Only 4 Teams survived the last decade

[Raglanparade]

I was looking at the 1996 F1 Magazine for the Australian GP and it occured to me that only 4 teams out of 11 in 1996 still exist in Formula 1 as of 2006 (there are 6 teams at the moment).

They are:

Ferrari
McLaren
Williams
Minardi

Whilst the next two are going to be renamed for season 2006.

Sauber > BMW
Jordan > Midland
_______________________________________________________________

During the last decade we have seen all the below exit F1:

Ligier
Forti
Tyrell
Benetton
Stewart
Jaguar
Prost
Lola (Aus GP '97)
Sauber
Jordan
Arrows

Thats 11 Teams exiting F1 - Either exiting all together, or changing hands to another owner (eg. Ligier > Prost , Benetton > Renault).

It doesnt take a genius to work it out. But over the last decade, using the law of averages, we are losing over 1 team a season from the grid. Are we gaining one team a season?? With the exception of Toyota and BAR, there havent been any fully funded serious attempts at entering F1 over the last decade (maybe Stewart could be an exception).

Any thoughts of this ? or is this the natural dying process ?

[Xpunk75]

Its really sad, but alot of F1 fans like my Dad and my Uncle who have been watching since they were young in the 60's I believe or the 70's im not really sure when they started watching F1, but the point is their view is if you can't take the heat stay out of the fire.

My view is that it is really really sad that we have lost all these teams and I don't understand why Eccelstone saved Minardi a few years back and Jordan by giving them money to help them out and he didn't do it for Arrows and Prost. Thats what bug's me. F1 should have helped Arrows one of the oldest teams in F1. Prost had what I thoght a great chance to become a big team but again no one helped them out ether. Both these teams did better job at racing then Minardi and it would have made more sense to save them from folding then Minardi.

[FPV GTHO]

Well from the way youve put it, this year we've got Red Bulland next year we should be getting the Dubai team, so we "might" be seeing a turnaround in fortunes. I dare say though if its ever going to turn around for good, it'll be 2008 when customer chassis are allowed.

[Hazza]

Well bare in mind that, Tyrell > BAR and Stewart > Jaguar > RBR, So I really think of it as loosing
Forti
Prost
Lola (Aus GP '97)
Arrows

And gaining Toyota.

Still, not very good.

[Fiorentina 1]

McLaren, Ferrari, Williams and Minardi were there in 86 as well.

It is sad that we lost Brabham, Lotus, Tyrell, Ligier, & Benetton. Such fixtures in F1 history imo. I know, Benetto turned into Renault and that Renault was a big part of F1 in the late 70's/ early 80's, but it isn't the same.

[Raglanparade]

I find is interesting that Minardi has held on for so long, yet bigger names and squads have fallen by the wayside.

I guess the boys at Minardi live for moments like the 2002 Australian GP. That day is still firmly etched in my mind as Minardis greatest moment in the last 10 years.

[climb]

I've said many times my opinion why Minardi survive despite all: the curren trend (auto corporations taking over independent teams) is bound to make their role more and more necessary.

[Raglanparade]

Id love to see Minardi win a race someday.. And id like them to do it while PS is still the boss.

[Dutton]

Climb, I think you may be alluding to a point of view that I very much hold. Minardi are crucial in their role as the team that "don't mind" being last. Clearly they do not like it as such, but they won't leave the sport over it if you see my meaning. It doesn't matter who or what owns them, just so long as they keep afloat. They help prevent/minmise the risk of manufacturers coming last. This is very important, and Bernie is wise enough to realise it.

With regard the teams that have fallen by the wayside. Really it is only Williams, Mclaren and Ferrari that remain. The others have all changed ownership, which, in my opinion, makes them a different team, regardless of whatever brand is used. It can maintain many of the same structures and employees or whatever, but the team is still different.

IMHO.

[John Turner]

It is disappointing certainly, but is it quite as bad as Jason says given that a number of teams has been renamed. As Hazza has mentioned Tyrell became BAR, Stewart to Jaguar to RBR and didn't Benetton become Renault? In other words the names have changed but not necessarily the teams, so there is some continuity. (Just noted Dutton's comments about old teams becoming new different teams - also valid, and you could argue then that usually there is a new team to replace the old, with fresh blood and ideas - not all bad - I don't think we should get too depressed!). Incidentally, did Logier become the Prost?

