Special Saloon/Super Saloon Register

[Alan Brown]

1971

Another edited list of Anglias (about one-third of those recorded):-

Francis Beechey (originally EARP) - 1600/1650
Dave Bray (Yarbspeed) - 1800 (mainly sprint but also raced)
Mike Chittenden - 1600 twin cam (David Wood) - repainted yellow and black - damaged - replacement shell (in the mean time borrowed Roger Gard 1500 Anglia)
Ken Dawes - V6 3.0
B Gardiner or Gardener - 1800 twin cam
John MacDonald - 1000 BRM
Martin Maudling - 1000 SCA
Terry McNally - 997 Cosworth MAE - orange and purple livery of Revolution Wheels
Stephen Milne - 1298 Holbay - red
Les Nash - 1000 MAE or 1000 Lucas (Purple People Eater)
Alan Palmer (ex Mick Hill) - Janglia 3.8
Eric Smith (also raced by Norman Hodgson) -Janglia 3.8 (ex Mick Hill)
[I am not sure of the ownership]
Terry Stone (Rydal Garage) - 1650
Gerry Taylor (ex Roger Williamson) - 1000 Holbay (or MAE)

For sale:-
• Ex Laurie Hickman Anglia, offers around £350, Lowden, Grimsby (MN 10-6-71)
• Ex-WRA “Purple Haze” (George Whitehead) 1860cc, London (MN 1-7-71)
• V8 Anglia, Cobra, offers, Richard Lane, Kinver (MN 8-7-71)

Ireland:-
D Lindsay - 1600 twin cam
Mattie McNamara - 1300 (“the power unit is a one-off Ford-Cosworth 1.3 litre unit built for racing in 1969 but dropped after a change of heart on the part of Henry Taylor …. it was never raced” MN 25-3-71) or was it a 1000 twin cam?
Seamus O’Connor - 1700 or 1800 twin cam
Joe Pat O’Kane - 1600
Robert Ward - 1800 twin cam – to Ernest Stewart

[Alan Brown]

From the sublime to the ridiculous, or should it be the other way round?

2009 has seen the debut of one new special saloon (in my opinion in the old tradition) and the reappearance of another.

Harvey Death won at the Silverstone Classic in his new Mini, built by Rollcentre and powered by a 320 bhp V8 2.6 Powertec engine. (See also Autosport 30-4-09 and this youtube clip of a test session at Donington - http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yX-mhIngXF8)

The reappearance, also a winning one at Lydden in August, was of Bill Richards' Metro now sporting a 2.0 Duratec instead of the previous BDH.
(http://www.billrichardsracing.com/wp/?page_id=12)

[driftwood]

anglias Teryy McNally car will be Pat Manions car
John McDonald RAM racing boss i think is in broadspeed chassis car

is Dave Bray from Maresfield near Uckfield had the Itsanopel 3.5 litre sprint car 20 years ago?
Janglia
can we have a list of who owned drove this car
reading march 1979 AS adverts gary charlwood is selling his Janglia 320 bhp E type mptor £1000 but i think its been written this is NOT the Mick Hill /R Scantlebury car?

how many Janglias have been raced 2 or 3?

[Alan Brown]

In a nutshell dunno.

The famous one was 1967 Richard Scantlebury and 1968-70 Mick Hill.

Other Janglias
Late 1970 Norman Hodgson
1971 Alan Palmer (ex-Mick Hill)
1971 Eric Smith [also raced by Norman Hodgson](ex-Mick Hill)
1972 Tony Tobias [(Wynns] (believed to be ex-"many", so could be ex-Mick Hill

http://tentenths.com/forum/showthrea...=25836&page=37
Gary Charlwood said “my janglia was not the ex mick hill car i brought it from a mr homes from northumberland on 3 sep 1977”

As many of the above drivers in the early 1970s raced in the north/north-east there could be links.

For sale (A/S 4-10-68) V Jag Anglia (3.8 E-type), now fitted Lotus suspension, £575, Long Eaton.
For sale (MN 3-7-69) Jag Anglia, rebodied, 280 bhp E-type unit, £950, Long Eaton.

I'll keep reading!


For sale (A/S 4-10-68) V Jag Anglia (3.8 E-type), now fitted Lotus suspension, £575, Long Eaton.
For sale (MN 3-7-69) Jag Anglia, rebodied, 280 bhp E-type unit, £950, Long Eaton.

[driftwood]

Long eaton is donington park area?= Mick Hill land?

[Alan Brown]

I dug out Mike Kettlewell's Motor Racing Directory (second version) and found some useful gen about Mick Hill. His address was Draycott which is more or less opposite Long Eaton across the M1.

He bought the Janglia from Richard Scantlebury in 1967. After racing it in 1968 he did a complete rebuild "virtually re-engineering the car" with a new bodyshell. Raced it in 1969-70.

