[WEC] Porsche GTP / Hypercar: factory and customer

[AGD]

I just checked the racing news for the day and saw this whopper. Well, Porsche back at Le Mans, it just makes sense. Too much sense.

Originally Posted by FordCosworthPanoz

Im a pessimist, but I love looking through forums and people always find to see this as a bad thing: Audi pulling out, what happens if Peugeot pulls out, too many manufacturers in LMP1, LMP1 is too expensive, Honda will go to DP, evil aliens in tin spaceships destroying Circuit de La Sarthe, ect.

I do think it is legitimate to think that more serious competition will lead to some of the other companies on the fence to question the investment it will take to be competitive. On the other hand, some may see the increased competition as a sign that Le Mans is the place to be. What will happen? It's hard to say. Will we see companies jump in in 2012 or 2013 with the "old" rules? I don't know again. We'll see.

As far as Audi goes, I don't know if they will stay or not. If they do, I wonder if they (and Peugeot if they stay) will stick with diesel. It may be wise for them to do what Peugeot does in the hopes of getting favorable French regulations, but I don't know. Someone who did the pit visit said that Audi was saying that a legitimate petrol team would have an advantage. I don't know, they might be right. We'll see. We could see signs of this if a legitimate petrol team comes in for 2012/13, but the move to a fuel consumption formula could change things.

But, yes, although there is a lot of excitement now, what will the petrol whiners say when a petrol team comes in and kicks the behind of all the privateer petrol runners? Dave Richards and others are going to lose their excuse. Will their teams go with them?

[CTD]

Originally Posted by Dead-Eye

It was 2007, so we'd be in 2008 if it had only been a year ago

This is embarrassing

[JAG]

Originally Posted by Speed-King

Will there even be an ALMS to be back in in 2014?!

When you consider future LMP and GTE options, the fallback option of GT3, and lacklustre state of GA, if the ALMS cannot make a go of things, I worry if there's any hope for professional sportscar racing in NA.

Previous sportscar failures where down to lack of new machinery, quite the opposite of todays scenario, should the ALMS fail, even with WEC competition, it will be down to poor management and lack of interest.

[hondafan37]

Greatest News!!!!
The last Porsche winner Le Mans, The 911 GT1 1998 was one of the most beautiful sport cars of all times, I would like that the new car will be as beautiful as this.
Perhaps this news pushes to japaneses brands to return too.

[deggis]

Originally Posted by AGD

Someone who did the pit visit said that Audi was saying that a legitimate petrol team would have an advantage.

I read that from the garave visit thread. Would be really interesting to know who said that and did he have some sort of agenda... the fact that both (& Peugeot) chose diesel, should speak for itself.

[AGD]

Originally Posted by deggis

I read that from the garave visit thread. Would be really interesting to know who said that and did he have some sort of agenda... the fact that both (& Peugeot) chose diesel, should speak for itself.

Yeah, it would be interesting to know the circumstances of that statement. Perhaps Audi thought that there would not be a serious petrol contender during the expected lifespan of the R18 (or at least of the engine) and so they decided to do what marketing wanted (diesel) since they could win with whatever they chose to do and all they would have to beat is Peugeot and they have the same disadvantage. Also, maybe they figure that they will never be at a rules disadvantage as long as they choose what Peugeot chooses. In other words, if a serious petrol team did come in, maybe the rules would change again to balance or favor the diesels if that is what Peugeot is running.

As far as the ALMS is concerned, isn't Porsche a supporter of the ALMS' new media platform? It is interesting that Porsche sort of announced this program through YouTube. Anyway, that does not mean anything in regard to whether the Porsche LMP1 will compete in the ALMS, but the media platform as such may not prohibit them from doing so if they are supporters of it. I would say it is unlikely that there will be a Porsche factory team in the ALMS full-time, but who knows. Maybe Neiman or someone can talk Porsche into providing a customer car or something.

[rich07]

This is fantastic news!!!!

I was looking at an article about daniel ricciardo's call up to HRT at Silverstone on AutoSport and then I saw those words-Porsche return to LMP1 and a shiver went up my spine. My morning is already quite good and it just got a whole lot better.

If Audi stays then I think Joest will stay with Audi but then who will run the Porsche? Penske perhaps, maybe Porsche will it out of their Motorsport division?

Whats interesting is to see who will drive. Sascha Massen would be a shoe in as would probably be Luhr, maybe some drivers from the GT ranks possibly?

