The cream always rises...Go Murph, Go Skaifey !

[Wizzby]

Is that your answer for everything? Cripple the Holdens so the Fords can keep up?

[HRT #1]

Originally posted by Grimace
What hope???the "P" word thats what!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Grimace Is that your best answer you have to give to try shoot down the Holdens just so your precious ford gets to win.??

[Mattracer]

Originally posted by Dave HRT Moy


It's only the ill informed and chronically thick that are claiming any sort of parity issue.....

And they're mainly upset and angry Ford fans....

Or keen, long-time spectators who can still remember the good 'ol ATCC who have a conscience about there being three Holden variants racing against Ford's two (OK make that one and the ugly half-sister with one four teeth and a limp...)

[GTRMagic]

Is it 3 variants or 4? Simon Wills' car started life as a GMS 1999 Bathurst winning VT, so it has been thru the VT, VX then VY panel changes.

So its:
- VT that became a VX with a VX engine (e.g. Dynamik #44)
- VX with a VX engine (e.g. LRT, Team Brock)
- VY with a VX engine (e.g. Murf)
- VY with an Aurora engine (e.g. PMM, Dynamik #45)

Yes the VT to VX conversion was cosmetic, but hints at the age of the vehicle

[Dave HRT Moy]

Originally posted by GTRMagic
Is it 3 variants or 4? Simon Wills' car started life as a GMS 1999 Bathurst winning VT, so it has been thru the VT, VX then VY panel changes.

So its:
- VT that became a VX with a VX engine (e.g. Dynamik #44)
- VX with a VX engine (e.g. LRT, Team Brock)
- VY with a VX engine (e.g. Murf)
- VY with an Aurora engine (e.g. PMM, Dynamik #45)

Yes the VT to VX conversion was cosmetic, but hints at the age of the vehicle

Quite a pedigree......All Bathurst winners VT, VX and VY(and soon to be all touring champ winners)!

In the same time, Ford have gone from the never Bathurst winning (or almost anything else for that matter) AU to the as yet non Bathurst (or touring car championship)winning BA....

[Nevermind]

Sounds like Dave here is confident enough to put one of his lazy 100's on a Murphy Championship.

Love your optimism Dave.

[bartman71]

Originally posted by Dave HRT Moy
I don't know. Murphy is right on Ambrose' tail with almost zero testing, after spending the first half of the season in an old VX and then only getting the Toddler's crashed and repaired hand-me-down VY, running the good old 18 degree Chev.

What hope would Ford and Ambrose have had if he was running a new Aurora spec VY from day one?

you have just said the fords don't have parity with this comment.
i thought i would never see the day you say the holden has an unfair advantage

[Conrod Kieron]

Originally posted by bartman71
you have just said the fords don't have parity with this comment.
i thought i would never see the day you say the holden has an unfair advantage

Its worth pointing out that Murfs VY would have been well and truly tested by HRT before been given to KRT so it was hardly a new car out of the box at OP.

What Dave should be worried about is Murf has polished the hand me down to be consistantly quicker than HRT's full spec VY AND HRT's full chassis spec VY with 18 degree!

[Dave HRT Moy]

Originally posted by Conrod Kieron
Its worth pointing out that Murfs VY would have been well and truly tested by HRT before been given to KRT so it was hardly a new car out of the box at OP.

What Dave should be worried about is Murf has polished the hand me down to be consistantly quicker than HRT's full spec VY AND HRT's full chassis spec VY with 18 degree!

I think that they're all pretty close now.

Witness Skaife's lap times in NZ and only a slip up (literally) near the end of race two prevented him from winning two from three.

I'll put my money on Skaife for poll at the creek and possible Murph 2nd or 3rd.

It's fair to say that if Ambrose finds himself near the bottom of the top ten, it will be an even longer weekend for him....

[Onlooker]

Well everyones just lucky that Team Brock have been held back this year because for a team to change cars, staff, relocate interstate and increase to a 2 car operation then run as a Level 2 outfit for most of the year they have done a sterling job,with there #2 driver leading the championship for the opening 7 rounds, and the lead car in the top 5, Ford should have really not let the engineering brain power of PWR slip out of there hands,just think what they could have done with a BA

[GTRMagic]

And 2 drivers in the top 11.... amazing stuff...

The 4 ex-PWR AU's Mark Howard is now sitting on must be worth a mint

[Dave HRT Moy]

Originally posted by Onlooker
Well everyones just lucky that Team Brock have been held back this year because for a team to change cars, staff, relocate interstate and increase to a 2 car operation then run as a Level 2 outfit for most of the year they have done a sterling job,with there #2 driver leading the championship for the opening 7 rounds, and the lead car in the top 5, Ford should have really not let the engineering brain power of PWR slip out of there hands,just think what they could have done with a BA

Not to mention the almost total lack of testing.

Well said onlooker....

[GTRMagic]

Those polarizers PB contributed are amazing things arent they, someone should patent them

[Dave HRT Moy]

Originally posted by GTRMagic
Those polarizers PB contributed are amazing things arent they, someone should patent them

Awwww, geez GTR, did you have to bring that up again? ? ?

