MG David,Rich and Delta trip to NZ 2024.

[Peter Mallett]

Excellent story Iain. Good luck MG Dave.

[Peter Mallett]

Just about to dash off to The Pom, but Iain sent this pic yesterday. It's the signing on office at Teretonga. Very old school.

[andy97]

Originally Posted by GORDON STREETER

According to Automotive News China, the shady side of the People's Republic is set to sell $45 billion worth of counterfeit auto parts this year. Those include high-volume pieces like spark plugs, brake pads and steering components as well as oil seals and airbags. All told, the report says that China is responsible for a hefty 83 percent of the world's counterfeit parts, leading the top three producers by a wide margin. The report goes on to state that Taiwan and Thailand are responsible for five percent of the pie each, while Japan and Malaysia weigh in with two percent each of the counterfeit market.

In many cases, authorities are ill-equipped to handle the sheer volume of rip-off artists. In one instance, a facility that produces knock-off oil seals gets shut down once a year only to re-open at full capacity. That plant had the capacity to produce seven million fake oil seals per year in 2008. Now that number is up to 10 million.

In the case of the seals, the manufacturer uses low-grade rubber and metal to cut costs, and as a result, the fake pieces carry a price tag that's less than half of the genuine article. They're also almost guaranteed to fail.

Meanwhile, legitimate Chinese companies are beginning to fit their boxes with radio frequency ID tags to distinguish their products from the fakes.

A few years ago when I was still working for Babcock, we were asked to tender for a contract to repair some Iraqi navy patrol boats. They had been paid for by US overseas aid and built in Malaysia iirc but had proven to be very unreliable.
The main problem appeared to be with the MAN diesels; now MAN have a very good reputation so this was strange to say the least. To cut a long story short, it turned out that the “MAN diesels” were cheap Chinese copies and MAN had never had anything to do with them.
Even the US Govt gets caught out by fakes it appears.

[grantp]

Originally Posted by andy97

The main problem appeared to be with the MAN diesels; now MAN have a very good reputation so this was strange to say the least. To cut a long story short, it turned out that the “MAN diesels” were cheap Chinese copies and MAN had never had anything to do with them.
Even the US Govt gets caught out by fakes it appears.

On a lesser scale, a few years ago I bought a new lawn mower and the best deal around for what I wanted was a Sanli. A Chinese product of course.

Well known for some time in Aus, as I understand things, but not so common here - at least not under their own name.

I think they manufacture for a number of other lawn mower brands and and also produce versions of the Honda engines used in mowers sold as Honda. They use whet appears to be the same engine in their own units.

It mostly alright. I ha some problems with starting in the early months but a new spark plug seemed to fix that. It's always been dodgy re-starting when warm. Still is but somewhat better these days. I think it a carb problem but no idea what will finally fix it.

However, it really does not present as being of a quality one might expect with a different brand name attached.

It just gives the impression that it has the potential to be a very good product and does a decent job but one or two of the components may be a bit sub-par without be catastrophically bad. That's OK for a mower. Not so good for a component of a more expensive product.

[Mike Harte]

Originally Posted by grantp

It just gives the impression that it has the potential to be a very good product and does a decent job but one or two of the components may be a bit sub-par without be catastrophically bad. That's OK for a mower. Not so good for a component of a more expensive product.

Isn't that somewhat similar to what happened post-war with items from Japan. That is until they found ways to start producing electronics, cameras and cars, etc. far better than anyone else could do, and also far cheaper.

[grantp]

Originally Posted by Mike Harte

Isn't that somewhat similar to what happened post-war with items from Japan. That is until they found ways to start producing electronics, cameras and cars, etc. far better than anyone else could do, and also far cheaper.

That's true Mike but the Japanese seem to have a different approach to quality matters than can be found in other places.

Plus they listened to some of the manufacturing gurus from the USA - like Deming - and improved on the suggestions made over time.

Things eventually became more expensive of course ... to they shifted some manufacturing to cheaper countries. That may also have been influenced by lack of space to build factories and the risks of catastrophic earthquakes, etc.

I'm not sure that other places have the same attitudes or ever will.

Moreover the world, for now, seems to have moved to rampant disposeability principles. That's probably partly driven by tech at the moment followed by desperate attempts to find ways to keep the economy "growing" during an impending period of energy supply constraint.

As far as I can tell China has been a rapid development basket case over the past 2 or 3 decades and right the way through the manufacturing and delivery chain every possible corner is being cut without anyone believing that there will be significant, avoidable consequences coming back from their decisions and actions.

Whether the same is true for other emerging manufacturing centres only time will confirm.

[Gerard C]

Originally Posted by Mike Harte

Isn't that somewhat similar to what happened post-war with items from Japan. That is until they found ways to start producing electronics, cameras and cars, etc. far better than anyone else could do, and also far cheaper.

