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19 Aug 2010, 09:55 (Ref:2747036) | #76 | ||
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Notwithstanding my conversation with John and Claire last Sunday, I'm having second thoughts about M3s and Cossies. Still not sure that we need to let them in.
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19 Aug 2010, 10:03 (Ref:2747038) | #77 | |||
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Precisely....our car was ineligible on the grounds of being an '88 and having a turbo.....I know Claire contacted me late on to invite us to the Invitation class (naturally) but of course at that stage budgets etc were already fixed (if not stretched......) A little OT, but it might help in getting people to think about future events if some of those who did participate in this year's race could give a realistic (tho obviously "ballpark") figure for what the event cost - we know the entry fee, but what were the on-day costs - fuel/tyres/extra wheels(??) etc and what were the extra costs of prep - special fueling churns / modded exhausts / big block under the accelerator to prevent over-revving, that sort of thing? I'm just thinking that some people might perceive it as being "too expensive" without much by way of proper data.....tho' I'm not expecting it to be cheap Last edited by Lancsbreaker; 19 Aug 2010 at 10:12. |
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Richard Murtha: You don't stop racing because you are too old, you get old when you stop racing! But its looking increasingly likely that I've stopped.....have to go back to rallying ;) |
19 Aug 2010, 10:18 (Ref:2747044) | #78 | |
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Yes, what way was the refueling done? That is a bit I am unsure of.
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19 Aug 2010, 10:31 (Ref:2747051) | #79 | ||
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It's all in the regs on 360 website. Nothing expensive, just the Sunoco style churns or similar. They are around £30 which is same as a cheap jerrycan. Important bit is the filler into tank- that can make all the difference- the Corolla struggled whereas the Jag was 'optimised'.
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19 Aug 2010, 10:42 (Ref:2747056) | #80 | ||
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I've just realised that a few of the "cost questions" are discussed in one of the many other threads...in the National racing" lounge....and its useful info....but I suspect to really promote the event some sort of "Facts pack" might be a useful tool to encourage people to make an informed decision on entering.
Of course now 360 has a "track record" (groan) the event can be more confidently promoted in plenty of time to allow people to build it into their plans |
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Richard Murtha: You don't stop racing because you are too old, you get old when you stop racing! But its looking increasingly likely that I've stopped.....have to go back to rallying ;) |
19 Aug 2010, 11:08 (Ref:2747066) | #81 | |
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This is true, it is no longer 'notional'
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19 Aug 2010, 15:12 (Ref:2747161) | #82 | ||
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One thing that was apparent whilst observing some of the re-fuelling was the number of people who were using a standard tank and still using the standard vent. For the Dump type churns I think it advisable to utilise a ventilation system of at least a 20 mm id,this should be enough to let the air out fast enough to take full advantage of churn fuelling.
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Living the dream,Chief instruktor and racing on the worlds best circuits-The Nordschleife and Spa.Getting to drive the worlds best cars-someone has to do it, so glad its me. |
19 Aug 2010, 15:31 (Ref:2747170) | #83 | |||
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Firstly what a great day had by all and extra special for us as it led to our first team victory. Other than our fantastic driving ( especially Russell's who managed to keep her going with 'the back axle hanging off') the time spent in the pits ( or lack of it! )was the key to success. We were doing hourly driver changes so no real advantage with the big tank also regs stated that we could only put 60 litres in at a time which is pretty much what we were burning per hour anyway!! The "HOT ROD JAG!!" also put in the second fastest lap time, beaten only by Mikes fantastic Escort that was running slicks.... Consistency and reliablity were the words of the day and the 53 year old Jag had both until the last 45mins when something gave way on the back axle which kept us in the pits for 9 laps and nearly let the unstoppable Pug catch up. Not many races are that close over that time and with the Pug munching 6 seconds each lap it was going to be pretty close until Russell changed his driving style to allow for the wobbly back end and got his times back down to 1.30 ish. The atmosphere in the pit lane was electric and we honestly thought it was going to go to the wire, if we could even keep her going! Just a bit of info for anyone thinking of entering next year. My Jag is prepared to run in the CSCC's Swinging sixties series and has done a whole seasons racing (15 plus hours!!) with nothing more than spanner checks and oil changes. Not bad for a old girl. She was also prepared over 15 years ago! We also could of just about finished the race on one set of Tyres, so anything that can run for an hour'ish on fuel and can keep going is in with a real chance of challenging our title.... We learnt a few other things on the day to tweek us next year but will be keeping those to ourselves!! A really fantastic day and to be honest if you look at other events that last for half an hour and still have all the associated costs of travel, car prep each race etc etc the "360" represents good value for money. So get your get your entries in early and show support for Claire and her team and I look forward to a full grid next year. Many thanks to Claire, John and all the other teams that took part. |
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19 Aug 2010, 15:39 (Ref:2747178) | #84 | |||
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19 Aug 2010, 15:47 (Ref:2747181) | #85 | ||
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lol,
Welcome to 10ths Ed. I still haven't got to the bottom of our lack of speed, but I usually burn between 55 and 60 litres in a one hour race at Snet. Last weekend we were burning 40! Can't just have been the choked exhaust. |
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19 Aug 2010, 15:58 (Ref:2747184) | #86 | ||
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Welcome Ed, great post, and well done on hard won victory.
