Jap GT in the USA...

**gomick** · 19 Dec 2004, 09:36 (Ref:1183024)

fontana race results...

1. 32 GT500 Tsugio Matsuda, Andre Lotterer Honda NSX 87
2. 3 GT500 Toshihiro Kaneishi, Erik Comas Nissan Fairlady Z 87 1.156
3. 35 GT500 Naoki Hattori, Shigekazu Wakisaka Toyota Supra 87 25.989
4. 12 GT500 Benoit Treluyer, Yuji Ide Nissan Fairlady Z 87 1:43.476
5. 37 GT500 James Courtney, Tatsuya Kataoka Toyota Supra 86 1 lap

6. 16 GT300 Tetsuya Yamano, Hiroyuki Yagi Honda NSX 84 3 laps
7. 100 GT500 Shinji Nakano, Hiroki Kato Honda NSX 83 4 laps
8. 81 GT300 Masataka Yanagida, Naofumi Omoto Nissan Fairlady Z 81 6 laps
9. 77 GT300 Katsuo Kobayashi, Tatsuya Tanigawa Subaru Impreza 81 6 laps
10. 63 GT300 Osamu, Hiroki Yoshimoto Vemac RD320R 81 6 laps
11. 19 GT300 Takayuki Aoki, Nobuteru Taniguchi Toyota Celica 79 8 laps
12. 6 GT500 Juichi Wakisaka, Akira Iida Toyota Supra 79 8 laps
13. 80 GT300 Mitsuhiro Kino****a, Kazuki Hoshino Nissan Fairlady Z 78 9 laps
14. 2 GT300 Kazuho Takahashi, Akira Watanabe Honda NSX 78 9 laps
15. 26 GT300 Yutaka Yamagishi, Kaoru Ijiri Advan GT3R 73 14 laps
16. 8 GT500 Katsutomo Kaneishi, Daisuke Ito Honda NSX 65 22 laps
17. 5 GT300 Tetsuji Tamanaka, Go Mifune Vemax RD320R 59 28 laps
18. 22 GT500 Masami Kageyama, Michael Krumm Nissan Fairlady Z 58 29 laps
19. 7 GT300 Shinichi Yamaji, Hiroyuki Iiri Mazda RX7 52 35 laps
20. 1 GT500 Satoshi Motoyama, Richard Lyons Nissan Fairlady Z 12 75 laps
21. 18 GT500 Ryo Michigami, Sebastien Philippe Honda NSX 12 75 laps
22. 43 GT300 Morio Nitta, Shinichi Takagi ASL Garaiya 9 78 laps

Fab · 19 Dec 2004, 11:00 (Ref:1183074)

Thanks for that Gomick !

I just edited the clownie smilie : it was understandable that your thread was a joke... I supposed you wanted something smiling, so...

**PascaLM** · 19 Dec 2004, 11:21 (Ref:1183092)

The 60 Samurais on the land of the Seven Mercenaries...what a movie !

**skycafe** · 19 Dec 2004, 15:49 (Ref:1183218)

DSC reporting a crowd of 30,000 which seems impressive to me for a first time event, and given how close it is to the holidays.

Any idea on speeds versus anything that may have run at Fontana before? I know bikes have run there, but don't know if same circuit used. Also Historic Sports Racing has been there I believe, so maybe some of the GTP/Group C crowd have set marks?

Also, am I going to get a chance to see any coverage of this race on Speed here in US?

robert

billnchristy · 19 Dec 2004, 16:12 (Ref:1183230)

It was said on the Speed forum that they were 8 seconds faster a lap than the DPs, but I looked at the track layout and its a bit different, so theres really nothing to compare them too...

**skycafe** · 19 Dec 2004, 16:22 (Ref:1183233)

I did understand track layout difference, but nothing else has run same layout they ran?

I would guess they must be faster then a GT1 car, since they are more liberal on everything from suspension to aero, aren't they?

I know very little about JGTC, but they seem close in concept to the old Group 5 type silhouette type cars-Porsche 935, Lancia Beta Monte Carlo, BMW 320iTurbos. Should have been a great show. I have friends that live but 15 minutes away from the track, and if I hadn't had a non adjustable work obligation I could have been there. Groan!

robert

Danske · 19 Dec 2004, 16:25 (Ref:1183234)

Someone has said the JGTC event used the motorbike course at Fontana, so while Grand-Am runs there too they use a different, longer course.