+ 1. Big difference between Japanese and Chinese companies, the first using patents when the others just copy. For instance, induction systems used by Denso are identical to Bosch systems quality wise and Chinese so called Weber carbs are identical to a crap coming from the scrapeyard.

[andy97]

Originally Posted by grantp

That's true Mike but the Japanese seem to have a different approach to quality matters than can be found in other places.

Plus they listened to some of the manufacturing gurus from the USA - like Deming - and improved on the suggestions made over time.

Things eventually became more expensive of course ... to they shifted some manufacturing to cheaper countries. That may also have been influenced by lack of space to build factories and the risks of catastrophic earthquakes, etc.

I'm not sure that other places have the same attitudes or ever will.

Moreover the world, for now, seems to have moved to rampant disposeability principles. That's probably partly driven by tech at the moment followed by desperate attempts to find ways to keep the economy "growing" during an impending period of energy supply constraint.

As far as I can tell China has been a rapid development basket case over the past 2 or 3 decades and right the way through the manufacturing and delivery chain every possible corner is being cut without anyone believing that there will be significant, avoidable consequences coming back from their decisions and actions.

Whether the same is true for other emerging manufacturing centres only time will confirm.

I worked on a bid for a well known rolling stock manufacturer a few years ago. They seriously considered off shoring the production of the body shell (U.K. design) to a Chinese company and were very impressed by the price, quality and the factory facilities.
However, they did not go through with the plan because the penalty clauses for late deliveries of the completed trains to the end customer were very onerous, and the U.K. company could not risk delays in shipping the body shells from China.
Given the recent issues with the blocking of the Suez Canal by the Ever Given container ship (2021) and the current issues in the Red Sea their decision was proven correct (although production of those train would have been complete by 2021).
It just shows that a) Chinese quality can be good (anyone heard of any issues with modern MGs etc?) and b) the production costs in the far east may be cheaper but if the sea lines of communication (SLOCs) are disrupted the west is very vulnerable.

[Mike Harte]

Andy, as you say, I'm sure that there are many Chinese companies more than able, or could be able, to manufacture all manner of things to a high degree; the fact that a lot of Chinese companies choose to make tat is because it's highly profitable for them.

This reminds me of a business trip that I took to Taiwan 40 odd years ago looking for suitable partners to expand my company. During the time I spent there I only came across firms that were producing junk, and no serious contenders for any joint ventures. All I got was sleepless nights being constantly woken by telephone calls from "agents" supposedly representing manufacturers of mainly plastic toys - I found out that hotel receptionists take bungs to provide lists of foreign business people staying in the hotels.

But my point is that nowadays, Taiwan no longer specialises in that sort of manufacturing, and is, or so I believe, the major supplier of electronic chips to the world and China now getting on that bandwagon because that is where the real money is, as pretty well everything you buy now needs a chip to make it work.

[grantp]

The problem seems to be not so much that China cannot make good quality products but that there is no certainty that they will do so consistently, batch after batch.

In addition, there will always be the temptation to sell rejects packaged as the genuine, quality-approved, article.

If a product seeker is not willing or able to put the time, resources and effort into QC management it is likely that the product manufacturer will attempt to cut corners at the first opportunity. Or find ways to sell product that fails quality control and should have been scrapped.

Or they run overproduction, creating stuff that looks identical to OEM components but, being overrun, is not QC'd but may well find a way to market anyway.

[MGDavid]

Back on topic (!!) had great weekend at Teretonga to round off the tour. Four races, P10 P9 P9 and P7. Just getting my head round the circuit and it was time to pack up and come home. Had a brilliant time with friends old and new, the FJ lot are all top blokes, especially Delta who suggested I do it and sorted the invitation. I note the Otago Times omitted to mention the USA in foreign countries competing - luckily Rich isn't the type to take offence. Just outside Christchurch now, wending our way back to Auckland, flying home on Friday to what's left of winter. Roll on Easter, we' re exercising the Gilbern on the Monday at Goodwood.

[Paul D]

Great to hear you had a reasonably successful trip in the end. It must have been a little more gratifying after the way it looked very touch-and-go at the beginning with the delays, etc?

Congratulations on finishing the races, and with improvements along the way!

[delta]

We head home later today . I really don’t want to leave NZ. Just off for a run to wear myself out ready for the long flight .

[racinglad]

1/2 Marathon with stew?

[Peter Mallett]

Originally Posted by delta

We head home later today . I really don’t want to leave NZ. Just off for a run to wear myself out ready for the long flight .

Safe journey.

