a result of a dispute about a payment not having been made....

[kerrmanningjarv]

Originally Posted by Piglet

I'm not sure how well know it was but the cars only arrived at Brands Hatch at around 7pm on the Friday night before race day and that was allegedly as a result of a dispute about a payment not having been made....

I presume you mean Thursday night, because they had rookie and free practice on the Friday at Brands...

[Toads]

Not too happy about this. This would've been my hometown event and it really makes me wonder if Tony Teixeira has any idea how many people he has put out by stringing this event along as long as he did.

I can't see how thinks the A1GP statement even comes close to an apology. Tony Teixeira would have had to have known back when the deal was done, to weather he could honour it or not.

[Kiwi3]

Also interesting how he states he will donate a sum to charity etc when the whole issue is that he has not found money to pay suppliers...

He has zero credibility and nobody is going to believe his statement.

[JagtechOhio]

Kiwi,

That struck me as rather odd too. If A1GP needs to scrape together $2m to get the cars out of the warehouse for the next event on the schedule...do you think they're going to refund the Surfers sanctioning fee and donate to charity first?

[Oldtony]

The only way those cars are ever coming out of that wharehouse is for the recievers auction I would think.
By the way with the treatment handed out to people charged with financial misdeeds in China do you think anyone there is going to be interested in anything to do with the next event on the schedule?

[Mak]

The Queensland govt. may also put in a case for damages caused by the non arrival, to go onto the already massive A1 debts. Seem to be digging a bigger and bigger hole, making it harder to see a new management resurrect the series.

[Piglet]

Originally Posted by kerrmanningjarv

I presume you mean Thursday night, because they had rookie and free practice on the Friday at Brands...

Ahh yes, you're right, it was a three dayer.

[rychard]

Bit the cars were late coming to Kyalami and they cancelled half the prctice sessions. I think the cars were also impounded after the first Durban race

[fredd1]

mac,
You're on the right track - sure, it's all hindsight now, but the Champ/Indy racers at Surfers were a great spectacle and it's a shame that the Q government didn't try a bit harder to accommodate them.
Sorry for those who invested their hard earned in getting to what is now going to be largely a non event. The V8's are worth seeing tho they were at best, only running second to what was to be the main interest.
Strange to look back and see that the V8's didn't figure at this meeting a few short years ago. Don't recall tho why they weren't wanted or who didn't want who.

[JABWOA]

IIRC, the V8's wanted top billing or at least equal billing (to match thier ego's) and the event organisers quite rightly refused but then the CWWS/ChampCar collapse occured and played into thier hands (same thing happened at the F1 AGP)

[mountainstar]

Originally Posted by fredd1

mac,
You're on the right track - sure, it's all hindsight now, but the Champ/Indy racers at Surfers were a great spectacle and it's a shame that the Q government didn't try a bit harder to accommodate them.
Sorry for those who invested their hard earned in getting to what is now going to be largely a non event. The V8's are worth seeing tho they were at best, only running second to what was to be the main interest.
Strange to look back and see that the V8's didn't figure at this meeting a few short years ago. Don't recall tho why they weren't wanted or who didn't want who.

Champcar always wanted to be there, but the irl never did and only took the race for one year. Ultimately it was a dumb move abandoning a race which was well established AND one that paid for everything for them to come down.

Now the irl is scrambling to get a brand new race off the ground in the sugar cane fields of brazil along with starry visions of mega million prize funds and no surprise the race is going nowhere.

V8SC over the years ended up going from supporting the surfers race to pretty much sharing billing with it. Hence after a while they began to believe most fans were coming for the V8's and therefore they wanted all the cash and to be the headline event. Now they got it!

[Mak]

Always been a single seater fan, but to this date the best race meetings I have ever attended has been the Clipsal events. Much better than any F1, A1, wttc, bttc ect. races. Maybe Australia now has another standout motor-race event with its own well marketed V8 series. I hope the Queensland govt. realises this and keeps it going in the future. I Live in Europe and know the series has a big following her. Maybe the promotors could push the free to air coverage overseas. Motors has good coverage and I watched some of Bathurst online. Just think if the V8's were made more accessible to the general public their popularity would get a massive boost.

[Tourer]

Originally Posted by JABWOA

IIRC, the V8's wanted top billing or at least equal billing (to match thier ego's) and the event organisers quite rightly refused but then the CWWS/ChampCar collapse occured and played into thier hands (same thing happened at the F1 AGP)

The Gold Coast event has been a double header with the V8s having equal billing and their own pit lane since 2005. There was no resistance from either the organisers or the government - the time was right for it.

V8s have never asked for equal billing with Formula 1.

[Andy Roberts]

I'm in Surfers at the moment. Have been here for 6 months traveling round Oz while I wait for my permanent visa to come through, and we drove back up to the Gold Coast especially for the A1GP.

Brought our tickets in Brisbane on Tuesday $145 each, so annoyed when found out they were $100 on Saturday, then even more annoyed to find out A1GP had cancelled, but now a bit happier to see that GCMEC are issuing refunds if needed. Means I can take my tickets back tomorrow for a refund, then pickup the same tickets for $100 on Saturday at the circuit and end up watching the V8's instead.

Incidentally, apart from the obvious circuit in Surfers being built, if you didn't see that you wouldn't know the race is here. No signs anywhere for SuperGP and nothing really promoting it. Surprised at that.

[Tourer]

Views of some of the V8 Drivers:

http://news.smh.com.au/breaking-news...1019-h4w8.html

[Flyin Ryan]

Originally Posted by mountainstar

Champcar always wanted to be there, but the irl never did and only took the race for one year. Ultimately it was a dumb move abandoning a race which was well established AND one that paid for everything for them to come down.

