[Team] Red Bull: Unbullievable

[Richard C]

Originally Posted by EastonNeston

how about Max and Yuki at Aston Martin in 2026. Yuki is Honda's current F1 choice and AM will be using Honda Engines in 2026

People have speculated about Yuki going to AM given the Honda connection. But it seems that the only way this can happen is for Lance to step aside (I assume AM will always want a top name like Max, Alonso, etc. in the other car) and there seems to be no evidence this will happen anytime soon. Especially given Stroll Sr. has been working to build his F1 empire, why yank his son out just now that the ball is really rolling with getting Newey. Not that I agree that Lance should stay. I think Lance can be a decent driver, but in any other team he would have been given the boot a long time ago. But currently Lance is the pinnacle of pay drivers.

Richard

[TrapezeArtist]

Originally Posted by chillibowl

if DR is out which presumably means he will not be an option for next season, does the knock on effect mean RBR are locking themselves in with Perez for next season?

I was thinking along similar lines. If Dan and Checo are out the door by the end of the year (which would make sense to me), Red Bull are left with a superstar, a journeyman and a possible young hotshot to fill the four seats. That leaves an interesting vacancy.

[chunterer]

Originally Posted by TrapezeArtist

I was thinking along similar lines. If Dan and Checo are out the door by the end of the year (which would make sense to me), Red Bull are left with a superstar, a journeyman and a possible young hotshot to fill the four seats. That leaves an interesting vacancy.

Well Horner had already naned Hadjar and Lindblad from their own books.

I'm not convinced Hadjar is anything to write home about. He's seems to play the 'victim' a lot over the radio in F2 when he fails. Seems to have suspect racecraft too. In the ever more frequent races where he has qualified down the field he's hardly come through to rescue decent finishes. Hardly gobsmackimg ace in the making material.

Don't know huge amount about Lindblad, admittedly but seems pretty comsistent in F3?

Anyway it doesn't matter they'll sign George Russell! Lol.

[GTRMagic]

[Adam43]

Originally Posted by chunterer

He's seems to play the 'victim' a lot over the radio in F2 when he fails. Seems to have suspect racecraft too.

Does he swear in press conferences?
If he does he seems a good fit.

[EastonNeston]

We can do without another driver with the negative "Luggage" that comes with the Verstappen family!

[crmalcolm]

Max needs to find a new 'trademark'.

Guenther already holds the swearing crown and Kimi hold the short, abrupt answers title!!!

[chillibowl]

Originally Posted by GTRMagic

kinda like they drew him with the cartoon stink lines!

[greentrumpet]

Is the Honey Badger back?
https://www.planetf1.com/features/si...24-conclusions

[chunterer]

Originally Posted by Adam43

Does he swear in press conferences?
If he does he seems a good fit.

Dunno? he's just a bit rubbish!

[chunterer]

Lawson has a huge oppo now.

He showed he's got the basics nailed last year.

Now he can really stake a claim to be a major player in Red Bulls future plans.

I think he'll do just that.

Bottom line is that he is quick and level headed.

Plus it'll be great to have a Kiwi f/t again.

Since Bruce, Denny and Amon New Zealand have really only had Thackwell and Dixon come close to an F1 career.

[E.B]

Originally Posted by chunterer

Lawson has a huge oppo now.

He showed he's got the basics nailed last year.

Now he can really stake a claim to be a major player in Red Bulls future plans.

I think he'll do just that.

Bottom line is that he is quick and level headed.

Plus it'll be great to have a Kiwi f/t again.

Since Bruce, Denny and Amon New Zealand have really only had Thackwell and Dixon come close to an F1 career.

**Brendon Hartley puts hand up**
Oh, as does Howden Ganley
Collectively 60 GP starts between them.

As an aside did Dixon ever get closer than a test or two with Williams ?

[Richard C]

Originally Posted by greentrumpet

Is the Honey Badger back?
https://www.planetf1.com/features/si...24-conclusions

I think I saw a different version of that same theory yesterday. If I remember correctly it was some relatively unknown F1 pundit peddling the idea. I tend to have a rough time believing the theories that Daniel was pushed out of his seat as sort of a preparation for him to replace Perez.

