It may not happen..but if it does...

Gt_R · 6 Apr 2004, 08:38 (Ref:931958)

...let's say come Brazil, last race of the WDC, Mclaren finally sorted their problems but the late charge means they are still in 5th of the championship, behind say BAR..but very close with just a couple of points.

Each BAR and Mclaren had 1 car left in the race, fighting for WDC/WCC position. Regulations state that only the last 6 teams are allowed to run a third car in friday practice the following season.

Would Mclaren (or in fact any team in that situation) fight all out for fourth, to get a little bit more $$ (which Mclaren doesn't lack), but forfeit the chance to run the 3rd car in practice, or would Mclaren give up fourth and settle for fifth (not much diff to them), and hope that the friday free practice advantage would help them push for the 2005 championship?

If you are the boss, what would you do?

**Adam43** · 6 Apr 2004, 08:44 (Ref:931964)

It has to be very finely balanced, but if it does happen? Hmmm. Interesting.

It might depend if it was for a win or not.

It is a risky strategy as the rules could well change over the off season!

Although presumably McLaren would have a veto.

Irv the Swerve · 6 Apr 2004, 08:54 (Ref:931973)

If I'm Ron Dennis, coming 5th is more advantageous. The dosh difference between 4th and 5th would want to be seriously substantial in order to make it more attractive than the extra practice sessions.....and I doubt that it is.
So I would order Kimi and David, well Kimi, not to fight the BAR's.

hgmonaro · 6 Apr 2004, 09:15 (Ref:931995)

won't the rules change again between end of season and the new one...

fiona · 6 Apr 2004, 09:20 (Ref:932004)

Quote:

Originally posted by hgmonaro
won't the rules change again between end of season and the new one...

i guess thats a possibility but going on the rules as they stand it would be a very tough decision to be made

and i dont honestly think mclaren would settled for 5th - even though it may be advantageous to get the 3rd car running on the friday ut it may cost them sponsers etc

jetsetter · 6 Apr 2004, 09:50 (Ref:932026)

I would hope that they go for the win regardless of the situation, i can't see how their sponsors would be happy if they held back.

DriverT · 6 Apr 2004, 10:23 (Ref:932050)

Well, they just don't tell the sponsors.

BootsOntheSide · 6 Apr 2004, 10:46 (Ref:932069)

It's a tough decision for a number of reasons. There would be a lot of shame and embarassment for McLaren in only finsihing fourth, but fifth might be even worse - their lowest since the early days of Ron's reign. Conversely, 4th would be a major publicity advantage for BAR, and would really help them attract sponsors - perhaps more so than McLaren having a third car.

Whether running a third car is a big advantage is debatable. Davidson has been quick for BAR, and his efforts in amassing setup data, but their improvement doesn't seem to have gone beyond what they showed in testing.

Kicking-back · 6 Apr 2004, 10:47 (Ref:932072)

McLaren is the only team to have been in the top four every year for the past twenty-three years, so I suspect they'd rather maintain that proud record.

shiny side up! · 6 Apr 2004, 10:59 (Ref:932092)

What if the one Mac left in the race was DC and not Kimi? Would DC not go for all he could, given the fact that Ron is putting him out on his

at the end of the race?

hamsmith · 6 Apr 2004, 20:22 (Ref:932734)

If you were dc and you were ****ed off that ron was putting you out on your a*se than would you put the team fourth to put a stop to the possible advantage of running a third car in fri practice.Especially if dc has signed to another team.

EDIT: Just doing what the autocensor would have done!

**Adam43** · 6 Apr 2004, 20:27 (Ref:932740)

I think DC would be professional about it and not hold grudges. I think he would be honourable and to his credit.

deeks6 · 6 Apr 2004, 21:49 (Ref:932828)

From what I've seen, there's no way known the McLarens will be fighting with the BARs so it is probably a moot point !

Glen · 7 Apr 2004, 09:01 (Ref:933156)

Agree, deeks6 - BAR will be well ahead by then. In fact, at the moment it's hard to say which teams will be second and third... right now I'd bet on Williams second, BAR third, Renault fourth and a big big gap to McLaren.

hamsmith · 7 Apr 2004, 09:03 (Ref:933161)

Quote:

Originally posted by deeks6
From what I've seen, there's no way known the McLarens will be fighting with the BARs so it is probably a moot point !

A bit of a turn aroud isn't it. Last year BAR were fighting for fifth position and McLaren were third. This year BAR have a very good chance to come second and McLaren will be fighting for best of the rest.

**Adam43** · 7 Apr 2004, 12:02 (Ref:933331)

OT, but last years championship positions after 3 rounds:
1. McLaren 39
2. Renault 23
3. Williams 16
3. Ferrari 16
5. Jordan 10
It's too early to tell, but McLaren aren't out of a chance to get third just yet...

Glen · 7 Apr 2004, 12:18 (Ref:933356)

Yes. They made it to third last year. From first.

**Adam43** · 7 Apr 2004, 12:20 (Ref:933363)

I meant more that Ferrari recovered OK and it did change, but good point

I agree it doesn't look good for McLaren, but I'm not writing them off yet (there is always the 17E

).

Kicking-back · 7 Apr 2004, 12:30 (Ref:933383)

They've found some extra pace with suspension tweaks at Barcelona yesterday.

Lets hope Merc/Ilmor can step up to the plate with some power and reliability.

RWC · 10 Apr 2004, 15:29 (Ref:935861)

A facinating question.
I suspect ron would do the pure racer thing and go for 4th in such a situtaion.
Someone like flabio would definitely choose to fall back because he would see the benifit of it and wouldn't give a toss about what anyone thought
Not sure where richards would stand but i suspect he would take 5th.Wasn't he the boss when burns in the world rally champs deliberately went way slow in certain stages to get the best final start position?

Mr V · 11 Apr 2004, 09:38 (Ref:936336)

Quote:

Originally posted by RWC
Wasn't he the boss when burns in the world rally champs deliberately went way slow in certain stages to get the best final start position?

They all do that in WRC, it's called tactics

Panzer · 13 Apr 2004, 14:43 (Ref:938376)

If I were the boss i think I would opt for the third car option. I wouldn't worry about what the public thought about it I would want to give the team every advantage for next season, and surely the extra data gained on a race weekend would help that.

Glen · 13 Apr 2004, 16:14 (Ref:938476)

Quote:

Originally posted by RWC
Not sure where richards would stand but i suspect he would take 5th. Wasn't he the boss when burns in the world rally champs deliberately went way slow in certain stages to get the best final start position?

Isn't that just a question of going as late on the road as possible to get the best surface conditions? Each car removes more and more gravel and the stage gets quicker and quicker. No different to qualifying last.

grumpy1 · 13 Apr 2004, 20:18 (Ref:938725)

Its not as if it would be hard to pull off the ruse.Simply ask Kimi or DC to out brake themselves into a corner and plant it in the sand.Regardless of who is driving with Mac next year both drivers are proffessionals and would do as asked.

The Grumpy1

Kicking-back · 14 Apr 2004, 08:52 (Ref:939154)

I don't think Ron would ask his drivers to deliberately spin themselves out of a Grand Prix.

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