Miller, Oreovicz, and Cavin said the race did not make sense for any of the teams outside of Craig Gore.

Shame for A1GP. It was a neat idea at first by the Arab sheik but the business model never made sense (business models not making sense - seems to apply across all racing, but when a person like me brings up common sense when it comes to prize money vs. operating costs on Ten Tenths and that the two have to be in line, I get shouted down). And then they went and made it far worse by getting a ridiculous Ferrari engine deal for no return when a bunch of Cosworths or whatever would have worked just as well for less cost.

[mountainstar]

Originally Posted by Flyin Ryan

Miller, Oreovicz, and Cavin said the race did not make sense for any of the teams outside of Craig Gore.

The reality was that it was a completely paid for gig and a well established event. Regardless of what those journalists say, it's their opinion and I have mine. It was stupid to give it up.

[Mak]

Originally Posted by Flyin Ryan

Miller, Oreovicz, and Cavin said the race did not make sense for any of the teams outside of Craig Gore.

Shame for A1GP. It was a neat idea at first by the Arab sheik but the business model never made sense (business models not making sense - seems to apply across all racing, but when a person like me brings up common sense when it comes to prize money vs. operating costs on Ten Tenths and that the two have to be in line, I get shouted down). And then they went and made it far worse by getting a ridiculous Ferrari engine deal for no return when a bunch of Cosworths or whatever would have worked just as well for less cost.

Season 3 it all started to come together outgoing=income. Unfortunately is was not the cost of the engine deal but the so called use of Ferrari branding which cost so much. Agree on engine front thou, should have stayed with tried, testested and successful Zytek unit.

[mac]

Originally Posted by mountainstar

The reality was that it was a completely paid for gig and a well established event. Regardless of what those journalists say, it's their opinion and I have mine. It was stupid to give it up.

I agree - though I think a lot of the reason for its disappearance was to do with the inflexibility of V8 Supercars in regards to the date.

The IRL wanted to move it forward to fit in with their season (primarily the Motegi round), Tony Cochrane refused - the organisers decided to lie prostrate at the feet of Cochrane.

If Cochrane and the organisers had been willing to negotiate, the IRL would probably still have been a part of the event - however, I firmly believe Cochrane saw a reunited IRL (with two strong Australians involved) as a threat to the status of V8s at the event, so did everything he could to remove them... ie. refusing to budge on the date.

[mountainstar]

Originally Posted by mac

I agree - though I think a lot of the reason for its disappearance was to do with the inflexibility of V8 Supercars in regards to the date.

The IRL wanted to move it forward to fit in with their season (primarily the Motegi round), Tony Cochrane refused - the organisers decided to lie prostrate at the feet of Cochrane.

If Cochrane and the organisers had been willing to negotiate, the IRL would probably still have been a part of the event - however, I firmly believe Cochrane saw a reunited IRL (with two strong Australians involved) as a threat to the status of V8s at the event, so did everything he could to remove them... ie. refusing to budge on the date.

I agree with your view of Cochrane. If one examines everything he has said for the last six or seven years, he has always wanted the race for himself with no other international series on the card.

However now it's V8SC's by default and we'll see how they handle it.

The irl trying to twin the race with Motegi didn't really matter to teams pocketbooks. The whole trip was paid for and AFAIK teams weren't out of pocket for anymore than they would be at any race in the USA, maybe even less.

Ultimately I think it was pretty simple. The irl made it clear they just didn't want the race. They took it on when KK bailed out of Champcar to facilitate a deal ending the series so KK could keep Craig Gores money around. When it was clear that Gore was on his way out and KK was no longer essential, so was the race.

In any case I think it was dumb for the irl to dump the race. Again it was a completely paid for gig and an established race that was secure, so it was a no brainer. Instead the irl would rather go to tiny places like Barber Motorsports Park in Birmingham, Alabama.

[JagtechOhio]

Mac, is there fact in that? About V8 blocking the date and blowing an otherwise potential deal?

[Tourer]

There is likely to be some fact in Mac's post but maybe a bit overstated (sorry Mac).

The V8's calendar is announced each year in September and the dates locked down etc.

I'd suggest that as the whole discussion on changing the date was in November then the V8 calendar was out, tickets already on sale for the Gold Coast race based on the announced dates etc.

Whilst I have no doubt that Cochrane held his ground - I don't know that I'd have done anything different personally.

After all that, the Indy guys only finished there season a week ago so it wouldn't have been a BIG issue (I would think) for them to do the race on the announced date?

[JagtechOhio]

Hi Tourer,

Most of this is conjecture, but I believe the agreement to have the IndyCar Championship at Homestead is a crucial part of that arrangement.

The Nascar finale is at the same track, a few weeks from now: separation was necessary between the two events for ticket sale considerations.

So IRL couldn't run Surfers this time of year. I completely disagree about the wisdom of linking Surfers and Motegi: if you cut both deals right, you pocket big profit from the savings on the logistics. It's a no brainer.

[mountainstar]

Originally Posted by JagtechOhio

Hi Tourer,

Most of this is conjecture, but I believe the agreement to have the IndyCar Championship at Homestead is a crucial part of that arrangement.

The Nascar finale is at the same track, a few weeks from now: separation was necessary between the two events for ticket sale considerations.

So IRL couldn't run Surfers this time of year. I completely disagree about the wisdom of linking Surfers and Motegi: if you cut both deals right, you pocket big profit from the savings on the logistics. It's a no brainer.

The total package to the irl was $11 million Aus$ with most everything, including travel paid for. It was a win win deal and teams didn't have to reach into their pockets.

Now they don't have that revenue at all so where is the savings?

The date changes the irl proposed conflicted with other major sporting events in Australia such as the Australian Grand Prix, the AFL Grand Final, etc.