GT3: ACO style

[S griffin]

We're still waiting for Honda, I wonder if it will happen? I doubt it. Toyota are staying here for quite a bit, so they don't need to worry about Honda

[Coach Ep]

Sounds like it's time for WEC to put some 'mild diplomatic pressure' on Toyota to add a few boxes to the Fuji pitlane. The track itself is long and wide enough to host 40+ cars and there's sufficient amount of time to finish the construction project well be before the 2024 race.

[hondafan37]

DSC said: "It is worth saying that as things currently stand, DSC would expect a minimum of seven potential two-car teams from different makes, with the potential for tough choices to be made about the available slots on the grid for significantly more manufacturers than that"

https://www.dailysportscar.com/2023/...-portimao.html

[KlBD]

Originally Posted by Coach Ep

Sounds like it's time for WEC to put some 'mild diplomatic pressure' on Toyota to add a few boxes to the Fuji pitlane. The track itself is long and wide enough to host 40+ cars and there's sufficient amount of time to finish the construction project well be before the 2024 race.

Recall also that Fuji regularly hosts 42-3 cars for Super GT multiple times per year, and the Super Taikyu Fuji 24h in recent years has also had 50-60 cars.

[Mike E]

I was wondering about Super Taikyu. They regularly have big fields

[CTD]

Originally Posted by KlBD

Recall also that Fuji regularly hosts 42-3 cars for Super GT multiple times per year, and the Super Taikyu Fuji 24h in recent years has also had 50-60 cars.

Not knowing enough about Super GT, but the format of the series can affect the amount of the cars massively. The Nürburgring 24h is a good example of multiple teams in the same box, with a shared refueling area.
This is not the format of WEC, so one box per car is currently required.

[Richard117]

Originally Posted by CTD

Not knowing enough about Super GT, but the format of the series can affect the amount of the cars massively. The Nürburgring 24h is a good example of multiple teams in the same box, with a shared refueling area.
This is not the format of WEC, so one box per car is currently required.

In Sebring with the remote garages they dump the regular WEC format of one pitbox per car too. So why should it be a problem to change the format on other tracks?

Are we sure the number of pitboxes is limiting the WEC grid size? I know in the past it was the amount of space in the cargoplane that was the limit.

[PhilipR]

Originally Posted by Richard117

In Sebring with the remote garages they dump the regular WEC format of one pitbox per car too. So why should it be a problem to change the format on other tracks?

Are we sure the number of pitboxes is limiting the WEC grid size? I know in the past it was the amount of space in the cargoplane that was the limit.

But if they do not limit number of entries into WEC how to they balance Le Mans entries from IMSA, ELMS or ALMS?

More cars in WEC less spaces available for Le Mans and then people will complain that their favourite team did not get an entry. These are not simple solutions and a capping on entries in WEC are needed.

[Coach Ep]

Originally Posted by PhilipR

But if they do not limit number of entries into WEC how to they balance Le Mans entries from IMSA, ELMS or ALMS?

More cars in WEC less spaces available for Le Mans and then people will complain that their favourite team did not get an entry. These are not simple solutions and a capping on entries in WEC are needed.

Spoken like a true ACO executive!

[PhilipR]

Originally Posted by Coach Ep

Spoken like a true ACO executive!

How much do they pay?? :P

[KlBD]

Originally Posted by CTD

Not knowing enough about Super GT, but the format of the series can affect the amount of the cars massively. The Nürburgring 24h is a good example of multiple teams in the same box, with a shared refueling area.
This is not the format of WEC, so one box per car is currently required.

From what I've seen in Super GT, it looks like 1 car per garage bo since each team has its own refuelling rig and dedicated garage decoration, and if a team has multiple cars then they get one garage stall each.

The garage space probably isn't the limiting factor, considering DSC reported there is something like 128 cars at Barcelona this weekend for the first round of ELMS and its support series.

[J Jay]

Would (sea) freight not also be a factor potentially limiting the WEC grid size? Perhaps at the moment, the logistics just work out, but it needs a significant increase for an extra cargo ship* to make sense financially.

*Forgive me, if it wasn't obvious I am not an expert in international logistics.

[broadrun96]

Think they have a deal now with one of the ME airlines for air freight but I think there's still a space limitation that they are close to if not at.

Don't forget that the ACO, I think, still gets to decide on LM invites and they seem to enjoy, as do many fans, the extra LM cars so they will want to limit the WEC teams so they can add on. But that's still only halfish so there's a bit of wiggle room there

[v8supes]

I wanted ACO to go GT3 but its starting to sound like there are going to be an awful lot of unhappy drivers/teams. If the 20+ Hypercar grid does end up happening then maybe you can split Hypercar & LMP2 from GT3 and have 2 separate races?

