Isle of Man TT 2014

[Asp]

I'm surprised no-one has started this thread yet, now we're well over half-way through practice week.

Unfortunately it has been a disjointed week - Saturday totally washed out and last night stopped after just a single lap of solos. From what we've seen, Bruce Anstey has been on form on the big bikes - but even with John McGuiness nursing an injury he's still up there, so you can't bet against him...

[chunder]

Not sure you will get uch out of this anymore

Le MAns is starting soon and this forum now sadly, pretty much revolves around that.

[Dani Filth]

well .. it seems Webber paid them a visit

[Armco Bender]

Isle of Man is much more rivetting than some sportscar race.
Great to see a Kiwi is the fastest person around the track,he was giving it everything that Superbike last lap.

[David Stallard]

Karl Harris died at the TT today, RIP fella you will be missed.

we all know it can and probably will happen but it is still unbelievably sad when it does.

.DAVID.

[chunder]

One of the reasons I really dont like this week, as there are so many RIP messages at the TT.

KArl was always pushing it and was known as a bit of a crasher, maybe as Simon Andrews was, but you are pushing the envelope at a differnet level at the TT.

Two guys with amazing talent and families lost.

I do so wish this race didnt attract so much talent.

[Asp]

We've had a couple of sad days over here with Bob Price killed in yesterday's Supersport race; a public fatality on open roads that delayed racing today; and then the incident involving Bomber Harris.
It's always a risk this fortnight, and following so closely after Simon Andrews (who had a memorial lap on Sunday) has created a bit of a somber mood in the paddock.
Thoughts with all involved in all these incidents, and also all those injured in the past few days.

[davyboy]

Originally Posted by chunder

One of the reasons I really dont like this week, as there are so many RIP messages at the TT.

KArl was always pushing it and was known as a bit of a crasher, maybe as Simon Andrews was, but you are pushing the envelope at a differnet level at the TT.

Two guys with amazing talent and families lost.

I do so wish this race didnt attract so much talent.

I felt sick in my stomach when I heard about Karl yesterday. I know these guys knew what they were at and died doing something they loved but in 2014 why does a minor mistake in a sporting event have to be punishable by death almost every time ?

I know I'm probably a lone voice on here and I expect to get castigated again but it's shocking, upsetting and terribly sad - and it doesn't need to happen.

[chunder]

What amazes me here is this.

And this is only a certain amount of grief telling me this...

Karl and Simon Andrews were both noted for maybe not staying on the bike as much as some in short circuit racing. They were both insanely quick, top 1% in terms of speed and both had limited success in Superbikes after superb Supersport campaigns.

It must be conincidence, but when both mentioned doing the roads, my first thought was, "crikey, you can't stay on it on the track, how on earth are you going to cope on the roads". Horrible thought I know, but just an honest opinion. ANd not meant to be disrespectful.

If I think that being just a mere fan, surely someone somewhere with some power and a bit of influence could come up with some sort of way of restricting what bikes they ride maybe?

I know this is a kneejerk thing, and there are fatalities every year at road races, but I do think at times simply letting anyone get out there, no matter what their history and achievement is a recipe for disaster.

[bella]

this is all incredibly sad. BUT the riders themselves choose to get involved, and choose to take on the risks, and love what they do. let's respect that, eh?

my thoughts are with his friends and family, some of whom are mine too and are devastated.

[chunder]

Interesting reading comments form a few top racers about this.

Scott redding was going to be at the track on Friday, but knew Bob Price who was killed earleir, and also Karl.

Was a little outspoken about the place,a dn obviously received good and bad commets on Twitter.

I think Simon Crafar put it best "As usual, as a rider you are allowed to comment on any track, apart from that one."

Couldn't put it better myself

[Asp]

Mod note: To allow the RIP thread to remain as a tribute I have edited some of those posts and moved the thread into Tributes. The entire Karl Harris thread has been copied into this thread for any wider discussion that people wish to have.

[steve_r]

Scott Redding was very close to Bob Price by the sounds of it, so it's perfectly understandable that he might not want to go to the IOM just days after he was killed there. People criticising him in his time of grief really ought to take a step back and take a good look at themselves.

Some people are so overprotective of the TT. You hear the same arguments every single time - the riders knew the risks etc etc. Yes, but what about doing something to REDUCE the risks, so that competitors, spectators and mad Sunday riders don't die nearly every year.

[racer69]

Originally Posted by steve_r

Some people are so overprotective of the TT. You hear the same arguments every single time - the riders knew the risks etc etc. Yes, but what about doing something to REDUCE the risks, so that competitors, spectators and mad Sunday riders don't die nearly every year.

To be fair, you hear the same arguments from both sides year on year as far back as I remember.

What can realistically be done to reduce the risks more than the organisers currently do?

[davyboy]

Originally Posted by steve_r

Scott Redding was very close to Bob Price by the sounds of it, so it's perfectly understandable that he might not want to go to the IOM just days after he was killed there. People criticising him in his time of grief really ought to take a step back and take a good look at themselves.