[Dead-Eye]

Is Maassen still a Porsche works driver? He's not listed at http://www.porsche.com/germany/sport...t/workdrivers/

Out of those, I think only Bernhard and Dumas have recent LMP experience.

[AGD]

Originally Posted by Dead-Eye

Is Maassen still a Porsche works driver?

No, I don't think so. Then again, I don't think it will be a problem for them to call him and Luhr back up if that is who they want. There is no shortage of qualified drivers out there and also Porsche probably wants to keep some top drivers in the GTEs. It will be interesting to see where Pat Long goes though.

As for Timo and Romain, will Audi keep them within the program if they are expecting to stay in 2014? It might not be wise to have them in on Audi's development and testing programs. Porsche might learn some family secrets that way, although maybe they can be put on gag orders. Maybe the two unlikely sisters will welcome their partnership and will share data openly. Who knows. They are great drivers who will be hard to replace at Audi if Porsche takes them back.

[rich07]

My mistake, thought Massen was still a works driver, but as said it wouldnt be hard to get him back.

[ujoint]

It will look like nothing you have seen to date.

[arakis]

I hope they give Jorg Bergmaister a drive in this, he has realy deserved it, although I doupt it.

[Dead-Eye]

Originally Posted by arakis

I hope they give Jorg Bergmaister a drive in this, he has realy deserved it, although I doupt it.

Deserved maybe, but a good GT driver doesn't necessarily make a good prototype driver. I'm sure they'll give everybody a go in testing and then decide who goes where.

[arakis]

they didn't give him a ride last time in the Spyder, I think it was because of the height.
And Lattly I find that GTE drivers are better then the prototype drivers, Dumas, Bernard, Rockenfeler, were all top GTE drivers for years before they drove Spyders and Audis. many have said that it takes a lot more skill to drive a GTE car on hte edge then a prototype, doubly so in a porsche I would say

[WMUCarGuy]

Originally Posted by arakis

I hope they give Jorg Bergmaister a drive in this, he has realy deserved it, although I doupt it.

The only reason he never drove the RS Spyder was that he was too tall and didn't fit in the car.

[porman]

Originally Posted by arakis

you mean like porshce never did in F1

I don't mean to turn this into a Porsche/Ferrari debate but what exactly are you saying Arakis?

If you are saying that Porsche has not come back since they were funded to build a multiple championship engine for the TAG/McLaren project then you are right to a certain extent.

Porsche is very shrewd and realized back in the early sixties when they did build a car themselves that it made no sense to continue to spend that amount of money when sports cars are their bread and butter. Ferrari can have F1.

Don't forget all those years that Ferrari were uncompetitive in the supposed pinnacle of motor sports. If I recall correctly, they had one hell of a draught.

On a lighter note. I really hope to see Toyota back in LMP1. The more competition the better.

[arakis]

Originally Posted by porman

I don't mean to turn this into a Porsche/Ferrari debate but what exactly are you saying Arakis?

If you are saying that Porsche has not come back since they were funded to build a multiple championship engine for the TAG/McLaren project then you are right to a certain extent.

Porsche is very shrewd and realized back in the early sixties when they did build a car themselves that it made no sense to continue to spend that amount of money when sports cars are their bread and butter. Ferrari can have F1.

Don't forget all those years that Ferrari were uncompetitive in the supposed pinnacle of motor sports. If I recall correctly, they had one hell of a draught.

On a lighter note. I really hope to see Toyota back in LMP1. The more competition the better.

so then dont make it a porsche vs Ferrari there is a thread for that, and I am sorry but I belive that the name of that car was McLaren not Posche, sorry engine only dont really cut it.

and same as Porsche, Ferrari discovered that F1 was their bread and butter so they chose to leave Le Mans, as for droughts, I guess the 18 yeas porsche has stayed out of LM, is a dry spell.

P.S. mods feel free to move these P vs F arguments to the designated thread if they get out of hand. I was only responding to a jab by a porshce fan boy

Originally Posted by porsche91722

I wonder if Ferrari will now have the balls to come back to P1.
.

BTW it was never about hte balls only about the money, and neither Porsche nor Ferrari have the cash to support both F1 and sportscars. so they chose theyr respective strong suits and went separite ways. Respect it, dont mock it.

[911targa]

Originally Posted by Sodemo

Great news, I love Porsche, they belong in sportscars doing LMP type stuff. Can they run with Rothmans or Martini sponsors please?