31 out of 40 races were won in 1971-2 with the Boss Capri. He also raced a production Capri "but this was not very successful". A new 6-litre Capri was built for 1973. 18 race wins in 1973 with the two special saloon Capris. 10 wins in 1974.

With a lack of sponsorship in 1975 plans to convert the ex-Mike Wilds March 74A into a super saloon had to be shelved but it was raced as a single seater.

1976 - Trojan T102-based VW Beetle. Sold in 1977 (Doug Niven, Jeff Wilson)

1977/8 ex-Hazlewood XJ8-Chevy 7.0 - destroyed in a workshop fire Out of the ashes rose the Phoenix (Skoda with the 7.0 Chevy) for 1979-80.

[driftwood]

I dug out Mike Kettlewell's Motor Racing Directory (second version) and found some useful gen about Mick Hill. His address was Draycott which is more or less opposite Long Eaton across the M1.poss same area code then?

He bought the Janglia from Richard Scantlebury in 1967. After racing it in 1968 he did a complete rebuild "virtually re-engineering the car" with a new bodyshell. Raced it in 1969-70. wonder if he sold off the old shell to someone henec 2 cars around?

31 out of 40 races were won in 1971-2 with the Boss Capri. He also raced a production Capri "but this was not very successful". A new 6-litre Capri was built for 1973. 18 race wins in 1973 with the two special saloon Capris. 10 wins in 1974.i think this car later in 76 or 77 went to martin birrane tony rosen i have a note somewhere skoda i think went to george welly potter to race then Mick took T400 durex car made his BMW M1 surtees chevy lump for don GT races the Lola T400 is now rebuilt in NZ body and parts where for sale 3 yrs ago i think body can be bought motor other parts now all sold off

With a lack of sponsorship in 1975 plans to convert the ex-Mike Wilds March 74A into a super saloon had to be shelved but it was raced as a single seater.car was sold to jamaica then to usa

1976 - Trojan T102-based VW Beetle. Sold in 1977 (Doug Niven, Jeff Wilson)jeff raced it 1980 ish then built the B30 pruley chevron ga f5000 car into teh bmw M1 for donington GT-VW beetle went to gary charlwood to race lydden circa 82ish the beetle has now been restored and runs

1977/8 ex-Hazlewood XJ8-Chevy 7.0 - destroyed in a workshop fire Out of the ashes rose the Phoenix (Skoda with the 7.0 Chevy) for 1979-80. skoda was F5000 based i believe the jag was not a total write off ex hazle wood sheel at autosport nec auction few yrs back

[Clive Brown]

Originally Posted by Alan Brown

Ron Mason is R V Mason

But so was Rob Mason- Robert Victor Mason! It is not actually impossible that Rob wasn't racing as early as 1963; a bit of, err, creativity might have been employed in filling in his licence application.

Rob certainly knew Ken Costello from an early age, and raced a number of Ken's Minis.

[driftwood]

for rob to have raced in 63 he would have been 15 lying about his age as 17 !
i dont think rob started until 67/68 at the earliest i know he had the lap record at the Palace in a mini when it closed

[Clive Brown]

Originally Posted by driftwood

for rob to have raced in 63 he would have been 15 lying about his age as 17 !

By no means impossible! I can't actually remember his real age, but think he's about five years older than me, which makes him....

Of course, it's not impossible that his dad wasn't Ronald Victor Mason!

[Clive Brown]

Originally Posted by petestenning

The Imp being 875 must have been a near standard car as developement of the 998 's may not have started in earnest in 63 .

It must also have been cheating, as the class is up to 850cc! It is also likely that it was a quasi-works car, as Tim Millington worked for many years for the factory's Special Tuning department.

The Rootes/Chrysler factory certainly did know how to cheat, viz. the homologation into Group 1 of the 1300 and 16000 Avenger with twin 40DCOE Webers "for the Brazilian market". 5000 of each made in a calendar year? Yeah, right.

[driftwood]

Rob M would certainly be late 50` possibly pass bus age? he is younger than my father

Imp 1 litre was developed in 63 with the Apex project but rootes decided to de tune the motor for the general public as it was too quick hence why we ended up with 875 cc engine
the 1 litre was homologated in 65 for 66 season as the Rallye for the monte carlo event

[Clive Brown]

Originally Posted by driftwood

Rob M would certainly be late 50` possibly pass bus age? he is younger than my father

Are you George Bernard, drifters? I reckon he's probably 62 (birthday in November?), but will look twenty years younger. That's Rob, not your Dad; he's had a very stressful life!

[Clive Brown]

Originally Posted by driftwood

Imp 1 litre was developed in 63 with the Apex project but rootes decided to de tune the motor for the general public as it was too quick hence why we ended up with 875 cc engine
the 1 litre was homologated in 65 for 66 season as the Rallye for the monte carlo event

I've heard this before, but I'm not convinced. Early factory or quasi-factory (for which read Fraser) 998s had a dry liner with a 'top hat' flange to retain the liner at the top of the block; the rim of the 'top hat' used to crack away from the bore, the liner gradually got pulled down, and eventually the top ring would expand over the top of the body of the liner, pulled it down into the crankcase, and bad things happened. Hence all the later one litre and over engines were wet linered.