[GTRMagic]

Sorry, its a cheap and easy shot

The scenario is kinda like the TKR one though, take existing cars with a crew who had used them previously in other seasons, and run them as well as they can from guesswork and driver input until they are allowed to test.

There is still life in the VX chassis, Bright's speed late on Sunday in NZ showed that. Funny though that the team was mentioned as wanting to run a VY for the first time at Eastern Creek. Maybe the lead driver will debut it instead of Bright?

[Joe5619]

Originally posted by Onlooker
Well everyones just lucky that Team Brock have been held back this year because for a team to change cars, staff, relocate interstate and increase to a 2 car operation then run as a Level 2 outfit for most of the year they have done a sterling job,with there #2 driver leading the championship for the opening 7 rounds, and the lead car in the top 5, Ford should have really not let the engineering brain power of PWR slip out of there hands,just think what they could have done with a BA

Yeah, beasue they where kick arse in an AU ford!!!! Maybe you should give more credit to the cars origin!!!!

[Dave HRT Moy]

I agree GTR, but I think it shows how fundamentaly good the VX (and VT) chasis were and are.

But I think it's time has just about come at the pointy end of the field. Development in terms of shocks and supplier input has well and truly shifted to the VY. So there's isn't much "new stuff" coming through (front end wise at least) that will apply to the older model.

And you'd have to call money spent on anything non essential on a VX as questionable.

I think (especially HRT and K Mart) the VY runners have just about got their heads around the new front suspension.

Not bad considering that most have been running it for less than 10 months and Ford have had it for 10 years.....

[GTRMagic]

Yes but the Ford boys spend 4 years with the AU, and very few of them actually got a handle on that particular race car. Moving forward into the BA with so little knowledge on how to make an AU work was always going to end in tears.

While SHRT/KKRT had run the VT/VX package in its entirity for 5 years before moving to VY, with the similar VY shell and packaging a proven product for all areas bar the front end.

So Ford made a quantum leap, taking a gamble, while Holden refined an existing successful package.

Not that there was any other choice, but it does show who the smartybums are out there.

The PMM & Dynamik cars are very strong on occassion, and when the consistency comes right, should be as strong as a factory car

[Conrod Kieron]

Originally posted by GTRMagic
Yes but the Ford boys spend 4 years with the AU, and very few of them actually got a handle on that particular race car. Moving forward into the BA with so little knowledge on how to make an AU work was always going to end in tears.

Couple this with the fact that the BA also received new blueprint front end location points means the Ford boys had a complete suspension change.

I wonder how well Murf will go when he receives a ground up VY like Skaifes?

TB mentioned running a VY at EC, are they building it themselves?

[GTRMagic]

I thought Team Brock may have just trying to convert the #50 car...

[champcarman]

I think it is most likely that Team Brock will convert the #50 car as it was the last VX built by Dencar. Interestingly the current Murphy car is one of the oldest chassis in the stable. Dennis from Dencar was very proud of the fact that he built the first five cars over the line in Race 3 last weekend. The effect that the lack of testing had on TKR and TB has been evident when you see their pace in recent Rounds as both Teams have had their allocated 2 test days since the ban was lifted after Oran Park.If a level playing field had existed all year one wonders what the Pointscore would lok like now?

[Grimace]

Originally posted by HRT #1
Grimace Is that your best answer you have to give to try shoot down the Holdens just so your precious ford gets to win.??

Its the correct way- the way the formula operates!

[Grimace]

Originally posted by Peregrine
I thought that the Blueprint parity formula was to look at the top few Ford's vs top few Holdens lap times over 3 or four rounds and then make adjustments where necessary ??

If this is the case then it is very surprising that nothing has happened to level the playing field before now considering that Ambrose has been the only consistently competitive Ford all year closely followed by a pack of Symbol Crummydores......

The new Blueprint formula was never equal, it was just that SBR got an immediate handle on the BA and while Marcos was winning the Symbol biased series administrators would not give the BA the parity adjustment it needed. So it is only now increasingly obvious the Ford is disadvantaged as SBR's development curve is levelling off and the VX's are walking all over them.

Just my 2 cents worth....

Truthfully and concisley explained

[Grimace]

Originally posted by bartman71
you have just said the fords don't have parity with this comment.
i thought i would never see the day you say the holden has an unfair advantage

Bartman 71 - ABSOLUTLEY PERFECT ANSWER
Dave HRT walked right into it and ya gotim!!

A Parity adjustment is absolutely needed quickly despite what Wizzby, DHRT, etc etc Holden faithfull say,

they know the Falcons are struggling at this end of the

season..........

there are no "sub 7 second Bathurst capable"

FALCONS NOW...they LACK CAR SPEED COMPARED TO THE

LEADING COMMODORES...

You all know it - just wont admit it!!!!!!!!!!!!

[AlbertM]

Parity should not be an issue. Both makes are the same, have the same potential. However after years of Holden preaching Fords HP advantage. Amazingly the ol' 18degree is now good enough.

Hey Dave, what are you doing supporting KRT?