"Then in 1999 Rothmans was acquired by British American Tobacco."(wikipedia),very sorry for that.

But hopefully we can expect Gulf-Porsche!As recent as 5 years ago Gulf sponsored LM24 GT2 Porsche custom team Ice Pol Racing Team and in 2008 with GT3 Porsche regular team Kelly Moss Racing,considering their success with LM24 and Daytona24 917s and the terrible performance of AMR-One they may rejoin Porsche in the future.

[911targa]

Originally Posted by gustavobamba

Well, let´s begin speculation:

1 - Wich Engine ???
2 - Coupe or open ???
3 - Driver´s ????
4 - Team´s ???
5 - How much Horsepower ???
6 - Hibrid ????

I Love Speculation

1.Flat-6 most likely

2.Coupe I believe

3.
R.Dumas(for sure)
T.Bernhard(for sure)
M.Lieb(long-lasting desire,best RS Spyder test driver)
L.Luhr(this year won Ring'24 and do LM24 all with Porsche,former factory driver of RS Spyder,last year with custom RS Spyder)
S.Maassen(former RS Spyder factory driver)
J.Bergmeister(remember how fast he was at Daytona24 this year)
E.Collard(911 GT1&RS Spyder factory driver,if Pesca not care)

Expect drivers from custom team join if their regular team comes,like K.Graf and P.Long.

4.
US:
Penske Racing
Muscle Milk team CytoSport
Flying Lizard Motorsport
Action Express Racing

Europe:
Team Essex
Van Merksteijn Motorsport
Joest Racing
IMSA Performance Matmut(they talked about it in early 2010,but for sure will remain GTE no matter with or without P1 project,never forget Matmut is a big one in P1)

Asia:
Navi team Goh

And most likely Porsche will return with factory team,last year at Zhuhai the Hybrid R was ran under "Porsche Motorsport" without any support from custom team.

5&6.not my dish

[arakis]

1.I dont think a flat six is good under curent aero regulations, I think they'll go with V8, probably a supped up version off the spyder, although who knows what new aero and engine regs bring to the table.

2.Coupe

3. many to chose from.

4. Porsche Motorsport A.G. for Le Mans, and WEC. ALMS/LMS, might not enter, since it will probably be a manufacturer only car like Audi and Peugeut

[911targa]

Teams wont run proto and will remain GTE with Porsche 911 RSR series after 2013

US:
Team Falken Tire(confirm no interest in prototype)
Paul Miller Racing(Porsche dealer team,without proto interest or experience)

Europe:
Proton Competition(dozens of gentlemen drivers,will run one prototype at most if no other team does)
IMSA Performance Matmut(Porsche dealer team)
ProSpeed Competition(Porsche dealer team)
Manthey Racing(used to be a regular in LM24 and Spa24,can pick those project back together with VLN and Ring'24 if there's no enough number of 911 teams)

[Porsche917K]

I think Patrick Long is a shoe in as he provides a great open wheel, and prototype background as well as being an American driver giving it some relevance to a HUGE part of their target market. Not to mention the guy knows how to handle himself in front of a camera.

[Porsche917K]

Also don't know if it was mentioned before, but 3 years is a long time and I don't see them slowing their GT program as it makes them so much money. So I would bet we see the Porsche factory driver stable increase in size, and maybe with some young blood.

[911targa]

Originally Posted by Porsche917K

I think Patrick Long is a shoe in as he provides a great open wheel, and prototype background as well as being an American driver giving it some relevance to a HUGE part of their target market. Not to mention the guy knows how to handle himself in front of a camera.

Yes,but his lap time with flat-6 powered Daytona proto was a bit slow compared with Joerg,sometimes he's also a tiny bit slow in lizard 911s compared with Joerg and Lieb.

For sure if Lizards does proto project he will be a driver,but I'm afraid Penske and other US teams always find drivers themselves and Lizard will still have Pat with Berg in #45 Lizard 911.

[FordCosworthPanoz]

If Porsche were to run 3 cars at Le Mans then this would be my ideal lineup. Just some suggestions including current factory/non factory drivers as well as some new hires of drivers that should be on the market. Id put Bergmeister on the list but of course there were fitting issues with the Spyder.

Car 1:

Timo Bernhard
Romain Dumas
David Brabham

Car 2:

Marc Leib
Lucas Luhr
Klaus Graf

Car 3:

Patrick Long
Joao Barbosa
Jeroen Bleekemolen