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19 Aug 2010, 16:21 (Ref:2747191) | #87 | ||
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re refueling, we had a couple of blue pressurized churns ready but after David explained how he covered himself in unleaded while practising his pit-stop we switched to our back-up churns because we had a standard filler. I suspect the answer is we all have boot-mounted tanks if refueling is to be by dump churn, which isn't a problem (although the Lancia would need modifying if we wanted to enter it again).
As for eligibility, Peter's list is a great starting point. I had a mint GS/E not so long ago which would have been perfect for the 360 (GS/Es won the first two Willhires back to back) but there was nowhere to race it so I sold it. Try finding one now, grr! I've never owned one but a 2-litre Sierra or Mk2 Golf should be a safe bet for 6 hours? Just as with Spa, if you want to win, first you have to FINISH, and finishing in itself is a major triumph. Finally, I couldn't agree more with Claire, keep App K cars OUT of the 360 - from the very start it was intended for cars that weren't eligible for Spa, so please let's keep it that way. |
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19 Aug 2010, 16:59 (Ref:2747213) | #88 | |||
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There are pros & cons for all refuelling methods but certainly your set up looked the best there. Helps to have a car with boot, though! Maybe hinges on the bootlid would help that part of the operation! Terry is right about venting the tank- look at pictures of 70's ETCC cars or other endurance racers and they have an outlet same size as inlet. The ETCC cars had them set in bootlid- full churn went on one and a breather churn on other if I am thinking correctly? Look forward to doing battle next year Ed- I will be in a more suitable car with same tyres as everyone else! Mike |
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19 Aug 2010, 17:24 (Ref:2747224) | #89 | ||
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>>>>>>>The "HOT ROD JAG!!"
Sorry Ed, it wasn't meant to be disparaging, as a former Hot Rod MG Midget owner I love that car It's just a little wry joke using terminology favoured by some contributors here who prefer to keep things "original". Your car and my old one are EXACTLY the sort of thing I enjoy - sympathetic modifications totally in the spirit of club racing in the day. And I think that sums up the ethos of the 360 as well. |
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Midgetman - known as Max Tyler to the world. MaxAttaq! |
19 Aug 2010, 19:41 (Ref:2747293) | #90 | |
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CSCC Swinging Sixties #128 Red/Black Mustang |
19 Aug 2010, 20:14 (Ref:2747307) | #91 | |
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I asked somewhere a wee while ago about how the noise levels are measured. What I am trying to get at is, if I am running a V6 engine and I bring the exhausts out, one on each side, where does the decibel meter measure from? 1 meter behind the car? 1 meter from each exhaust? Surely if all other things are equal, in those circumstances it should give a lower reading than a straight 4?
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19 Aug 2010, 21:19 (Ref:2747347) | #92 | |||
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That's a really good question and one for the experts. We had noise issues on Sunday and we were thinking of doing a similar thing... The Jag runs side pipes that both exit on the left, we were going to redirect one to underneath the other side hoping it would quieten things down on the left. Thankfully the geniuses from Mallett Racing had an easier solution involving scouring pads, long pokey things and bits of wire. It just got us under the 105 but I think we shot three marshalls on the first lap!! |
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19 Aug 2010, 21:25 (Ref:2747348) | #93 | ||
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19 Aug 2010, 21:51 (Ref:2747351) | #94 | |||
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No offence taken. It made me smile the thought of it running at Santa Pod. I can't take any credit for the mods done to her as I bought her pretty much as is, I really have just spanner checked her and changed the oil all year. Planning some real TLC for the winter. Chris Williams enjoyed his first time out in her on Sunday and still has a silly grin on his face today. She is a real pleasure to race and looks great in amongst ( and beating ) the modern cars. Bit upset that a few people thought it was wrong that an invitation car was allowed to win but Blimey she was twenty years older than anything else on the grid and only 290cc too big. If she was running a non production engine with a pair of turbos and slicks then fair play but I think she is totally in the spirit of the event and I'm sure that the regs and classes will be updated to allow her and similar older club cars in next year. I agree with the posts that suggests that Appendix K cars are excluded as they could really take the Clubmanship out of a really great event. The banter in the garages the night before was very very funny with several teams claiming times that Hamilton would be proud of. We obviously joined in and I think the Hot Rod would have broken most land speed records if there were any truth in our boasts!! |
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19 Aug 2010, 21:53 (Ref:2747352) | #95 | ||
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19 Aug 2010, 21:55 (Ref:2747353) | #96 | ||
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There was confusion regarding this but the track allowed 105 and I think thats the way its going to stay. It was something to do with the way they were measured I think.
Ed |
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19 Aug 2010, 22:00 (Ref:2747356) | #97 | ||
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19 Aug 2010, 23:38 (Ref:2747393) | #98 | |
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Is anyone else finding it strange that in this thread and the others concerning the 360 event that everyone seems to agree that Appk is not good for 'club' motorsport yet normally everyone is so biased towards it
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CSCC Swinging Sixties #128 Red/Black Mustang |
20 Aug 2010, 05:45 (Ref:2747446) | #99 | |||
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Living the dream,Chief instruktor and racing on the worlds best circuits-The Nordschleife and Spa.Getting to drive the worlds best cars-someone has to do it, so glad its me. |
20 Aug 2010, 07:04 (Ref:2747466) | #100 | |
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