[BTCC] BTCC News & Rumours 2025

[S griffin]

Originally Posted by coffinpilot

The second chassis they have is the one Deleon raced last year - supposedly one of the other two can't be touched because of finance against it.

Hopefully it can find a good home eventually

[Pickles]

Originally Posted by coffinpilot

The second chassis they have is the one Deleon raced last year - supposedly one of the other two can't be touched because of finance against it.

Pretty much everything Gilham sold throughout 2023 had finance against it.

[Sodemo]

How much of a factor is the cost of hybrid in the shrinking grid size?

[Mike Harte]

Originally Posted by Sodemo

How much of a factor is the cost of hybrid in the shrinking grid size?

Any cost could be a factor, even tyres let alone the hybrid system. I believe that the upfront lease fee for each car is about £50,000, so would possibly account for up to 10% of the cost for each car for the year.

[coffinpilot]

I thought the hybrid cost for 2024 was £30,000?

The more important question to me at the moment is, can AT-S raise the budget to step back further up the grid? His form in the car he has (Doble too) makes you wonder what he'd do somewhere else?

I think if he could raise the budget for Excelr8 they'd benefit as much as he, having a second driver who can deliver at a high level on a consistent basis would be an advantage. Or NAPA? Could he outbid Rowbottom? For what most of us expect will be the only seat questioned. A switch to RWD with WSR? Is a Toyota seat really worth the extra £££s? They're not that far ahead of PMR.

[touring fan01]

Originally Posted by Mike Harte

Any cost could be a factor, even tyres let alone the hybrid system. I believe that the upfront lease fee for each car is about £50,000

no
its £25k and paid in 2 or 3 instalments over the season

[Spanner monkey]

Originally Posted by coffinpilot

I thought the hybrid cost for 2024 was £30,000?

The more important question to me at the moment is, can AT-S raise the budget to step back further up the grid? His form in the car he has (Doble too) makes you wonder what he'd do somewhere else?

I think if he could raise the budget for Excelr8 they'd benefit as much as he, having a second driver who can deliver at a high level on a consistent basis would be an advantage. Or NAPA? Could he outbid Rowbottom? For what most of us expect will be the only seat questioned. A switch to RWD with WSR? Is a Toyota seat really worth the extra £££s? They're not that far ahead of PMR.

I don't think he could outbid Rowbottom as he has the Cataclean backing. Also he has proved to be very quick if a little inconsistant at times but also is a team player as he proved last year.

[Mike Harte]

Originally Posted by touring fan01

no
its £25k and paid in 2 or 3 instalments over the season

Has this changed for this year, because I'm pretty certain that in the last year, possibly the year before, this was discussed on here and the cost was £50k and that had to be paid before Cosworth would deliver and install the system.

This came up because one team wasn't able to pay up before the launch day, and Cosworth was installing the system in the pit's garage/team awning whilst all the other teams were out testing.

[coffinpilot]

Originally Posted by Mike Harte

Has this changed for this year, because I'm pretty certain that in the last year, possibly the year before, this was discussed on here and the cost was £50k and that had to be paid before Cosworth would deliver and install the system.

This came up because one team wasn't able to pay up before the launch day, and Cosworth was installing the system in the pit's garage/team awning whilst all the other teams were out testing.

That was Team Hard for 2023 at Brands. I'm sure it was 20k overall in 2022, and 25k overall in 2023 (meaning Hard would have needed a lot of cash up front for even the first instalment fees from the drivers at Brands - I'm sure they got two out that day.

[touring fan01]

Originally Posted by Mike Harte

Has this changed for this year, because I'm pretty certain that in the last year, possibly the year before, this was discussed on here and the cost was £50k and that had to be paid before Cosworth would deliver and install the system.

This came up because one team wasn't able to pay up before the launch day, and Cosworth was installing the system in the pit's garage/team awning whilst all the other teams were out testing.

it has never been above £25k
it was just under £21k first year in 2022 and has gone up (inflation) to just under £25k this year

https://www.carmagazine.co.uk/hybrid/btcc-hybrid/

[Pickles]

Originally Posted by coffinpilot

That was Team Hard for 2023 at Brands. I'm sure it was 20k overall in 2022, and 25k overall in 2023 (meaning Hard would have needed a lot of cash up front for even the first instalment fees from the drivers at Brands - I'm sure they got two out that day.

I caught up with the man who lent Tony the money for the hybrid in 2023, at Snetterton this year. Guess who is still waiting for his £100k?

[thetool]

Originally Posted by Pickles

I caught up with the man who lent Tony the money for the hybrid in 2023, at Snetterton this year. Guess who is still waiting for his £100k?

At what point does it become fool me twice (or ten times) shame on me? This is one leopard that's never appeared to change it's spots.

[Pickles]

Originally Posted by thetool

At what point does it become fool me twice (or ten times) shame on me? This is one leopard that's never appeared to change it's spots.