**PascaLM** · 19 Dec 2004, 16:31 (Ref:1183235)

I don't have information about the JGTC technical rules, but it seems to be very liberal, and the cars definitions are far from the production models.
But the several races I saw on TV were lively. Unfortunatly, the rules of FIA-GT and LM series are to much different from the JGTC rules.

JAG · 19 Dec 2004, 17:26 (Ref:1183266)

The JGTC cars tend to be 2-5 seconds a lap quicker than privateer GTS/GT1 cars in Japan, depending on the circuit configeration.

The 5 second time difference may well have been down to car problems for the GT1 cars.

It was hinted on DSC that the new Super GT regs that are being discussed for the JGTC may give less technical freedon and be more inline with FIA/ACO regs.

**skycafe** · 19 Dec 2004, 17:42 (Ref:1183279)

According to DSC, we will see JGTC back on our shores in December 2005 for an All Star event-they also question if it will be back at Fontana or Laguna.

I would think Fontana works with the speed festival component they also have created with car shows, drifting, etc. Sounds like a winner.

TheNewBob · 19 Dec 2004, 21:57 (Ref:1183418)

Would be nice to see a "works" effort from Maserati in JGTC - there they might be allowed to run the car in all it's glory rather than the FIA GT restricted car. Wonder how fast that would be compared to the GT500 cars?

Apart from Nissan 350Z, all the cars there are old machines like Honda NSX and Toyota Supra, yeh? I know next to nothing about their championship, but those cars were at Le Mans about a decade ago, would they be in similar format to what they run in Japan nowadays?

Sure would be nice to see some quick Supra's, NSX's and 350Z's mixing up the order against the cars likely to be competing for Le Mans GT1 and GT2 glory next year.

Anybody know exactly what the differences are between JGTC and FIA/ACO cars?

neilap · 20 Dec 2004, 00:02 (Ref:1183502)

I am amazed that the NSX's did so well. The regs which are made by JAF who by the way consist of Toyota and Nissan have not been in their favor in the past years. The winning Honda was DQed after complaints but still it did well and 3 in the top 8!! Not bad at all. Maybe next year the NSXTT will kick some...

Hopefully next year I will be able to attend

paul-collins · 20 Dec 2004, 15:15 (Ref:1184017)

I know there's talk about Laguna; Laguna can only run 5 major events a year due to local restrictions, and they just turfed Champcars, so who knows? However, SoCal is more natural for the series as it's the epicentre of the American branch offices of the Japanese manufacturers.

They may hit both coasts next year, by the way.

neiltbag · 20 Dec 2004, 23:01 (Ref:1184486)

I was lucky enough to go to this race, and have to say that I haven't seen cars this exciting since the old GT1 days with the McLaren F1, Porsche GT1, Merc CLK-GTR etc. These things are THE business! Hope they come back next year, and I hope it will be a full championship round with a full field. There was certainly a large enough field that it didn't feel small, but hey, I'm greedy.

The track used was the same as the motorcycle track, approx 0.7 mile shorter than the Grand-Am config. The JGTC cars were lapping about 2 seconds faster than the superbikes. At Virginia, the DPs lap 6 seconds faster than the superbikes, so you can guess that DPs are about 3.5-4 seconds faster. But nowhere nearly as COOL....

Finally, 30,000 spectators seems way inflated. I'm guessing 7500-10000 on Saturday. If you roll in Sunday's crowd (I wasn't there so don't know how many came that day) you might get a total of 30k. Having been to some outdoor concerts with 30000 people, I think I know what that looks like, and this certainly wasn't it.

neiltbag · 20 Dec 2004, 23:12 (Ref:1184498)

Also, they're showing the race on Speed Channel in the new year

JAG · 20 Dec 2004, 23:21 (Ref:1184508)

'The track used was the same as the motorcycle track, approx 0.7 mile shorter than the Grand-Am config. The JGTC cars were lapping about 2 seconds faster than the superbikes. At Virginia, the DPs lap 6 seconds faster than the superbikes, so you can guess that DPs are about 3.5-4 seconds faster. But nowhere nearly as COOL....'