It's sad to have lost the great names like Lotus and Brabham as Fiorentina says, although we lost them more than 10 years ago, but I can go back further and mourn the passing of BRM and Vanwall and others. It's all part of the history of F1.

[Rob29]

Its just that the losses have outnumbered the gains for 15 years now. In 1989 there were 20 teams,with 39 cars(one one car team) Toyota is the only new team in the last 10 years and the only one to have paid the current entry fee for a new team-other have bought existing teams.

[BootsOntheSide]

I agree with climb and Dutton about Minardi - they are in it for the love of the sport and the passio of competition, and by finishing last they stop someone who are in it to win (either to promote a car or promote a brand), and saving them considerable public emabrassment. Not only that but they have blooded Webber, Albers and Alonso in recent years, and many more in the past. In fact, out of the current grid only Jenson, Taku and JPM made their debuts in a works team, and JPM came in as F3000, ChampCar and Indy 500 champion. This driver-blooding aspect is something I hope Midland can inherit from Jordan.

[Knowlesy]

Minardi are one of the most vital teams when you look at it.

Tail end charlies maybe, but they keep others afloat!

[N I Tram]

The next time anyone criticises Minardi, just direct them to this thread. Survivors and burden-takers for 20 years, and I applaud them for it.

[robert77]

Not even 100% confident about Williams next year.
I think they won't be many years in going.
They sure ain't competetive at the moment, and it takes a long time to get that competitivness back once you've lost it.

[FPV GTHO]

Originally Posted by moxey77

Not even 100% confident about Williams next year.
I think they won't be many years in going.
They sure ain't competetive at the moment, and it takes a long time to get that competitivness back once you've lost it.

Well i dont think Williams have lost their competitiveness, just their consistency.

Its almost as if when they try and give it all theyve got, they fall flat on their arse, but when they slow down for a minute, realise theyve got a problem and just try and salvage something from a bad situation that they seem to get anywhere.

[BSchneiderFan]

Hard to see Williams getting back anywhere near the sharp end of the grid this year. BMW can't have very much interest in further developing the V10 for a team with whom they're splitting.

[BootsOntheSide]

The question for the sake of this thread is more about how long the Williams name will remain for. Considering Frank and Patrick's ages and the loss of works engines, there are serious question marks in that area.

[climb]

Originally Posted by Dutton

Climb, I think you may be alluding to a point of view that I very much hold. Minardi are crucial in their role as the team that "don't mind" being last. Clearly they do not like it as such, but they won't leave the sport over it if you see my meaning.
IMHO.

Exactly

[Dylanl]

Originally Posted by BootsOntheSide

In fact, out of the current grid only Jenson, Taku and JPM made their debuts in a works team

Actually Taku made his debut in a Jordan in 2002. This was to try and convince Honda to give the works engine deal to Jordan, although they went and gave it to B.A.R instead. In 2002 there were two Honda teams (Jordan and B.A.R), which isn't really a works deal at all.

[BSchneiderFan]

Originally Posted by Dylanl

In 2002 there were two Honda teams (Jordan and B.A.R), which isn't really a works deal at all.

Honda has supplied two teams on a works basis in the past; Williams/Lotus and McLaren/Lotus in the late 1980s, for example.

[Dylanl]

Originally Posted by BSchneiderFan

Honda has supplied two teams on a works basis in the past; Williams/Lotus and McLaren/Lotus in the late 1980s, for example.

Ahh ok, my definition of "works" must be a little mixed up

[Korr]

If you are counting teams that have not changed ownership, only Ferrari, McLaren and Williams are the remaining teams.

[Dutton]

Yup Korr, and that is how I would classify it.

[Snrub]

What's most disturbing is that F1 lost Keith Wiggans' Pacific team.

F1 has become a bigger money sport and big players have taken over. Contrast to a decade ago. Essentially the only really committed manufacturer involvement was from Renault and Ferrari, with the first only supplying engines. Mercedes obviously had some involvement, but it only looked like a step up from buying a Ford.

I don't think many will deeply lement the loss of manufacturer teams in the future. There's something compelling about real teams racing for the sake of racing.