Some people are so overprotective of the TT. You hear the same arguments every single time - the riders knew the risks etc etc. Yes, but what about doing something to REDUCE the risks, so that competitors, spectators and mad Sunday riders don't die nearly every year.

Very good post Steve... completely agree. Nothing whatsoever has been done to mitigate the grave risks that event poses to everyone involved. It's macabre pure and simple.

[Juarez Jed]

We all go to motorsport events knowing that something could go wrong and someone could be killed or injured, but the problem with the IOM TT is that you expect people to die every year, and there is something uncomfortable about that. I know I would not follow motorsports if it were so commonplace as to have a death at nearly every event.
Do the coroner's findings ever lead to anything changing ?

[mountainstar]

If you are going to have a 37 mile track which is public road and you are bombing along at 200 mph and come off, you are going to fly for a long ways in just about any direction and there is only so much that can be done.

[wnut]

Originally Posted by mountainstar

If you are going to have a 37 mile track which is public road and you are bombing along at 200 mph and come off, you are going to fly for a long ways in just about any direction and there is only so much that can be done.

There is actually quite a lot that could be done, but it would interfere with the ambience, mystique and risk of the event.
This would probably impact on the mass appeal of the event while adding considerable expense, so nothing gets done, sad but simple!

[Asp]

As Juarez has said, motorsport is dangerous. The number of miles covered over the TT fortnight is probably more than most short-track series over the course of a season, so the concentration (and comparative "deaths per mile", being blunt) has to be looked at.

However, I will readily accept that road racing is more dangerous as street furniture present additional hazards. What I can say from first hand experience is that the safety provision is second to none. I'm confident that the organisers continue to learn and look at past incidents to make things safer. Mountainstar is completely right in that only so much can be done, and I'm sorry davyboy but (as someone currently over here for my fourth TT) I have to disagree with your statement that "nothing whatsoever has been done" - it has and will continue to be so.

[steve_r]

Originally Posted by Asp

. Mountainstar is completely right in that only so much can be done, and I'm sorry davyboy but (as someone currently over here for my fourth TT) I have to disagree with your statement that "nothing whatsoever has been done" - it has and will continue to be so.

Thats good to hear - I wonder what exactly is being done? Apart from changing regulations to make the sidecars faster of course.

[davyboy]

Originally Posted by Asp

I'm sorry davyboy but (as someone currently over here for my fourth TT) I have to disagree with your statement that "nothing whatsoever has been done" - it has and will continue to be so.

Maybe I should have been clearer and qualified what I posted by saying that nothing whatsoever has been done to lower the risk of death or serious injury. It's impossible to disagree with that because people are still dying in unacceptable numbers every year there.

[chunder]

I remember at Daytona they tried to slow things down force majeure, by making the 200 a race for Supersport machines, making the tyres easier to run the long distance as Dunlop were strugglign to make Superbike tyres cope with the banking.

Wonder if it might be worth looking at reducing the power of the bigger bikes at the TT? Cant be hurt to run them on a restrictor?

Let's face it, a Superstock bike can lap maybe only 3 or 4 mph slower than a Superbike! And Supersport machines not far off those either.

Sadly, even though I do not like this event for the hurt it causes, unless there is a groundswell of support to stop it, it will never be stopped as far too many people want to put themselves to the test.

It just so happens that for me Karl and Si Andrews were known as maybe being a little crash happy in the first place on short circuits, and for them to think they could wing it on roads shows more to me than anything else I can say.

[davyboy]

Originally Posted by chunder

Sadly, even though I do not like this event for the hurt it causes, unless there is a groundswell of support to stop it, it will never be stopped as far too many people want to put themselves to the test.

I think you're right. Even though the current death rate would be totally unacceptable in any other form of motor sport, because it's ones and twos being bumped off at a time, it hides below the radar. Regrettably, it's going to take a catastrophic tragedy for something to be done about this thing. If only the bike fraternity had somebody like Jackie Stewart to champion their cause.

[chunder]

This is true, I remember davyboy us having a discussion about this nearly every year!!

But, sadly, with the TT I realy do not know the answer, other than restricing bike power or makin newer riders ride slower or more restricted bikes.

And let's be honets, what guy who has won at the top level like a Harris or Nadrews is going to want to do that?

I fear, this is one area where common sense gets left behind, anyone who watched the TT film and saw how Guy was made to look a chump in the pits and lost a race because of it after going a fraction over the pit speed, whilst risking his life elsewhere realises the people that run the TT have their priorities on rules, breaking them and the applicaiton of them, not a lot else matters. Rules are rules, but hey!

[garcon]

I have never understood this obsession some people seem to have with attempting to save motorbike road racers from themselves. They're grown ups, they know the risks, they do it because of the challenges those risks bring. You can't make it safe, but you can do everything possible to ensure the very best medical care for those riders unlucky enough to crash but lucky enough to survive. You can also do everything possible to ensure new riders have the ability and application to learn the circuit and treat it with respect. A huge amount of work has been done on both fronts in recent years.