What I can believe... is that Perez may have indicated internally that he does plan to retire. Maybe even before end of the season. With speculation that this might be announced on or after the Mexican GP. So Red Bull has the quandary of who to promote. They don't believe it will be Daniel so it will be either Liam or Yuki. They are unsure about Yuki, but need more evidence for Liam. So they push Daniel out, put in Liam to measure him against Yuki. If Liam does well, then Liam gets it. If Yuki outpaces him... I don't know if they really will consider Yuki. I suspect they are just wanting to confirm that Liam is the right answer. Then if Liam goes to RB, who to pair with Yuki at VCARB? Especially if it happens before end of 2024 (probably unlikely). They could put Daniel back in with Yuki, but but I think they will pick someone else who is new (no idea who). Part of me wants to see Yuki just wipe the floor with Liam. Mostly because it just probably would just screw Red Bull's plans. But in reality, I expect Liam to do just fine and potentially better than Yuki.

If all of this was some weird path to replace Sergio with Daniel, then they would just wait, leave both Daniel and Yuki at VCARB. Then once Sergio was out, put Daniel in and Liam and Yuki in at VCARB. No need for some crazy 3D chess game in which us mere mortals can't understand the advanced gameplay required to make it happen.

I think all of these crazy theories to keep Daniel in F1 are just fans of his cooking up weird scenarios that fit with an ever negative reality that Daniel is experiencing. It's interesting that it's not just about keeping him in F1, but that he is going to land in a top team (if RB is still a top team! )

However... as I have said before, Red Bull makes really weird driver decisions. So given the Horner/Marko split, you could see Marko doing what he is doing now (talking about why Daniel is not the right person for Red Bull) and Horner just off doing his own thing. Including potentially putting Daniel in the Red Bull for whatever crazy reasons he comes up with.

Richard

[bathurst77]

So DR has waved good bye (How many fingers are held up in that pic?)
I really like the guy and rate him, but it was clear that his time was up. He did great things, but wasnt likely to do more than a hopeful "Bradbury" podium or win. It was time to give a new talent a chance.

He probably cant see it himself yet, but i think itwill be good for him. It must have been mentally and physically murder, the position he was in under the whole racing worlds spotlight.

It feels so good when you finally stop banging your head against a brack wall.
He can take time and reflect, live, then make a decision in time..HE isnt short a buck, and any non F1 team would jump through hoops to get him as a guest or full time.

Drive for fun!
He loves ballsy card like Nascar and AUssie V8 supercars, and his media PR personality would be well suited. Not to mention Red Bull having huge presence in V8s.
Might be a bettter change for him than indy (Whiich is kind of Formula one but U.S style) do something different.

OR he could start his own team somewhere.. Or do something completely different
(given hhow most of his team change choices went, Im not sure managing a driver is his forte!), or stick to farming, start a band, become a Tv personality (this is almost a given)
or..... take up ballet!
(But Im not ready for Dan in pink a tutu tho!)

Thanks Dan, you really flew the flag and made Aussies proud!
You did well, son, but its time to put the cue back in the rack

[bathurst77]

Putting Lawson in now is clever.

It settles the whole team, gets rid of all that will they/wont they/should they static. Lets the whole team chuck a big send off party this week and get back to work wiith new focus and unity next.

It gives the media positive news and interest on Lawson

And most importantly it bloods Lawson in race weekends, when there is nothing to lose now, but come round 1 2025, he will know his chops. And get the team used to how he operates and working with him in real races. They can hit the new season running from round 1.

Also gives Dan a few months to try and arrange something for 2025 if he wants.. If not in f1, then somewhere.

Excellent timing

[bathurst77]

Now we can all get back to the "WHat about Checo" argument.

I think he is there because Max wants a "2nd driver" a number 2 (ahem, so to speak), not a Lewix/Lando/Alonso etc who might make his life harder.

But like Dan, Checo doesnt have "All time superstar" written about him. I would liek to see someone else in that seat, he isnt setting the world on fire.
Like Dan, there is always "a reason why" but.....

Issue being that RB have 4 cars, one GREAT one very good, one "keeping the sponsors happy" and one unknown. They need someone better than Yuki or Checo now. But who would Max allow?

[bathurst77]

Im still bemused by Dan taking fastest lap last week.

If he and that car have had that potential, why did it take until the last lap of his last race to come out?

WHere has THAT Dan and THAT car been up to now?

[HDTVKSS]

I do wonder if they have an eye on Franco Colapinto if Checo goes. Sure, the last one they stole from Williams didn’t work out but he may be a better option than what current exists in the lower driver pool. He’s been marked against Albon and will have half a seasons worth of racing under his belt.

