Simona's fire & the pathetic attempt to put it out..

[racerxf12004]

I couldnt beleive how unprepared the safety crew was when they tried to put out the fire on Simonas car. It was like watching the 3 stooges in action. One guy stood there with a fire house & there was no water pressure. Another guy tried to pull her out of the car. I couldnt beleive it! Finally one of them put an extingisher on the fire. This was after 15 seconds of her still sitting in the car after they pulled up. This could have been really UGLY if she was in the car for another 10 seconds. The IRL needs to look at there procedures of putting out fires a little more closely....

[DanicaFan]

I agree, the safety crew is usually very good at doing the job but that was terrible. They knew the car was on fire as it was rolling down the track. A safety crew member in that first truck should of had an extinguisher on his lap ready to go and when they got there, jump out and start putting out the fire.

[mountainstar]

Someone sent me a youtube clip of this and it looked like a bunch of monkeys doing a football.

Obviously they had no plan when it hit the fan. I wont try to second guess those guys too much but I don't think they looked that organized. I believe the FIA guidelines/rules say the first extinguisher has to hit the drivers area in 7.5 seconds. What they were doing fiddling around with the hose and running around like chickens with their head cut off I do not know.

[fieldodreams79]

i think a bucket brigade would have put the fire out quicker. looks to me like both truck's hoses malfunctioned; that is quite unacceptable. 1st truck crew panicked after that.

glad that she only had minor burns and was in remarkably good spirits about it in her interview during the race broadcast.

[JagtechOhio]

This is the Holmatro Safety Team. They are supposed to be trained experts, who are transported by the IRL to every event along with their specially designed equipment.

They appear to be experts at picking up trash from the ground after an accident. And sweeping up cat litter. That was a disgrace.

[Stuart Hill]

As a Marshal with over 25yrs experience (some of it in the USA), it was embarrassing to watch. I've seen novices with minimal training do better.

At least Simona doesn't seem too badly injured and here's to a speedy recovery.

Those of you who haven't seen it yet, see below and judge for yourselves...

Simona's crash

[JagtechOhio]

Thanks for the clip, Stewart.

I counted 20 sec. from impact to car stopped. It seemed to me that they should have been on scene faster, seeing the slow slide and the flames. 30 seconds more before the first extinguisher was played.

Nobody reached for a kill switch or the onboard fire system activation, did they?

It seemed like an hour in real time. Thank goodness for the lucky result, there was not much skill in evidence.

[Stuart Hill]

Originally Posted by JagtechOhio

I counted 20 sec. from impact to car stopped. It seemed to me that they should have been on scene faster, seeing the slow slide and the flames. 30 seconds more before the first extinguisher was played.

Nobody reached for a kill switch or the onboard fire system activation, did they?

It seemed like an hour in real time. Thank goodness for the lucky result, there was not much skill in evidence.

I can't fault them in arrival time. Don't forget that they have to allow time for the other cars to slow down plus they have no idea just where the broken car may come to a halt.

The main issue is that they didn't seem to know how to operate the hose system (maybe it failed) but those hoses should only be used as back-up. Here in the UK our first weapon is Dry Powder extinguishers which "knock-down" the flames thus allowing time for cooling to occur with hoses or foam extinguishers.

IMHO, the first bottle should have been powder and should have been on the driver/car within 5 secs of their arrival.

Kill switch may help if fuel is still being pumped. I don't know about any on-board systems in these cars.

Either way, that fire did not seem to have taken a good enough hold and should have been out within about 10 secs of the arrival of the pick-up. Just look how quickly the fire did go out once the second pick-up arrived.

[JagtechOhio]

Here's the beakdown:

http://www.16thandgeorgetown.com/201...5-seconds.html

[Stuart Hill]

Originally Posted by JagtechOhio

Here's the beakdown:

http://www.16thandgeorgetown.com/201...5-seconds.html

excellent piece, thx for that.

But, just because she was O.K. doesn't make the situation O.K.

EXACTLY !!

[JagtechOhio]

I believe the fuel pump is still mechanical cable drive from the engine.

On-board minimum 2.25 liters fire supressant AFFF-M-E fluid.

"IMHO, the first bottle should have been powder and should have been on the driver/car within 5 secs of their arrival."

Amen.

[Stuart Hill]

Originally Posted by JagtechOhio

On-board minimum 2.25 liters fire supressant AFFF-M-E fluid.

works well doesn't it?

[JagtechOhio]

I'm looking for pics, I swore there was a pull ring and kill switch right where you know they should be. Nothing to show the onboard bottle going off.