[E.B]

Safe flight home all

[raspritz]

NZ was a wonderful trip from a tourism standpoint, one of the greatest places I've ever been. And I met a lot of wonderful folks and made many new friends. But was a very expensive and very tough trip from a racing standpoint. As you all know, due to shipping F-ups we missed the racing at Ruapuna entirely. And the cars arrived at Levels something like an hour before scheduled qualifying. At Levels we unfortunately suffered failure of the gearbox front seal, but fortunately had a spare gearbox so we were able to do a swap. But we continued to be plagued by oil leaking into the cockpit at each session, and halfway through the racing at Teretonga we realized we had a leaking front main seal of our new Swiftune engine and DNSed the rest of the racing. Still, this all falls under the category "That's racing", and indeed there was some great racing. I think you all know about the big oil spil at Teretonga, leading to multiple spins, including me, and a bad incident, with truly heroic and inspiring action by Martin McHugh and Graham Baron, both of whom were injured rescuing John Rapely. Sadly, though, the trip also negatively impacts much of the rest of my planned season's racing. Theoretically, on the car's return to the UK we could swap in our old motor while the new motor is being rebuilt. Unfortunately, thanks to our Houthi-Arab brothers' attacks on ships in the Red Sea, our cars remain in their containers, sitting at the Teretonga racetrack, with no scheduled departure date from NZ. That delay trashes our scheduled participation in the May FJHRA race at Enna-Pergusa, Sicily, which trip is all booked but now will be a tourist jaunt rather than a racing trip. And I have no idea about thereafter. Talk about a mess! At least I didn't prang the racecar!

[Peter Mallett]

With all of those challenges you all did well to at least get some racing in. Very sorry to read about your ongoing woes but not entirely surprised given the current political situation. Fingers crossed your cars return soon.

[Mike Harte]

The movement of containers back and forth from the Far East and beyond is an ongoing struggle. This time two years ago, my son sent a container of his household contents to Japan, with a contract that stated that it would arrive in Japan approximately 2 weeks after he and my daughter in law arrived - they left the UK a month later.

What happened was completely different. Firstly, it wasn't loaded on to the ship it was originally intended, and in the end, it went about a fortnight later. Then, for reasons never explained, it was off-loaded in China before the ship made it's scheduled stop in Japan and sat there, on the dockside for weeks before it was eventually shipped to Japan.

Finally, it arrived at his new home over 3 months after he had moved in. At the same time, he had his Mini shipped out there on a car transporter a few days before he flew out and that arrived in about 5 weeks. Unfortunately, he is regretting paying a fortune to do this as the car has been sat in a local main dealer for about 3 months while they attempt to re-programme a second-hand ECU unit that controls a lot of the electrics. I sourced it over here because BMW, in their wisdom, decided not to have replacement units manufactured for older cars even though they know that it is a part that is known to fail.

[grantp]

Talking about shipping and containers ...

I have an upgrade ordered for my electric bike conversion. Used the cheap option to get about 50% off the price by waiting 6 months since there is no urgency.

However, communications from the turn of the year about hearing soon about shipping plans seem to have gone quiet.

I'm not surprised but one might imagine some may be rather annoyed about the delay and start threatening to cancel orders and claim refunds. The full impact of the effects of the Red Sea and the Panama Canal problems, along with everything else that's going on, may not become entirely clear to everyone until summer.

Certainly long enough to mess with many people's racing and leisure plans.

[andy97]

Originally Posted by grantp

Talking about shipping and containers ...

I have an upgrade ordered for my electric bike conversion. Used the cheap option to get about 50% off the price by waiting 6 months since there is no urgency.

However, communications from the turn of the year about hearing soon about shipping plans seem to have gone quiet.

I'm not surprised but one might imagine some may be rather annoyed about the delay and start threatening to cancel orders and claim refunds. The full impact of the effects of the Red Sea and the Panama Canal problems, along with everything else that's going on, may not become entirely clear to everyone until summer.

Certainly long enough to mess with many people's racing and leisure plans.

Perhaps our politicians should think about how we become more self sufficient in many critical areas?

[grantp]

Originally Posted by andy97

Perhaps our politicians should think about how we become more self sufficient in many critical areas?

Indeed Andy.

However, they would then need to find ways to fund the redevelopment of British Industry and all of the infrastructure that would entail.

Construction does not seem to be a strong point right now yet still has resource constraints due to a lack of trained (or even untrained) manpower.

I'm looking forward to the plans that the politicians have for instantly fixing the alleged housing crisis by building 1.5 million new homes at the same time as creating the new infrastructure for industry and "fixing" all of the old properties to make them Energy Efficient a part of the Net Zero drive.

I think that last country that achieved anything like that by itself was probably the USA in the 40s and 50s.

The background events in those times were, I suppose, somewhat similar to those we have now. Interstingly the US was able to not only do itself a lot of wealth-generating good but help Japan and Germany to recover their mojo at the same time.

Whether they can do it again in the current circumstances remains to be seen.

The UK, having disestablished most of the core industries that might make possible some sort of concept for self sufficient industrial development, does not seem to be in a good position, especially no politically, to develop a self-help regime.

Sadly.

[MGDavid]

perhaps the last 4 posts would be better suited in the Rendezvous thread?