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Yesterday, 21:41 (Ref:4232101) | #126 | |||
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One point though - the McLaren pit wall's big mistake, based on what radio we heard, was believing that Lando had been in front at the apex, which he wasn't. I suspect if they'd got that right, then they may have recommended another course of action (ie. give back the place) to their driver. |
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“We’re far from having too much horsepower…[m]y definition of too much horsepower is when all four wheels are spinning in every gear.” ― Mark Donohue |
Yesterday, 22:38 (Ref:4232104) | #127 | ||
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Seriously from reading your posts, I feel there is a theme that somehow the defending driver is expected to give up something to the overtaking driver and that seems to be unfair. I don't think anyone is saying the defending driver should "aid" in allowing a pass. Or if that at some specific point at the apex it's a "done deal" and the defending driver has to surrender. I don't think that is the focus of the discussion. I think what most are saying is that there are specific responsibilities for BOTH parties. And that Max is exploiting an issue in which he has reduced his responsibility in a specific way that most feel previously existed. And that the current Steward guidelines are at the root of the problem. That a specific scenario exists that creates what seems contrary to what most consider fair racing in a corner. More specifically to the passing attempt in question. We might say Lando was coming in too hot, or maybe he wasn't. Short of looking at data, we may not know. But one thing we do know for sure, he couldn't turn left as Max was always there... all the way until after they had left the circuit. And that type of defense just doesn't seem right to most observers. Speaking of looking at the data... I read an article this morning that I think was on PlanetF1.com (can't find it now) that did show throttle and braking data (which is only part of the picture). But they had an argument that flipped the story around. That saying Lando was the defending driver as he was already ahead as they entered the corner. This put Max as an overtaking driver trying to pass on the inside. I can't remember the conclusion (I don't think it was kind to Max), but it was an interesting perspective. (Edit: found it... https://www.planetf1.com/features/ve...y-fia-decision ) I am sort of done with this topic at this point. I "do" hope that this is just not one weekend of aggravation and that either the new driver conduct rules they are looking to implement in 2025 cover the scenario we have been talking about, or if not, they consider opening up that draft and consider additional revisions. I also think it would be helpful if they had a set of permanent stewards. I think when you have an important job and it has a rotation of people doing it, you inherently both lose some level of consistency (even if you have well documented guidelines) as well as uniformity of experience and feedback as to what works and what doesn't work. Richard |
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To paraphrase Mark Twain... "I'm sorry I wrote such a long post; I didn't have time to write a short one." |
Today, 05:07 (Ref:4232118) | #128 | |||
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There is no reason to go into that much detail on who was ahead of who. In fact, to do so is indicative of straining a gnat yet ignoring the most obvious and clear issues around the whole situation. For me Verstappen was definitely the defending driver and by going so deep he went off the track and took the other competitor with him negates any argument about overtaking. You can only overtake on the track, not off it so taking competitor of the racing surface it is not an overtake. He took the other competitor off the circuit with himself, just as he earned two penalty points last year for taking Leclerc off the circuit. The fact that the other competitor was able to rejoin ahead of him simply means that Norris was able to rescue his situation more quickly than Max. And if Norris was penalized for his part Max should certainly ben penalized. If Max made a driving error, it impacted Lando's race. You can't take a competitor off the track. If the car was at fault and had a problem, it shouldn't have continued in the race. If it was that dangerous it should have been retired. |
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