If the original blocks were one litre with cast-in liners like the 875 and the later B1 930, would it not have made sense to have used these blocks for the later 998cc Rallye (sic) Imp, which IIRC was homologated into the Gp. 3 of the time?

[driftwood]

my old fella only had stressful life that he has inflicted upon himself by going to work and wanting to go motor racing but until recently he still thought he was 30!

Im sure the developement Imp was 1 litre found it was way too quick for Joe public as it was derived from the climax FP series 1220 motor and created the Imp 875 block engine hence why the 998 etc was a new concept
i believe some one did race Imp with climax motor fitted poss Nathan Emery in 64 ish all before my time !

[Clive Brown]

Originally Posted by driftwood

my old fella only had stressful life that he has inflicted upon himself by going to work and wanting to go motor racing

And there's me unable to sleep at night for worry thinking that it was out of concern that instead of earning an honest crust, a wastrel son had taken to punting out old clunkers for a living....

Originally Posted by driftwood

as it was derived from the climax FP series 1220 motor and created the Imp 875 block engine hence why the 998 etc was a new concept

Generic series of Coventry Climax motors from which the Imp was derived was the FW. I believe that a 750cc version won either the Index of Thermal Efficiency or the Index of performance at Le Mans in a Lotus Elite, which did of course come (or was it just breathing heavily?) as a road car with a 1220cc Coventry Climax engine (FWE?).

The so-called 'deep head' used by Fraser in Gp. 5 and later by Carter was I believe the FWH head; five-bearing cams, long thick-stemmed valves, reversed inlet/exhaust order. Sand cast heads in two different versions, the later with more strengthening ribs. Some were on blocks not of Imp origin with a five-bearing crank, which were usually of 1150, 1212, or 1220cc capacity, but were not to the best of my knowledge FWEs; that was a physically larger motor.

[driftwood]

Clive the old duffer does also reap some benefits of my "wasted" occupation like a set of carbon discs n pads for the F1 car!

The Imp engine is actually a diferent set of castings and not a Climax cast made unit but the visuals certainly draw many folk to see a fire pump climax an elite climax and say oh you gotta Imp motor there!
Tis exactly what my mate said on sunday when he saw a fire pump under a bench- i should have said it was sunbeam 930 motor to confuse him even more

Im sure if you read Apex the Imp story you will read the concept design Imp had 1 litre climax motor fitted

[Clive Brown]

Originally Posted by driftwood

The Imp engine is actually a diferent set of castings and not a Climax cast made unit

I'm not so sure, as I've seen a number of sand cast bits (front cover and cam cover amongst others) which fitted the Imp perfectly. I think that a number of Imp bits, albeit pressure diecast, were interchangeable with CC originals.

[driftwood]

I dont dis agree about conectitivty of teh oparts BUT if that wa steh case why did rootes not utilise climax tooling as it was in exitance? and make 1220 motor etc etc
i think u willf ind the parts may bolt together but dont work as well combinded a syou think
if they did half teh race motor s of the 60`s would be climax not imp motors in teh Imp shell

[Clive Brown]

Originally Posted by driftwood

if they did half teh race motor s of the 60`s would be climax not imp motors in teh Imp shell

But the Fraser Gp. 5 cars did use a Climax FWH head, or at least some of them did. I think the works rallycross car may also have done, although I'm not certain.

[driftwood]

fraser rally cross car was the previous years club car converted
i can see the logic in tyring the F head but it woul donly be club racing NOt gp5 as it was not "mologated"
i did send u direct email on the F subject but u have blanked me

[Clive Brown]

But I don't think that cylinder heads in that particular Gp. 5 had to be homologated, viz. FVA Escorts, Arden eight-port headed Minis, and MAE Anglias with downdraught heads!

[col rooney]

None of the coventry climax parts fit the imp engine ,yes there was some very early sand cast blocks and covers but these wear more from the test engines ,

col

[Clive Brown]

Col

I know that the rule on this, and indeed any other properly-regulated Forum, is "attack the post, not the poster", but to the best of my knowledge, you're just plain wrong about this. Seen the bits, built the engines....

It actually depends upon from which FW-series engine you try to use components!

Perhaps we need a new thread about Coventry Climax FW series/Apex/Imp/B1 motors?

Clive

[VIVA GT]

This thread is a typical example of what I find fascinating about the Ten-Tenths forums. I have no more than a passing (and very casual) interest in the Hillman Imp engine, but am finding the postings here really interesting. All the background information and knowledge that's been held in people's heads for 40 odd years being laid out here for us all to read. - Brilliant! Thanks to you all for sharing your knowledge.
(Please note that my comments above are relating to the whole thread, and not just the last few posts!).