The GT500's are thought to be quicker than GTS/GT1 cars, which inturn are as quick, if not quicker than the DP's.

Zero Signal · 20 Dec 2004, 23:46 (Ref:1184525)

Going by the map on the JGTC USA website, they're using a layout similar to the AMA Superbike layout, but not the exact same layout.

JGTC Layout (1/2 way down)
AMA Superbike Layout

The first 180 degree left hander after the chicane that leads into the infield is much further down the track on the JGTC layout as opposed to the Superbike layout. The chicane on the front straight may be different as well, which could greatly affect the lap times, but it's hard to tell without actually seeing it.

The comparison of lap times by using DP's and Superbike's at Virginia is hardly fair at all, as they use completely different layouts. The AMA Superbike's use the North Course, while Grand-Am uses the Full Course.

Here are the pole times from 2004 at the tracks that the AMA Superbikes and Grand-Am both raced at, and obviously used the same layout as well to make the comparisons meaningful.

Barber Motorsports Park
Superbike: 1:25.251
DP: 1:20.613

Daytona
Superbike: 1:46.835
DP: 1:45.783

Mid-Ohio
Superbike: 1:26.375
DP: 1:19.496

neiltbag · 21 Dec 2004, 00:00 (Ref:1184530)

The map on the website is wrong. They DID take the earlier hairpin, like the motorcycles do, but the chicane was much tighter than the bikes use.

nsxr · 22 Dec 2004, 02:10 (Ref:1185546)

I was there. it was great. the best weekend of racing this year. the race result was changed the epson nsx got a time penalty after the race. the win went to the G'Zox Z. the crowd was 45,000 people. with 15,000 on sunday for the D1 GP. A N.A.S.A man told that there thousands more people here for this then the Grand-am. He said there more crew then fans that weekend. the LA times says were more people for GTLive then the IRL race. plus about a downtown street race in 2006. man those cars were amazing to watch. I was feet away from them. I got plenty of autographs. Now I'm off to learn japanese before the next year. A dp cant hold a candle to these cars. the gt300 were seconds faster then this SGS porsche that started the race. A dp would stand no chance against them.

Burd · 24 Dec 2004, 03:53 (Ref:1187220)

Quote:

Originally Posted by nsxr

plus about a downtown street race in 2006. man those cars were amazing to watch.

Hrm. I, for one, would shoot my mother in the foot to be able to see the JGTC machines tackle Long Beach. Call me crazy, but I *love* street races

Hugewally · 24 Dec 2004, 06:31 (Ref:1187254)

I can honestly say I've never seen a larger crowd at Fontana before...

martin

Burd · 24 Dec 2004, 14:11 (Ref:1187462)

I still can't believe they didn't work out any kind of a deal to have the race broadcast, not even on the Speed Channel. That's downright ridiculous. If you didn't live in SoCal or work for the press in some form, it's almost as though the race didn't take place. How can you go through the expense and the massive effort necessary to fly the teams halfway around the world and then not have a TV package of any kind put together?

Then again, I suppose I should first ask the following question... is the JGTC trying to break into the entire U.S. as a new market, or are they strictly interested in only Southern California?

Hugewally · 24 Dec 2004, 14:55 (Ref:1187484)

It will be on TV, just later. Alan de Cadenet was there being filmed...

billnchristy · 24 Dec 2004, 15:20 (Ref:1187506)

I would hope they would get a big crowd, besides Japan, wheres a better market than Cali? Everyone who has ever played Gran Turismo knows JGTC cars and would love to see one firsthand!! That race has the potential to be the most exciting race of the year...

This is the kind of stuff tuner people want to see...it doesnt matter if the cars are hideously disproportioned to their street versions, they are like the steriod pumped big brothers of hot imports and people love them!

Hugewally · 24 Dec 2004, 15:25 (Ref:1187514)

Quote:

Originally Posted by billnchristy

...it doesnt matter if the cars are hideously disproportioned to their street versions...

Except for the air intakes for the NSX's, IMO they're no more out of proportion than any other GT car racing out there... ALMS, GA, DTM, etc...

Martin