[Stuart Hill]

an example of just how effective dry powder can be. knock-down effect

see the related videos for the full crash to see just how long it took (and how many bottles were needed) but the point is that the driver was out (and extiguished) in a matter of seconds.

[JagtechOhio]

Spot on.

Here's the emergency pull ring:

http://www.facebook.com/album.php?ai...00000295071046

[Piglet]

Shocking stuff, I counted 40 seconds between the car stopping and the first extinguisher being used. I don't know what their procedure is but to me surely the first guy out the first truck should be knocking down the fire with a dry powder whilst the others sort the hose.

[JagtechOhio]

13.19B. “The master switch must be used as supplied by the chassis Manufacturer. The switch must energize the onboard fire extinguisher and shut off the ignition. The switch shall be clearly marked with a decal, which will be supplied by Officials”.

That's the red ring with the "E" sticker. I would presume that to be the first action taken by the first safety crew member to reach the car.

[fieldodreams79]

Originally Posted by Stuart Hill

The main issue is that they didn't seem to know how to operate the hose system (maybe it failed) but those hoses should only be used as back-up. Here in the UK our first weapon is Dry Powder extinguishers which "knock-down" the flames thus allowing time for cooling to occur with hoses or foam extinguishers.
.....

IMHO, the first bottle should have been powder and should have been on the driver/car within 5 secs of their arrival.

.....

Either way, that fire did not seem to have taken a good enough hold and should have been out within about 10 secs of the arrival of the pick-up. Just look how quickly the fire did go out once the second pick-up arrived.

the first truck had four guys jump out, focusing on the hose, at first. if one had the fire extinguisher (FE), they could have knocked in down on seconds after arrival. this is obvious...

so the trucks had water only suppression system besides the hand held FE? this fire looked like oil and whatever else caught. i'm no fireman or marshall, but the water (on the trucks) is for an ethanol fire ONLY? is water good for putting out everything that is burning an IRL car but oil? what i am getting at is; was there any reason to have been "banking" on the water truck?

i do have the same opinion of others and it is worth repeating. of all the series that i have followed over the years, the IRL safety crews have been top notch until last night.

[gttouring]

what a disaster and the way they pulled poor simona out of the car and just tugged and tugged!
i hope she is ok and they under stand and explain what went wrong with the crew and equipment and such

[marcostraz]

I don't underestimate the fact that in the U.S. officials are not used to work with visible flames...it's a psychological speech: in nature, seeing the flames is one of the things that put more fear...just think how many animals are driven with fire ...probabily officials were not unprepared to work with fir in general, but to work with visible flames...fire is a bad beast, especially psychologically...probably the officials have to return to practice more to these situation ...

[icemachine]

Originally Posted by JagtechOhio

Spot on.

Here's the emergency pull ring:

http://www.facebook.com/album.php?ai...00000295071046

Facebook is not letting me see that pic Jag

[fieldodreams79]

Originally Posted by marcostraz

I don't underestimate the fact that in the U.S. officials are not used to work with visible flames...

huh????

[Whosyermon]

I was shocked, I'm use to the car being met with emergency vehicles before the wheels came to a stop at IRL/CART races. And I'm use to at least two of the first three out of the trucks lugging fire extinguishers with the third going directly to the driver.

However as badly as the safety team performed the guy who went to Simona and stayed with her through the flames to get her out was supremely courageous. He saved the Indy Car Series and it's fans from mourning the loss of one of it's drivers this morning... and one of their female drivers at that. As much as the Team failed this man deserves everyone's praise.

[mountainstar]

With the lovely "reunification" between Champcar and the irl in 2008, the irl got rid of Champcars full time paid safety team and now uses volunteers from god knows where now. Especially considering the irls horrific safety record, it's a pathetic disgrace.

It's just another sign that the irl is and always has been amateur hour.

I'm looking forward to the day the hulmangeorges sell out and we get away from this buffoonery from 1950's Indiana. It's 2010.

Another issue is what if the driver had been unconscious with a serious neck or head injury and that idiot was sitting there yanking away at her??

Just unbelievably pathetic. PATHETIC!!

[mountainstar]

Originally Posted by marcostraz

I don't underestimate the fact that in the U.S. officials are not used to work with visible flames...it's a psychological speech: in nature, seeing the flames is one of the things that put more fear...just think how many animals are driven with fire ...probabily officials were not unprepared to work with fir in general, but to work with visible flames...fire is a bad beast, especially psychologically...probably the officials have to return to practice more to these situation ...

That's what big ass fire extinguishers are for!