[Mike E]

It will be interesting to see how this is managed. Will we see a Honda GT3 in WEC before we see a Honda Hypercar?

https://www.dailysportscar.com/2023/...ith-honda.html

[Simmi]

Originally Posted by Mike E

It will be interesting to see how this is managed. Will we see a Honda GT3 in WEC before we see a Honda Hypercar?

https://www.dailysportscar.com/2023/...ith-honda.html

There's some really interesting kinda political moves here around GT3. You can look at it both ways. Have a stance of "commit to hypercar and you'll get GT3 too". Or throw them the GT3 bone in the hope it leads to a full commitment.

That said, I know there's the JAS link, but I'm getting semi-works at best vibes from that entry.

[broadrun96]

Yeah, I'm also not sure what they ACO wants. Could a true semi-works project be what they want entered over a full privateer?

[Simmi]

Don't think it's worth setting up a separate thread but I'd be interested to know which manufacturers people would pick for the GT3 grid. Feels a bit finger in the air still on exact numbers. But let's say 20 Hypercars, 16 GT3s (8 teams) to make up a 36-car grid.

Which 8 would you invite? And why? Feel free to add teams too to run the cars. I'll make my picks later.

[rdjones]

Well it looks like Mercedes-AMG are exploring FIA WEC & ELMS LMGT3 options:-

https://www.dailysportscar.com/2023/...3-options.html

Also Aston Martin are still hoping to Secure LMGT3 Grid Places

https://sportscar365.com/lemans/wec/...3-grid-places/

It will be interesting to see who is on the grid next year.

[Coach Ep]

38 cars on the full season entry list this year. Assuming the same number for next season as demands will only increase!

20-22 Hypercars
16-18 GT3

Manufacturers already in HY:
1) Porsche
2) Ferrari
3) GM (Corvette)
4) BMW (starting 2024)
5) Lamborghini (starting 2024)

-) Toyota (Lexus. IMSA car available but not likely to be entered on world stage)

6) Aston Martin (longtime GT entrant)

7) Honda (if they join the HY class it's a guarantee)

8) McLaren or Mercedes (or both depending on Honda, see above)
9?) see 8.

If more Hypercar entries are to surface, start scratching from the bottom.

Not rocket science to be honest - but also not betting on the WEC to be transparent.

[broadrun96]

It feels like we will see
Porsche-pick a squad
Ferrari-AF Corse but others out there if they're busy
Corvette-PM cause well
Aston Martin-Heart of Racing seems likely
Lamborghini-don't know the teams running enough to call
MB-same as Lamborghini
Ford-Multimatic maybe or M-Sport takes it for them, most likely to try for 2025 over their debut season but who knows, and the bosses have stated a desire to be at LM again

Most likely entries above with McLaren, Honda, and BMW, longshot of Lexus to get a Euro team interested, to fight out the last one. Assuming no one would pick up, or ACO allow the long in the tooth Audi, Bentley, or Nissans, although don't the Bentley and Nissan homologations expire soon?

[Coach Ep]

Dang, I forgot about Ford!

surely they'll jump Aston Martin in the queue?

[broadrun96]

I would think both have a reasonable chance, Aston has been around a while. Ok ok, they kinda screwed everyone with the Valkyrie but GT has been a fairly consistent program

My list was just in order I thought of them rather than a ranking

[Koenigsegg]

I would say these 5 manufacturers will definitely be in LMGT3 due to them being in Hypercar as well in 2024:
- Porsche
- Ferrari
- BMW
- Corvette (since both Cadillac and Corvette are part of GM)
- Lamborghini

If certain GT teams are adament about being on the grid, it wouldn't surprise me if they would switch to these manufacturers due to their parent or sub company being in Hypercar 2024:
- Lexus (if the GT team can persuade Toyota to let them)
- Nissan (since Alpine falls under the Renault–Nissan–Mitsubishi Alliance)

If Honda approves entering the WEC Hypercar class:
- Honda

Then there are GT teams of manufacturers who aren't in Hypercar, but expressed desire to enter LMGT3. In order of likelihood I would say:
- Ford (too big of a manufacturer to deny in their return to GT racing while publicly expressing desire to return to Le Mans)
- Aston Martin (has been loyal to the GT class for years)
- Mercedes-AMG (also too big of a manufacturer to deny, however they don't have the history of Ford nor the loyalty of Aston Martin)
- McLaren (I just don't see them getting the nudge over Mercedes)
- Audi (discontinued their Hypercar/LMDh project and is most likely stopping customer support)

[broadrun96]

Thought Audi had announced they were stopping the R8 support and drivers recently.

Has the Nissan been updated in a while? Think I read somewhere that it is the oldest streetcar without an update in production and doesn't seem like the GT-R is really big in GT racing.