[Richard C]

Originally Posted by bathurst77

Im still bemused by Dan taking fastest lap last week.

If he and that car have had that potential, why did it take until the last lap of his last race to come out?

WHere has THAT Dan and THAT car been up to now?

I looked at the Singapore FIA documents. Lando who was on a one stop strategy set his fastest lap of 1:34.925 on lap 48 on hard tires that were 18 laps old. Not terribly old, but not ideal with respect to optimal tire and he still had fuel to burn. Outside of Daniel's lap, Lando was about 4/10th up on the next closest fastest time (Charles). So I would say Lando's lap was pretty good given his tire and level of fuel at that time.

Daniel switched to softs on his second stop on lap 46 and then again for another set of softs on lap 58. Daniel's fastest lap was 1:34.486 on lap 60. This was on fresh softs and as low as fuel weight as you can get during a race (last lap). This put him a bit better than 4/10ths up on Lando. It would be curious to know what Daniel's race pace was after his second stop (his first set of slicks) given they put him on slicks twice (can't remember what he started on and what he ran on in is second/long stint).

Note that Daniels Q1 time was 1:31.085 (Lando's Q1 was 1:30.002) and Lando's pole was 1:29.525. Slowest Q1 time was 1:32.054 from Zhou. All roughly 2-5 seconds faster than Daniel's fastest race lap.

While unfair to call out Q times vs. race fastest laps, you can see the cars have more speed in them than is shown in that race fastest lap. And as I call out Daniel had all of the advantages given fresh softs and low fuel. In short, taking nothing from Daniel, his fastest race lap was nothing spectacular. IMHO I expect many cars on the grid if they had pitted for softs at the same time as Daniel did, could have easily posted much faster times.

Richard

[Henry]

Originally Posted by Richard C

While unfair to call out Q times vs. race fastest laps, you can see the cars have more speed in them than is shown in that race fastest lap. And as I call out Daniel had all of the advantages given fresh softs and low fuel. In short, taking nothing from Daniel, his fastest race lap was nothing spectacular. IMHO I expect many cars on the grid if they had pitted for softs at the same time as Daniel did, could have easily posted much faster times.

Richard

Seconded. Anybody who'd harvested some battery power and pitted with a couple of laps to go for soft rubber was in for the FTD... if Lando had an extra ten seconds' lead, it wasn't beyond belief that he'd have done it, and it would've been a good sight quicker than Dan's ultimate lap.

DR was already nowhere, with nothing really to lose, and at least a small bit of bragging rights to gain on his way out the door.

[P38 in workshop]

^^ Sums it up well.^^

[Aysedasi]

Originally Posted by Henry

DR was already nowhere, with nothing really to lose, and at least a small bit of bragging rights to gain on his way out the door.

You actually think that's why it happened?

[Plantagenet]

Originally Posted by Richard C

Daniel switched to softs on his second stop on lap 46 and then again for another set of softs on lap 58. Daniel's fastest lap was 1:34.486 on lap 60. This was on fresh softs and as low as fuel weight as you can get during a race (last lap). This put him a bit better than 4/10ths up on Lando.

I agree with Richard. He was the only driver to put on new softs at that stage of the race with that level of fuel, so we really can't use it to compare to to other runners on used tyres. His quali position showed his true pace when those factors were equalled out.

Seems a genuine, nice gut but IMHO, he was lucky to get that drive after his 2 seasons at Maclaren and was lucky to keep it after Lawson's stand-in last year.

[chunterer]

Originally Posted by E.B

**Brendon Hartley puts hand up**
Oh, as does Howden Ganley
Collectively 60 GP starts between them.

As an aside did Dixon ever get closer than a test or two with Williams ?

Ganley was good yeah, but as good a sportscar pedaller as he's been I wouldn't put Hartley near the bracket of drivers I quoted, including Mike and Scott!

Just naming drivers wasn't the point of my post though! A full time top level Kiwi is long overdue.

[E.B]

Originally Posted by chunterer

Ganley was good yeah, but as good a sportscar pedaller as he's been I wouldn't put Hartley near the bracket of drivers I quoted, including Mike and Scott!

Just naming drivers wasn't the point of my post though! A full time top level Kiwi is long overdue.

Indeed, Hartley wasnt F1 grade, totally agree. Hopefully Lawson is the one to remind F1 fans about NZ in F1 terms.