From what I could see it was a case of borrowing more and more from people who were already owed money, with a promise that the big sponsorship deal was just around the corner and everyone would get paid back. But of course it never came. Talking to another debtor the other day and the figures are astonishing. Over a million quid from just 5 people. And he probably still owes around 30 staff, plus other companies/ suppliers, as well as things like track days and the scholarship which were paid for and never happened.

[coffinpilot]

Originally Posted by Pickles

From what I could see it was a case of borrowing more and more from people who were already owed money, with a promise that the big sponsorship deal was just around the corner and everyone would get paid back. But of course it never came. Talking to another debtor the other day and the figures are astonishing. Over a million quid from just 5 people. And he probably still owes around 30 staff, plus other companies/ suppliers, as well as things like track days and the scholarship which were paid for and never happened.

There's a decent Netflix financial crime documentary series in this story somewhere!

[TinTopGrumpy]

Originally Posted by Mike Harte

Has this changed for this year, because I'm pretty certain that in the last year, possibly the year before, this was discussed on here and the cost was £50k and that had to be paid before Cosworth would deliver and install the system.

I've never seen a figure that high quoted for the hybrid lease. Earlier this year Gow said the cost of hybrid to a team is less than the entry fees for the season which are around the £30k mark I believe.

[coffinpilot]

25k, 30k. It's a lot of money for most of us, but let's be honest, if 25k or 30k is too close to the bone for a season budget, no matter which team or level you're at, then you're cutting it too fine.

I get that some stat the season with the budget to be picked up along the way, but still, it's relatively small in the overall scheme of things, less than the tyre bill, if it wasn't a discount.

In that, does anybody know how much the teams pay for tyres? I know the TCR teams are paying around £325 per tyre, and this year they're racing the BTCC medium and hard.

Fag packet maths says at that price it would be £39k per season without discount for 30 races at £325 a boot, and that's before tyres for practice or testing.

I do know a couple of BTCC teams make a few quid back by selling used tyres - five or six laps on them - to some TCR drivers to use of Friday practice. Not sure what the TCR rules are - six tyres per weekend I think, but you're allowed to carry over?

[Mike Harte]

Originally Posted by TinTopGrumpy

I've never seen a figure that high quoted for the hybrid lease. Earlier this year Gow said the cost of hybrid to a team is less than the entry fees for the season which are around the £30k mark I believe.

My apologies to everyone over the figure that I quoted; this appears to have stuck in my mind from previous posts in the past that appeared to suggest that £50k was the sort of cost for the hybrid system. One such by redshoes was this from April 2022 in that year's rumours and news thread, discussing Goff not coming back to the series:

He's out. No definitive reason why, depends who you ask, but money is the common thread.

May or may not be related but I understand Hard only ordered a couple of hybrid kits, despite running multiple cars. They are expecting the drivers to find the extra £50K cost.

[touring fan01]

Originally Posted by coffinpilot

In that, does anybody know how much the teams pay for tyres? I know the TCR teams are paying around £325 per tyre, and this year they're racing the BTCC medium and hard.

btcc teams pay under £300 a tyre

[sceptic]

Originally Posted by touring fan01

btcc teams pay under £300 a tyre

It used to be £960 for a set around five years ago, but probably gone up a bit since then.

[coffinpilot]

Okay, some not very exciting gossip for next year. Croft are getting some new toilet blocks for next season - converted shipping containers on the Tower Straight. Apparently they have the permission, but removing the old cess pit is going to be a big job (no pun intended.)

They're also supposed to be getting a new medical centre in time for the 2025 season (I can't see that happening to be honest) it took how many years for Lando Norris' uncle to get that new cafe built?

The plan is supposedly to knock down the current prefab unit starting the day after the final club race of the year, to have ready for 2025 with a possible delay to the start of the club calendar. I live round there. I know for a fact that it's a mad plan to try build a two storey permanent structure of that kind of quality in a few months over winter. The ground will be a mess. The water table is utterly horrendous in winter there.

[S griffin]

I think it’s about time Croft had a refurbishment. So hopefully the changes will help the overall look and facilities

[Evantra]

New TOCA Junior car to revealed imminently at 6:30, for those interested. @tocajuniorchampionship

[Evantra]

Originally Posted by Evantra

New TOCA Junior car to revealed imminently at 6:30, for those interested. @tocajuniorchampionship

https://btcc.net/covers-officially-c...-launch-event/

Looks kinda dated, but hopefully the grids and racing are good!

[S griffin]

Originally Posted by Evantra

New TOCA Junior car to revealed imminently at 6:30, for those interested. @tocajuniorchampionship

Looks like an old post van

[AJD]

Originally Posted by Evantra

https://btcc.net/covers-officially-c...-launch-event/

Looks kinda dated, but hopefully the grids and racing are good!

I thought the same on first glance. However like you say what it looks like is secondary as long as the racing is good and the numbers are decent.

It'll be nice to have a junior series back.